OH HURR DURR, AMERICAN POLICE SO BADDoes this post mean that you agree with the way those officers handled the situation?
LOLOLlLoLOLOLOl EU MASTUR RACE
Does this post mean that you agree with the way those officers handled the situation?
How do they justify this shooting?I know, right? That dude did have two small knives, but he was walking away when they shot him. And he was complying, before the flashbang was thrown, and I'd assume that and the closing of the dog got him disoriented.
Of course it's showcased by RT. Ever seen them show anything bad in Russia? Fucking Kremlin biased news site worse than Fox News.
this video was released by the police department to show that the shooting was "justified."
I'd rather go to Saudi Arabia than to America. Got it!
I'd rather go to Saudi Arabia than to America. Got it!
What the fuck? I got so many questions from this video. For instance, who in the right mind deploys automatic rifles for illegal camping? They say "get on the ground" and then they shoot him when he was clearly trying to comply? Why did they shoot lethal rounds first and why did they shoot the non lethal rounds after? Was that flashbang really necessary? They say "drop the knife" when the guys is half dead on the floor and then shoot him up some more, WTF?
A flashbang, a dog, 3 guys in tactical gear with kevlar vests and automatic rifles? I guess they just saw the homeless guy as an oportunity to test their gear out....
What the fuck AntiBlitz.
So if someone refuses to comply you just shoot him dead? Why not use beanbags and taser first, leaving lethal rounds as the last resort?
Every man is a potential maniac whose dream is to kill or wound cops, with most likely a nuclear warhead in their pocket. It's better to be safe and shoot them first because I don't known what proportional means.
im trying to be a philosophical ass, yet i dont know what im talking about, my day job is sitting in an office, my night job is critiquing cops on youtube videos on a medieval game forum
well if your only going to post half the story then
My theory is that the US is a Fallout-style wasteland populated by psychos.
If it wasn't so, why would law enforcement always act like it is ?
What the fuck? I got so many questions from this video. For instance, who in the right mind deploys automatic rifles for illegal camping? They say "get on the ground" and then they shoot him when he was clearly trying to comply?
lol its a good theory, but really just think about it, you never know what a person is armed with, so you always assume the man is armed. Why put yourself at a disadvantage and at ease by believing he isnt. The one time he does and decides to use it was the moment you werent ready. Its a value that every leo has forced on him throughout his training. I dont think its a stupid value, if anything its those things that may keep you alive. Remember the entire country has access to firearms, so even a child could possess them, your only insurance to yourself is remembering that one simple value, believe everyone is armed until you know otherwise. Thats unfortunately why we always get videos of cops shooting someone reaching into their pockets or lifting a t-shirt up, or something silly, and then we blast the cop because you saw what seemed obvious while what he saw seemed like it may take his life. Of course in this instance its hard to believe this, as it just looks cold, and i am right with you if you believe that, it really does look like murder, or rather misuse of force, its all perception.(murder seems like too strong a word)
well if you're only going to post half the story then of course you will have two pages of uninformed people saying "how dare they" or "why no use non lethal".What? I posted everything that is relevant. The only thing that would've changed anything is if that guy had a suicide vest and the trigger to it was behind his back on the ground.
1) This event had been going on for around like 4 hoursDamn, the cops hadn't had their doughnuts for 4 hours. Nevermind then, just shoot the guy dead.
2) The original call was dispatched to local law enforcement, whom responded, and then called for a crisis team because the man had clear issues and refused to respond while holding 2 knivesGasp! Better shoot the guy, he had two butter knives!
3) They talked to him, he refused to comply, they threw a flashbang and told him to comply, he refused, they sent a dog on him, he brandishes two knives and attempts to get the dog off him while wielding two knives then turns away to do who knows what, maybe get another weapon from his gear, maybe get a gun from his waist band, you really dont know till after the fact, and then at that point its okay for everyone to monday morning quarterback you.He was complying before they threw the flash bang, as is evident on the video. The dog never attacked the man, nor was it in range of his knives at any point. Are you legally blind? That's about the only excuse for the crap you're spouting. He was complying - they throw a flash bang and bring the dog closer - he waves his arms - he turns around to walk away - they shoot him dead.
4)while lying on the ground, he still refuses to drop the damn knives, yet says he cant move, but can move his legs and talk just fine. They shoot beanbags at him, he still refuses to comply, they send the dog for assurance, then move to arrest him. You really can never be to safe, who is to say when they approach he doesnt lunge out and stab someone, why take that chance?Legally deaf too, I see.
We're back to the gun debate then. But to me there's a problem with the relation between the police and the citizens. As a police officer, you are protecting other people, not yourself. I don't see this here.
What? I posted everything that is relevant. The only thing that would've changed anything is if that guy had a suicide vest and the trigger to it was behind his back on the ground.
Damn, the cops hadn't had their doughnuts for 4 hours. Nevermind then, just shoot the guy dead.
Gasp! Better shoot the guy, he had two butter knives!
He was complying before they threw the flash bang, as is evident on the video. The dog never attacked the man, nor was it in range of his knives at any point. Are you legally blind? That's about the only excuse for the crap you're spouting. He was complying - they throw a flash bang and bring the dog closer - he waves his arms - he turns around to walk away - they shoot him dead.
"Monday morning quarterback", that's fucking rich. Maybe we shouldn't "Monday morning quarterback" school shootings either. The school shooter might've had a bad day, and hey, who knows, maybe he thought the kids had automatic weapons? Fuck, for all he knows, maybe the kids were "maybe reaching for weapons from their waistband."
Legally deaf too, I see.
For anyone interested, here is a good thread about it. Most of the posters have actually seen a lot of combat, and also has a lot of cops with Good Sense posting (as opposed to retards like AntiBlitz).
http://socnet.com/showthread.php?t=119726
And as you can see it's not most Americans who are like this, in fact, most of them are against the militarization of America's LE.
Hahah, "the militarization has always been there." God, so many things wrong with that sentence. First, a "militarization" can't always have "been there." Because this is not how English works. Second, AntiBlitz is, supposedly, LE himself, yet he's completely unaware of how the militarization has happened? MRAPs and cops with suppressed M4s in camos haven't "always been there", nor have all the other hi-tech shit the current LE cowards need to get within 100 feet of a drunk. And they won't get closer, of course, before they've shot the drunk a few times. He might reach for something.
yes, the government began selling surplus M16's to civilians and law enforcement some time after vietnam and up until now, though i guess that wasnt much of a problem back then. You're talking out of your ass, as if you know. How are suppressors a military only accessory, anyone can own a suppressor, given they have the correct stamps, and the state law doesnt forbid it. Painting a weapon with a can of spray paint doesnt increase its potency......Your reading comprehension is awful. I never claimed any of those things were a "military only accessory." You don't even know what militarization means, evidently.
Law enforcement have had firearms that only the military have had access to for decades, all the way back and before weapons like the Thompson. Though this weapon could be purchased by civilians for a costly price. So yes, its always been there, however small, its always been there. Just because they have come up to modern times with their equipment we must all of a sudden chastise the guys? okay........
Your reading comprehension is awful. I never claimed any of those things were a "military only accessory." You don't even know what militarization means, evidently.
Here, maybe you'll learn a thing or two (but probably not): http://socnet.com/showthread.php?t=116574
My theory is that the US is a Fallout-style wasteland populated by psychos.
If it wasn't so, why would law enforcement always act like it is ?
I'm glad people are playing the jump to conclusions game already. I guess it's worth mentioning that James Boyd had a history of attacking people with knives, box cutters, and even broke a female officer's nose in 2010. They flash banged him, shot him with bean bags, yet he still didn't comply and refused to go down.
Actually, yeah, they did shoot him with bean bags first. They also attempted to use a flashbang on him as well as a trained police dog.Actually, no, they did not shoot him with bean bags first. Yes, they used a flash bang after he was starting to do as told. And they did put a trained (does this detail add something?) police dog near him.
I'm sure the Government is backing these shootings 100%, Obama probably gave the order to shoot the guy.
Well, looks like I was right, this thread is nothing more than EU circlejerk "lol lets make fun of Murica"It's not about America, it's about law enforcement of America.
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Well, looks like I was right, this thread is nothing more than EU circlejerk "lol lets make fun of Murica"And rightfully so. This man would have been alive now if this would have been Dutch law enforcement, same goes for probably any other well developed country with a strong rule of law. Truth simply is, law enforcement in America is extremely messed up. Now don't get me wrong, incidents happen everywhere, but the fact that this video is used as a means to justify the behaviour of these cops, is just laughably fucked up. Can't believe this isn't in any way worrisome to you as a citizen of that country.
And rightfully so. This man would have been alive now if this would have been Dutch law enforcement, same goes for probably any other well developed country with a strong rule of law. Truth simply is, law enforcement in America is extremely messed up. Now don't get me wrong, incidents happen everywhere, but the fact that this video is used as a means to justify the behaviour of these cops, is just laughably fucked up. Can't believe this isn't in any way worrisome to you as a citizen of that country.It isn't any less worrisome to him, most likely, if he really thought about it. He's defending it because he sees it as a "us vs them" setting. He has to stand up for his team. His team being America, and the opposite team being evil Europeans.
This is how the German police handles knife guys:Is... is that chainmail? :o(click to show/hide)
Kinda removes the need to pump a stabbist full of projectiles before getting near him. Too fun-hating for the US though.
Well, looks like I was right, this thread is nothing more than EU circlejerk "lol lets make fun of Murica"
Is... is that chainmail? :o
It all stems from "dont put yourself in a dangerous situation if you can avoid it, if you cant, protect your life at all cost" police mantra, which is sometimes applied liberally. Still, policemen need to be protected from criminals too.
The barrier is thin between protecting oneself and overreacting to the cost of someone else life. Thus we argue about whether or not it was legitimate to use deadly force.
The barrier is thin between protecting oneself and overreacting to the cost of someone else life.
Why are you under the impression that the law enforcement ALWAYS acts like this? Have you ever been to the U.S? You can't believe everything RT tells you.
I should say that I'm not trying to justify the actions made by these officers, just giving some background information that RT seems to have left out.
My sister was put in jail for a few days because of a DUI. As far as I know she was not shot and killed by a police officer so uuhhh how is this supposed to worry me as an American that 4 wackos killed a guy out of all the law enforcement agents we have? Every country has em right, and don't go off and say "yeh but murica haz way moar wackos" no it's because we're less strict so people can actually post or film these type of things without much back lash.
Yeah just another lol troll thread, not like it matters though this is the interwebz where we can act like we know how to handle political matters or ones pertaining to the law.
I'm sure if these cops would play in crpg they'd be my old friendchers :P
police is called to resolve a case. They have the duty not to back off and leave the emotionaly disturbed person to wander around and potentially wound/kill himself
(suspect has record of violence and the police confrontation was actually hours-long (video doesnt show the full background)), I believe they didnt pop the poor guy just because he was camping.
Good thrower... come on, dude's a fucking hobo. Those policemen in Miami had regular gear yet had no problem to put down that cannibal dude who was eating hobo's face...
This happened in New Mexico and I bet these clowns were given these rifles and wests to deal with members of drug cartel... not homeless old dudes.
It looks so bad, but it must not be that bad when its been okayed by the court, and hasnt really hit the news in the U.S(only a few small sites and things, one day of coverage was about it).
After reading more, I must say, you EU's really do want to ignore facts to suit your view and belief in this situation.
Totally meaningless, he wasn't a threat for anyone, so there was no need to use such unproportional means.
You're fucked up dude, you know that. I nowhere said this is about USA, just said that policemen in question are idiots. And idiots don't live just in USA:
Not one EU person in this thread has said anything except "STUPID COPS DIE," "AMERICA BAD," and other gross over exaggerations. I'm quite critical of cops, I do(did?) live in my state's "Murder Capital" and "Highest Police Shootings."
Even the shoot was fucked up, the guy with the helmet cam should not have shot from that angle even if he was against a real bad guy.Why? Was he too close to another officer or something?
So... you are defending something you are "quite critical of", but we are not allowed to talk about it because we are smelly europeans ?
Next time we have football riots killing dozens I'll be sure to react the exact same way. Because how dare you criticize things that don't work properly in my country ?
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It looks so bad, but it must not be that bad when its been okayed by the court, and hasnt really hit the news in the U.S(only a few small sites and things, one day of coverage was about it).
That's even more scary cause it shows there's some kind of approval for such actions. When few years ago police in my country by mistake shot to death wrong guy (policemen were looking for some criminals, blocked the road, wrong guy didn't stop the car, they shot him down) it was top news in media for a few months and these policemen will end up in prison. You can read about it here: http://www.sn.pl/aktualnosci/SiteAssets/Lists/Komunikaty_o_sprawach/EditForm/V-KK-0099_12.pdf :lol: :lol:
There is something seriously, SERIOUSLY wrong with this statement.
Distrust everyone, use guns for "protection", assume everyone is armed. Blindly trust the courts and the media, but for the love of god don't see what's right in front of you.
That's even more scary cause it shows there's some kind of approval for such actions.
NOt an article, it's a verdict of polish supreme court, the case is not finished, but court pointed out that all measures taken by police have to be minimized and without serious threat to human life or property deadly force can not be used if there're other options.
He was an apparent homeless man(more than likely mentally ill) brandishing knives at police officers. I think they acted in accordance. You don't pull out a weapon when you are approached by police officers.
Its sad if he was mentally ill and didn't know better. But hey, in they end they made a judgement call.
He was an apparent homeless man(more than likely mentally ill) brandishing knives at police officers. I think they acted in accordance. You don't pull out a weapon when you are approached by police officers.Yeah, if you don't comply with the law enforcement, it's OK to just kill you.
Its sad if he was mentally ill and didn't know better. But hey, in they end they made a judgement call.
Why? Was he too close to another officer or something?
In this case, complying meant putting down a weapon.He was putting his shit down when they threw a flashbang and closed in.
Are you allowed to just resist an arrest or something in Europe?
He was an apparent homeless man(more than likely mentally ill) brandishing knives at police officers. I think they acted in accordance. You don't pull out a weapon when you are approached by police officers.
I won't argue whether or not the use of lethal ammunition was justified, but this was a suspect with a long history of violence towards police.Did you watch the video...? It's like some people in this thread rather believe some written word over seeing with their own eyes.
This ordeal had been going on for awhile when Boyd outright refused to cooperate by picking up his things and starting to turn.
He was then flashed, hit with beanbags (reportedly) and shot with a taser (reportedly).
To be totally fair, the officers were off camera when the flashbang hit, so who knows if they fired or not.
The only reason Boyd was shot was because he pulled two knives on the K9 officer who was unarmed and working with the dog.
Boyd was reportedly within eight feet of the K9 officer when deadly force was used by the APD officer wearing the helmet cam.
Eight feet is damn close. One step and a good stab would place a knife in the chest of the K9 officer... To be fair.
Perhaps it wasn't handled as well as it could have been. Perhaps the officer who used lethal force acted too quickly.
What's unfortunate is that this could happen to any well-meaning officer.
It's important to remember that the K9 officer could have also ended up dead too. We just don't know.
That's not to say we should excuse the officer in question of this shooting, but it is something to strongly consider.
We don't know what the intentions were of either the two men.
If anything, it's a cry for a better healthcare system in the US- one that can help the poor or homeless who are mentally ill.
These people often suffer the most from mental illness and any humanitarian society should be concerned for their well-being.
Why do you need to read about how far the K9 officer was from him? You can see it on the video. And they used bean bags after he was shot with lethal rounds, as is shown... on the video.
I can't stop thinking that you're living in a freaking war zone over there.
It's only because they set off the grenade did he freak out and pull a knife.
Our entire country of 313.9 million people is saturated with fire-arms and if we were to be invaded by a foreign aggressor think of how well that would go.This is just hilarious.
Also if he was a known threat to society why he isn't behind bars or at least in mental institution? Something in not right in Albuquerque.
This is just hilarious.
I am still baffled that supposedly trained officers can't handle a guy with tiny knives. Granted, it might not have been visually obvious to them how big those knives were but god damn it, those were professionals! Several of them! With a fucking dog! Versus a single fat man!The worst part of this absurdity is that these people were the fucking SWAT team. They're the supposed bad asses who the normal cops call when they can't handle shit. A little girl would do their job better. Not only are they cowards, they are incompetent cowards, as is evident from the helmet-camera guy firing and their subsequent shouting and setting-the-dog-on-the-guy etc etc.
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Do I at all approve of what the cops did here? Hell no.
Do I think they should lose their jobs, be investigated, have charges pressed, etc? Yes.
Do I think you are all judging them slightly too harshly? Yes.
You have to realize, no matter how much training someone goes through, and no matter what nationality someone is, all people have the same fundamental instincts: staying alive being the top priority. Also, most people (hopefully all of you reading this) would argue that protecting those you care about should be right up there with it. In this situation, the K9 unit was close to a "dangerous" (due to his previous history) person, and his squadmates felt obliged to cover him. They approached the entire situation poorly, and did many things wrong, in my opinion, but that doesn't change the fact that when you are put out in these kind of tense situations, where your target could have a butter knife, a real knife, a pistol, hell, maybe even a fully automatic assault weapon in his bag (however unlikely that may be) you are going to assume the worst. You want to be prepared for the worst, and cops/military to are trained to do so. Heck, it is simply common sense to do so.
Do I think that the cops should have flash banged and sent a dog at this guy? No. But I will stand by their decision to act in a manner of self defense after the guy disobeyed orders and drew knives on them. They had a co-worker, a friend, within striking distance of a presumably mentally ill guy armed with knives. Just because the cops had 3 guns v 1 guy with knives doesn't simply mean they are guaranteed to be safe. They guy (especially if mentally unstable) could very well lunge at one of them and severely injure him before being gunned down. A lot of you feel that 'the odds were against the guy, he didn't stand a chance and couldn't harm any of them.' And well, that's simply bullshit. All it takes is fists to injure someone. And this guy had two knives. Would a sane man charge 3 cops armed with fucking assault rifles with only knives? No. But from what we know, this guy most likely wasn't entirely sane. And don't go saying he only had butter knives... how could you tell? When the camera got up real close and gave you a good look at them? Even then I wouldn't pass them off as butter knives... you can't tell how sharp a knife is until you have handled it. Sure when up close you can get a general idea, but from over 3 meters away? Hell no. A knife is a knife, its a weapon.
Basically, screw these cops, they are trigger-happy assholes, but still, in the end their ultimate decision was one based on instinct, and I would support them in that. However I would first prosecute them for the 1000 other utterly disgusting and dumbass shit they pulled beforehand, which ultimately led to the final decision.
And let's not forget that they weren't in any actual danger. If he had moved towards them? Sure. But he was moving away.
"They weren't in any danger." Yeah, okay. Next time you see a guy pull out two knives right next to you, lets see you just nonchalantly walk on past, not giving it a second thought. The time it takes someone to close the gap between you two is less than a second. Now, was the guy moving towards them during the video? No. Could he, at any moment, have decided to charge? Yes. Hence, they were in danger once he brought out his knives. I already said, all the shit they pulled before that moment is pretty retarded, but the fact is, they were in danger once he pulled out weapons on them, well within lunging range.Yep, why would I not be nonchalant if someone pulls out two knives and walks in the opposite direction? I might follow him if I thought he was going to attack someone randomly, but I certainly wouldn't shoot him in the back for being a threat to me. It'd have taken that guy far more than a second to close the distance between himself and the cops. The terrain was uneven and the knife dude was fat and clearly not in good control of his body.
Yes, lets just get rid of everything in the Bill of Rights, it all sucks anyway.
I thought you were a brutally efficient logic machine xant, I am le disapoint :PShow me where my logic has failed.
I completely agree, only dumb cowboy rednecks wouldn't want all the guns in the hands of criminals and the government.
Well, it is pretty telling that pretty much all the mass shooting in U.S have happened in so-called Gun Free Zones...
Well, it is pretty telling that pretty much all the mass shooting in U.S have happened in so-called Gun Free Zones...
..Probably in one of the many "US weapon laws suck"-threads we have around here :D
Well, it is pretty telling that pretty much all the mass shooting in U.S have happened in so-called Gun Free Zones...
two guys with guns in a crowd is probably worse than one guy with guns in a crowd, or in a school.
It's sad you MUST have armed officers on the streets but yes I guess in US (and other parts of the world) you do. But that's another topic altoghetherYup, I think a 50% or so reduction in police officers with stricter standards and better pay would be good.
The problem are the officers themselves and recruitment policy, imo it needs to be way more strict than it currently is not in US only but everywhere especially in my corrupt little country where police officers are mostly scum and are not here to serve and protect but to opress and take advantage the badge provides (ease of getting and dealing drugs, prostitution, extortion) not to mention they are not respected a bit in the community. Never had a cop help me, probably never will...
Without making any judgement myself here it seems that there is a big difference in mentalities between EU and NA. Many Americans are still stuck in the wild west "hang-the-horse-thief" mindset and are even proud of that. A criminal forfeits his life once he breaks the law - no matter the circumstances. A naked knife-wielding schizophreniac yelling on the street is gunned down there. In Germany they'd send in a maille-clad police thug armed with a baton to do the job. Proportionality has a higher importance over here. Also paper work for fired rounds is a bitch and a good beating once in a while is fun when not on the receiving end.
NAs are natural born ranged f4gs
It's sad you MUST have armed officers on the streets but yes I guess in US (and other parts of the world) you do. But that's another topic altoghether
The problem are the officers themselves and recruitment policy, imo it needs to be way more strict than it currently is not in US only but everywhere especially in my corrupt little country where police officers are mostly scum and are not here to serve and protect but to opress and take advantage the badge provides (ease of getting and dealing drugs, prostitution, extortion) not to mention they are not respected a bit in the community. Never had a cop help me, probably never will...
This post reminded, me I forgot to mention if you score too high on the IQ test, you will fail the police recruitment exam. They don't want people who are able to make informed and moral decisions. They want blind obedient drones who will follow orders without asking questions or rocking the boat. Add this to the previous statements I made about people who seek positions of authority (i.e. law enforcement) and the relatively low pay that they make, and it's really no surprise our law enforcement officers are a lot of the time, scraping the bottom of the talent pool/humanity barrel.
The part in bold is actually not at all that true. Police officers (rightly so, in my opinion at least) get great benefits. Say what you want about them, fact is they DO put their lives on the line mostly every day (depending on their exact job, location, etc. No small town traffic cop should get the same benefits as a swat guy from NYC. Perhaps they don't, but they probably would get comparable benefits if they are in the same area). Not only do they get great benefits while working, they get them for life... these guys are typically treated like war veterans half the time.don talk bout my roh dyelan like this
When I was briefly in RI I learned two things really fast: 1) The state is corrupt as shit and 2) there are infinite numbers of police officers on every single block. I'll skip over the first part since it isn't entirely relevant to this conversation, but the reason for there being so many cops is that in RI when you retire as a cop you continue to make 90-95% of your salary. That's right, you might have a pitiful income while you work... but then you still make that pitiful income all while sipping pina coladas on the beach, without a care in the world. Since the coppers of RI get such a great deal, everyone wants to be a cop, and for some reason pretty much everyone (uneducated, mindless drones included) actually get accepted to be cops. If cops actually had shit wages and shit benefits, then perhaps only the men who are actually dedicated to protecting their town would be wearing the badge, but unfortunately it is not so, and any guy who flunked out of college can decide to be a cop nowadays.
Fire burns. Don't fuck with it. And don't complain when your dick is burned off because you whipped it out to piss on the fire. Responsibility for this incident falls on both parties.
Many Americans are still stuck in the wild west "hang-the-horse-thief" mindset and are even proud of that. A criminal forfeits his life once he breaks the law - no matter the circumstances.
Fire burns. Don't fuck with it. And don't complain when your dick is burned off because you whipped it out to piss on the fire. Responsibility for this incident falls on both parties.
Most American citizens do not have that mentality.I disagree, everytime there is a thread about police violence there are usually a few Americans displaying exactly that mentality, including this thread, Rumblood's response for example. This mentality still seems very present throughout American society. It's a mentality that I and many Europeans with me have trouble understanding, violence should always heed proportionality and human life should be valued higher than property.
That guy was mentally ill. Obviously he acted stupid as fuck. Doesn't mean he should be killed for it...
You're not suggesting what I think you're suggesting... are you?"Super tough spot." That situation might have been super tough for a couple of grade school girls, but police officers equipped like that? Nope.
No one in this thread wanted to see the guy shot, and no American police officer or citizen would think differently. unless they're a psychopath and I assure you there's very, very, very, very few of them
Unfortunately, when you threaten someone's life, you put that person in a tough situation where the blink of an eye could be the end of you.
It's sad, but welcome to reality; mental illness isn't an excuse in this case.
That's what I think is so fucking awful about this situation- the guy wasn't thinking clearly, and he put the police in a super tough spot.
I'll basically quote myself and say again that this video should be a cry for an improved healthcare system in the US.
Maybe with help Boyd could have avoided this fiasco and lived on.
mental illness isn't an excuse in this case.
I disagree, everytime there is a thread about police violence there are usually a few Americans displaying exactly that mentality, including this thread, Rumblood's response for example. This mentality still seems very present throughout American society. It's a mentality that I and many Europeans with me have trouble understanding, violence should always heed proportionality and human life should be valued higher than property.
That's what I think is so fucking awful about this situation- the guy wasn't thinking clearly, and he put the police in a super tough spot.
"Super tough spot." That situation might have been super tough for a couple of grade school girls, but police officers equipped like that? Nope.
Rational, non-emotional, thoughtful argument.Yup, it was. And it's been backed up more than your "wow, what a tough spot" argument.
mfw
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I know from experience that most bouncers go into "breaking-bones mode" when knives get involved, no matter the mental condition.
Those bones normally heal tho :D
It is ridiculous in this instance that they gunned down someone who was turning to run away from them. That is unacceptable. However it is also unacceptable to wave around a weapon near police, and not follow their commands. You are quite literally risking your life if you do that. I don't expect the police officers to put their lives on the line trying to apprehend an unstable person with a knife who has had multiple chances to comply with their commands. But there are better ways to disarm the suspect without going trigger happy and saying "BOOYAH" when you shoot a guy in the back in cold blood.
Every kid in America is taught you obey the police officers, and never brandish a weapon (or even a look-alike) weapon in front of a cop, or you could very well get shot. I don't expect a police officer to try and determine if the gun you are holding is real or fake, if you raise it up they are going to defend themselves. It's not the movies, people don't hold guns pointed at each other and scream "Drop it", if you raise a weapon towards a police officer, they will take action to make sure they go home to their kids at the end of the day.
he is partly to blame for not de-escalating the situation when he had many chances to do so. The police are tasked with enforcing the laws of the country, you, as a citizen, don't get to decide if you want to comply with the cops or not, that is not one of your options.
that is just common sense
If stabbing/shooting inside a nightclub didnt kill the business, they would go "kill-you mode". Some nightclubs do, but then only criminals ever goes in, or unsuspecting people.I'd expect most European countries have similar laws which apply for bouncers. That means, there is no "kill"-mode cuz you're going to jail in any circumstance imaginable. Those "criminal clubs" you're mentioning usually don't have "random" bouncers but people from within their ranks. They don't count as bouncers in my book.
Not all bones heal, and being a bouncer is shit when you are in a honourable business and you have to deal with dangerous people, for the same reason than policemen... Except that its even shittier since you're only a citizen in a fucked up job.
The police isn't - or at least shouldn't be - allowed to shoot someone just because he doesn't do what he's told to do.
Looks like we have different views on common sense.
Knives are messy. They are ugly and they are more dangerous than most people think but they are nothing you can't handle with a proper training. I'd expect every bouncer to have the proper training when working a club. Those who don't are stupid.Bouncers are expected to deal with knife armed people while being unarmed? Sounds incredibly stupid and saying 'nothing you can't handle' seems to greatly overestimate anyone's ability to fight unarmed versus a knife.
Bouncers are expected to deal with knife armed people while being unarmed? Sounds incredibly stupid and saying 'nothing you can't handle' seems to greatly overestimate anyone's ability to fight unarmed versus a knife.
We are talking about stupid angry drunk people with knives, not ninjas.And we are talking about bouncers who got a few hours of 'knife defense' training, not ninjas. Stupid angry drunk with a knife versus a bouncer equipped with 'knife defense', I wouldn't bet my life on the bouncer. He shouldn't bet his life either.
Bouncers are expected to deal with knife armed people while being unarmed? Sounds incredibly stupid and saying 'nothing you can't handle' seems to greatly overestimate anyone's ability to fight unarmed versus a knife.99% of those are drunk people who show the knife before making an uncoordinated haymaker-knife attack, or use it just to threaten. Very different from a pro who walks by and then stabs you 10 times in the neck before you notice what's happening.
Bouncers are expected to deal with knife armed people while being unarmed? Sounds incredibly stupid and saying 'nothing you can't handle' seems to greatly overestimate anyone's ability to fight unarmed versus a knife.
We are talking about stupid angry drunk people with knives, not ninjas.This. Should have pointed that out. My bad.
And we are talking about bouncers who got a few hours of 'knife defense' training, not ninjas. Stupid angry drunk with a knife versus a bouncer equipped with 'knife defense', I wouldn't bet my life on the bouncer. He shouldn't bet his life either.And as I pointed out, I would expect every bouncer to have proper training and that means way more than just a few hours of knife-counters. I know very few who carry a telescope bat for those purposes but they aren't legal. And pepper spray is problematic cuz that stuff tends to get to you as well and not just the guy it's aimed at. I never carried that stuff, seemed to dangerous to get caught in it myself.
Good luck evading the most uncoordinated knife lunge and subsequent strikes, except if he's so drunk he misses you or does it in slow-mo or both. You're going to get cut 100% chance. Of course if you manage to make him run away after he pulls out his metal dick, you win, but if his intent is to strike you you better run the hell out of doge if you're not ready to take major damage to your own life. The same for those armed policemen.
"Knife defense training" doesnt teach to evade cuts, and drills wont save you. The 2 first things you learn if you're into a no bullshit school. Hollywood and piss poor teachers are killing more people than you can count, and this thread is a proof.
Old man? The guy was 38 years old.
just remember, god loves yers and he wants yers.
idk how old this thread is but it's nice to see an ignorant EU base one situation and call it "Law Enforcement in America". EU and NA are both shit holes and i find it hilarious how nerds who haven't explored past a one mile radius around their comp act like they know shit. Suck an Obama nut and move on 8-)There are news like this constantly in the U.S. Very, very rare in Europe.
I don't know what sort of impression you get of the U.S. but being poor is against the law here.Occasionally it backfires. See Rambo 1 for proof.
idk how old this thread is but it's nice to see an ignorant EU base one situation and call it "Law Enforcement in America". EU and NA are both shit holes and i find it hilarious how nerds who haven't explored past a one mile radius around their comp act like they know shit. Suck an Obama nut and move on 8-)
The police are tasked with enforcing the laws of the country, you, as a citizen, don't get to decide if you want to comply with the cops or not, that is not one of your options.
A weapon doesn't make a harmless person dangerous. People are dangerous, not weapons.
99% of those are drunk people who show the knife before making an uncoordinated haymaker-knife attack, or use it just to threaten. Very different from a pro who walks by and then stabs you 10 times in the neck before you notice what's happening.
A weapon doesn't make a harmless person dangerous. People are dangerous, not weapons.
Most bouncers nowadays would use OC, though.
How someone who is not a worthless paranoid pussy handles a "dangerous" knife wielder:He trained something. The trip could be school yard experience, though it looks practised, but the 2nd one, when the dude got up again, is not a standard use of kinetics :)
http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhh4OwNWPe6499J5j0
Wow, he didn't even need body armor or years of training or 5 other guys on his side or a fucking attack dog, and most weird of all, he didn't even shoot him!!11!!. Truly he is a superman and expecting police literally trained to handle situations like these to not kill outright is obviously way too much to ask.
Many bouncers and civilians would indeed use guns if they had the right to do that against people with knives. Yet they don't. For a reason. And still they manage. Why should the police be allowed to... [...]
Their job description is not "just stay safe, no matter how many civilians you have to kill." No, they're "protecting" and "serving."
You stopped short of the reason, elaborate a bit more and you will find the answer.There is no reason for it.
"To protect and to serve" also include shooting down clueless dangerous armed people. If still alive, put in jail; if dead, case closed.Nope.
civilians would indeed use guns if they had the right to do that against people with knives. Yet they don't. For a reason. And still they manage. Why should the police be allowed to shoot people dead if other people aren't allowed to do that (and still manage)?
If a jurisdiction or a country has removed your right to defend your life or the lives of your family if and when you are faced with the gravest extreme, then they have taken away one of your most basic civil rights.
There's a difference between self defence against someone who's directly attacking you and shooting at guy standing 10 m away from you and doing nothing.
Absolutely correct. I was responding to the statement that civilians do not have the right to use a gun to defend themselves from a knife attack. That's why in your example the first case is self defense and the second case is murder or manslaughter.
Quite obviously a person 10 meters away, doing nothing, does not put you in imminent danger of death or grievous harm.
I don't know where you are from but in my country, if a reasonable person (legal concept) has a reasonable expectation (another legal term) that he facing the threat of death or grievous bodily harm, then lethal force is permitted in self defense. It has been established that a person with a knife can cover 21 feet and stab another person before that second person can draw a holstered pistol and fire. A knife is a lethal weapon that can cause death in an instant. Any civilian threatened with a knife and in close proximity to a knife wielder most certainly has the right to self defense up to and including the use of lethal force with a gun. That's how it should be. His actions will be scrutinized to the nth degree by the police and prosecutor and during a jury trial if he is charged with murder.Finland. Pretty sure the laws are more or less the same in all of Europe. While in theory you may be allowed to shoot someone with a knife (if you somehow get your hands on a gun -- unlikely), in practice it can be very different. Self-defense laws at least here are pretty fucked up. Or well, not the laws, but how they're handled in court - a lot of the time the "bad guy" sues the defender and wins, even if he's got nothing but a bruise. Witnesses, how much people in the court like the accuser and accusee, what was said in the police investigation, and perhaps most importantly, what the doctor said ("the description of the event matches the injuries" = conviction), etc.
If a jurisdiction or a country has removed your right to defend your life or the lives of your family if and when you are faced with the gravest extreme, then they have taken away one of your most basic civil rights.
Finland. Pretty sure the laws are more or less the same in all of Europe. While in theory you may be allowed to shoot someone with a knife (if you somehow get your hands on a gun -- unlikely), in practice it can be very different. Self-defense laws at least here are pretty fucked up. Or well, not the laws, but how they're handled in court - a lot of the time the "bad guy" sues the defender and wins, even if he's got nothing but a bruise. Witnesses, how much people in the court like the accuser and accusee, what was said in the police investigation, and perhaps most importantly, what the doctor said ("the description of the event matches the injuries" = conviction), etc.
If you killed a knife-wielding dude, 99.9% of the time you'd be the bad guy. Where do you live? If not in the US, I can almost guarantee it's the same in your country.
Theory and praxis, I guess.
There's also the fact that if you hold someone at gunpoint he can travel an average of zero meters before you can react and shoot. Hence why neither persons in the videos posed a threat warranting the use of deadly force.
Absolutely correct. I was responding to the statement that civilians do not have the right to use a gun to defend themselves from a knife attack. That's why in your example the first case is self defense and the second case is murder or manslaughter.
Held at gunpoint and trigger ready is still about a few meters before actually being able to react to the threat.
The question relative to the topic would be, why try to pull the same kind of bs on police? Stop trying to put them in jail each time they fire their gun.
wat
Because it's obviously not the same thing. The cases here are not representative of "each time they fire their gun". Hopefully, anyway.
Now try doing that in an intense situation while someone is charging at you with a knife (also knives can be thrown).
I will rephrase : even down the sight and fingers on the trigger, if you wait for the guy to move before shooting, your whole body totally relaxed and focused on doing that perfect non-lethal leg shot combo break 360° no scope, it will still translate into the guy being able to move a few meters before you are able to touch the trigger in reaction, and then you still have to actually hit the target, and hit him bad enough to drop him before he slits your throat.Have you actually trained this? It sounds like you haven't.
Eric Holder wants gun owners to wear ‘smart gun’ bracelets (http://dailycaller.com/2014/04/07/eric-holder-wants-gun-owners-to-wear-tracking-bracelets)
Common sense has nothing to do with gun control.
The gun owner has committed no crime by exercising his natural right to be armed.
Actually NO! only a deep desire to Destroy the Constitution and the Rule of Law
and WHAT ARE YOU?////////// I am an American .. and WHAT ARE YOU????? I did not vote for the Current FASCIST REGIME. AND WHO DID YOU VOTE FOR???????///// I served in the US MIlitary and YOU???????????????/// I SWORE allegiance and to DEFEND the Constitution.. and YOU???????.
Brand 'em right in the middle of the forehead. ANy illegal found in this country with evidence of surgery to remove the brand is subject to summary execution. If they want to live here, do so legally.
The summary execution is a little harsh, but you have the right idea. We need to do the same thing to people who cheat at the polls.
I've often thought that these illegals need to be microchipped like they do dogs so once they are deported and try to come back, they will set off alarms.
Those, this idiot would rather arm. The entire government these days is about doing the opposite of what the Constitution says, and what common sense dictates.
Obama didn't get the Lar-of-the-Year award for having honor....and holder is just a whiney racist...those mean white people.
The ONLY of gun control to which I subscribe is this: I keep a firm and steady hand on my gun.
Gun control should involve four things: a two handed grip, frontsight, frontsight, and squeeze.
Don't forget: hit what you aim at.
leaving only one witness, that is you!
Ever compare how many black children are killed compared to white? I haven't because I don't care but really can't understand when I see blacks in the projects say I knew He was going to be killed....why they don't get off the couch & raise their children instead of jerking them up!
Christians and Jews, lets face it this admin is for Muslims and atheists, Exclusively.
Are you kidding? Jews love gun control. Look at the USSR. They had some real fun there. Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, Yurovsky the list goes on and on.
Gun control is Communist policy NOT Nationalist. You have the two mixed up.
That comment section(click to show/hide)
I tend to side with those who approach it more as a right to personal safety from other individuals who may be criminals, in that police protection isn't perfect and always available at the drop of a hat. Especially in isolated rural areas, which in the US is the vast majority of the sparsely populated territory, and also tends to explain the difference between "red" and "blue" states on this issue. In a densely populated city, the nearest police patrol is usually not that far off, and proliferation of firearms creates more crime than it ever prevents. Whereas in sparsely populated areas the exact opposite is true.
At election day, each state votes separately. The majority in each state gets all the electors of that state (with two exceptions). Each state has a number of electors loosely depending on the population of the state. However, it's not fair because say one elector in Iowa represents much fewer people than one elector in California. On top of that, this system strenghtens the bipartism of the US, because in order to get electors you need to be the first political force somewhere, instead of getting say 10% everywhere like a minor party could easily acheive.
This system also causes huge problems with gerrymandering and also the fact that if you live in a state that traditionally always votes blue or always votes red, your individual vote really is pointless.
Certain states(mine) have started to revoke the gerrymandering districts. (one of the reps, who had a Gerrymandered district to include practically all the blacks to stay elected every 2 years was campaigning hard against it)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida%27s_3rd_congressional_district#The_1993.E2.80.932012_black_majority_district
http://pjmedia.com/zombie/2010/11/11/the-top-ten-most-gerrymandered-congressional-districts-in-the-united-states/
It's really amazing how you point to one fucking instance of gerrymandering, and it was about black people, conveniently ignoring that the majority of gerrymandered districts ended up as such specifically to disenfranchise black voters.
It's really amazing how you point to one fucking instance of gerrymandering, and it was about black people, conveniently ignoring that the majority of gerrymandered districts ended up as such specifically to disenfranchise black voters.
No, is pretty much the same way here. You can shoot someone who breaks into your house with a gun and still get sued and jail time. It might be a little different in states like Florida with a Stand Your Ground Law or whatever, though.
#1 rule is to never call the cops, ever. Just leave. Worst case scenario, you're found later... but you've lost nothing. You have no obligation to give yourself up to the police and you can't be punished for not doing so.
Well in the US, leaving the scene and not calling the cops is tantamount to admitting guilt and is seen that way by the police and the courts. Here self defense is a legal defense against a murder charge by a prosecutor. If you flee and do not turn yourself in, a judge may disallow self defense as a defense against murder charges in your trial.Source? It may "look bad", but it should have no real weight on anything. You should always have a story about being in shock etc as well.
Source? It may "look bad", but it should have no real weight on anything. You should always have a story about being in shock etc as well.
Leaving the Scene, regardless of why, will get you arrested, just for the mere fact of "leaving the scene" which is against the law.
Oh well, at least you don't get shot to shit if you would stay there.
The police won't just pull guns out on you and start shooting, unless there's already a gunfight going on(wild west, but I've never heard of this, usually the bads up an leave before cops pull up). If you DO leave the scene, you WILL have an officer approach you later to "take you in" for questioning.Well obviously you'll be questioned. You'll be questioned either way.
Source? It may "look bad", but it should have no real weight on anything. You should always have a story about being in shock etc as well.
The police won't just pull guns out on you and start shooting, unless there's already a gunfight going on(wild west, but I've never heard of this, usually the bads up an leave before cops pull up). If you DO leave the scene, you WILL have an officer approach you later to "take you in" for questioning.
It's really amazing how you point to one fucking instance of gerrymandering, and it was about black people, conveniently ignoring that the majority of gerrymandered districts ended up as such specifically to disenfranchise black voters.
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See this is why Europeans have a superiority complex when it comes to gun crime/control; 'internet Americans' give the impression that you're all sister-marrying red-necks who masturbate to images of guns on your wall, and then jizz right down the barrel of your nearest gun and say 'OH shit, Ma gun!!!' and haul your pants back up, take the gun apart and start tenderly cleaning it, then start to get a little bit excited in your pants again as you clean the inner workings of your gun, so whip your dick back out and start rubbing it up and down the outside of the barrel again.
Source? Lawyers, books written by lawyers about self defense laws, accounts of jury trials written by defense counsels, legal precedents from case law.Such as...........
OH HURR DURR, AMERICAN POLICE SO BAD
LOLOLlLoLOLOLOl EU MASTUR RACE
Kill yourselves, all of you
i think ur just mad that in 240 years we built a bigger and stronger country than yours could in thousands
stay mad, europoors.
Damn, Clockwork, taking one for the team.Wow, you're seriously comparing real life law enforcement (you know, which leads to deaths) to "EU forum mods" on a game forum :lol: :lol: :lol:
There's some hilariously brutal irony here in a thread about American law enforcement being edgy and forceful while an EU mod mutes someone with 98 pointer for being a "dumbass."
Anyway, carry on.
Wow, you're seriously comparing real life law enforcement (you know, which leads to deaths) to "EU forum mods" on a game forum :lol: :lol: :lol:
The problem is the militarization of american police. They have millions dollars to equip them with tanks, Black Hawks, drones and dumdum bullets.
The sign of a more and more unequal society. After the "War on drugs", "war on terror", here is "war on poverty".
Not a tank and thats a helicopter with armed dudes. So? Every countries policeforce has armored vehicles and helicopters.
pretty much this, its an apc, and a transport helicopter, sorry, we dont have tanks with cannons and rocket pods on them, though you can think we do.
Why are you defending bloated police budgets that are leading to every bumfuck town getting armored military vehicles and major cities having drone fleets. That shit should be considered insane by any American regardless of what your political views.
You realize SWAT teams, which function like fucking Mongolian raiders through property seizures, very often bust down the wrong house while using flashbangs, teargas, blinding lights, all sorts of shit to disorient the "druglords" inside. If you so much as reach for your constitutionally protected home-defense firearms that you always post about cuz you think you woke up in fucking Fallujah and need to protect your family, you will be executed on the spot. Even if you don't do anything they are videotaped regularly murdering people's dogs and shit.
I also dont see a problem with seizing property which is purchased on the backs of drug money and gangbanging.
Why are you defending bloated police budgets that are leading to every bumfuck town getting armored military vehicles and major cities having drone fleets. That shit should be considered insane by any American regardless of what your political views.
You realize SWAT teams, which function like fucking Mongolian raiders through property seizures, very often bust down the wrong house while using flashbangs, teargas, blinding lights, all sorts of shit to disorient the "druglords" inside. If you so much as reach for your constitutionally protected home-defense firearms that you always post about cuz you think you woke up in fucking Fallujah and need to protect your family, you will be executed on the spot. Even if you don't do anything they are videotaped regularly murdering people's dogs and shit.
http://socnet.com/showthread.php?t=116574
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Oh, I finally understand why Americans need the right to use military grade weaponry : it's to defend from the SWAT assault teams when you forget to pay your parking ticket.
I don't know if you guys caught it early in the thread, but this was a pretty illuminating article: http://socnet.com/showthread.php?t=116574
Police tase 8-year-old girl (http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/09/us/south-dakota-taser-lawsuit/)
Police throw a 10-year-old autistic boy on hot car to "cool off" (http://thefreethoughtproject.com/10-year-old-boy-autism-treated-police-state/)
Both links shows a situation where tantruming children could have potentially harmed themselves or others, police arrived, defused the situation, everyone is safe and no laws were broken, and there is something wrong?
:?
INB4 harmless children dont have the strenght to cut with knives/scissors.
While this particular skirmish (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/supreme_court_dispatches/2014/04/fourth_amendment_cellphone_cases_at_the_supreme_court_the_justices_are_tech.html) wasn't lost, it does suggest that many district attorneys don't care for fourth amendment rights. All it takes is enough money behind the next decision, and it'll probably end up similar to our right to propose election reform (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/03/us/politics/supreme-court-ruling-on-campaign-contributions.html).
While this particular skirmish (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/supreme_court_dispatches/2014/04/fourth_amendment_cellphone_cases_at_the_supreme_court_the_justices_are_tech.html) wasn't lost, it does suggest that many district attorneys don't care for fourth amendment rights. All it takes is enough money behind the next decision, and it'll probably end up similar to our right to propose election reform (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/03/us/politics/supreme-court-ruling-on-campaign-contributions.html).
Cellphones are easy way to track someone but not the scariest. Yes there are voice records, bunch of pictures, videos, other private documents. But using smartphone in such ways is like giving them the right to track you. Higher fidelity satellite images are what is really terrifying. Number of commercial satellites serving that very purpose is increasing every day and your government is issuing right to commercial businesses to use equipment that is capable of taking images of increasingly higher resolution. Right now I think the limit is at 50 cm for pixel size. If it stays that way, it won't be that much of a issues. But if it goes down, there might be a problem, big problem.
I'm not talking about typical conspiracy theory where USA government is tracking us, that is now taken for granted. I'm talking about having thousands of civilian companies having the same right. Soon we'll be able to see every fine detail on services on Google Street Maps and with computer technology growing by leaps and bounds in few decades those still images will be converted into real time 3D highly realistic interactive videos (practically something like video games). There will be virtually no place to hide, voluntary or not everybody will be tracked in every imaginable way by multiple parties at the same time. So far only Paypal has access to my bank account, in the future every single service provider (common term for IT companies of the future, because they will be providing various services) will have access to your bank account and not just that. Number of tracking sensors on "smart" technological units will increase and they all will be interconnected and companies will claim they won't use that data for their own gain (one huge lie). So far only smartphones are the massive thing. In the future smartwatches market will grow, smart home appliances will spread to less fortunate when they find a way to cut the prices. Augmented reality glasses and virtual reality headsets hand in hand will provide entertainment and take our privacy away, collect as much data as possible and send it to huge clusters of computers for further alysis. This is happening already, but it's going to become many order of magnitude bigger.
You think movies depicted future as scary. You know nothing. It will be million times worse. Good thing, I won't be alive for more then 50 years from now and probably won't live during the worst times that are bound to come.
After all, no one with power gives a fuck about your 200 years old fourth amendment. There are businesses to be taken care of and it doesn't matter at what cost they come.
46 shots only, I'm sure you can do better than that!
Piss poor training and discipline for cowards with guns. That's all this is.There's that, but there's a disproportionate amount of incidents like this in the U.S. The issue has to stem from a more general LE mentality in the US. Their mindset seems very, very different from European cops.
There's that, but there's a disproportionate amount of incidents like this in the U.S. The issue has to stem from a more general LE mentality in the US. Their mindset seems very, very different from European cops.
There's no doubt about that.Yeah, maybe. A lot of the former (and current) military guys I've seen speak about it tend to be very condescending towards the current generation of America's cops, though. I doubt they learn the poor trigger discipline in the military, especially since the US hasn't really been in an all out shooting war for what, ten years? From what I hear, the service members are held to very high standards abroad, and would get a lot of shit for acting like those cops.
But you also have to realize that a lot of areas have literally volunteers acting as sheriffs and deputies. These people receive little in terms of training and will seek to escalate the situation because they have no training to fall back on instead of a lot of practice firing their guns. Not to mention that many veterans end up being cops, and they retain the military mentality. When you spend your formative years in a environment where being trigger happy is a survival method it's hard to get rid of it.
Yeah, maybe. A lot of the former (and current) military guys I've seen speak about it tend to be very condescending towards the current generation of America's cops, though. I doubt they learn the poor trigger discipline in the military, especially since the US hasn't really been in an all out shooting war for what, ten years? From what I hear, the service members are held to very high standards abroad, and would get a lot of shit for acting like those cops.
Not sure if this was posted yet, but pretty funny. Dat training.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP0f00_JMak
All out shooting wars are one thing, being an occupying force is another experience altogether. It's one thing to go out on patrol and expect to see a uniformed enemy and have a shooting war - you're expecting to meet an enemy and have a proper battle. It's a whole other experience to run checkpoints in an occupied country where any car coming up to you could be loaded with explosives. It's this uncertainty that leads to frayed nerves, and sometimes really bad shit happens when you put nervous people with guns in a country with an insurgency.
Wrong country for that, Smooth, wrong country.Guns have little to do with it. Most of the police forces in Europe are armed, yet incidents like this are rare, almost non-existent.
The gardai (police on Ireland) are only armed in Limerick and high crime-rate areas.
In Dublin they don't even carry guns around.
Guns have little to do with it. Most of the police forces in Europe are armed, yet incidents like this are rare, almost non-existent.
No money, no life
SECTION I
ARTICLE 2
Everyone's right to life shall be protected by law. No one shall be deprived of his life intentionally save in the execution of a sentence of a court following his conviction of a crime for which this penalty is provided by law.
Deprivation of life shall not be regarded as inflicted in contravention of this article when it results from the use of force which is no more than absolutely necessary:
(a) in defence of any person from unlawful violence;
(b) in order to effect a lawful arrest or to prevent escape of a person lawfully detained;
(c) in action lawfully taken for the purpose of quelling a riot or insurrection.
And?
And it's fucked up that things like that happen in the U.S. but it looks like it could be argued "deprivation of life" was legal in Walter Scott's case if it were Europe. From the little I gathered, and uncharacteristically of the justice system in the US, that officer was also charged.No, it couldn't be argued in Europe. What you quoted isn't law.
I still remember this shit, "exchanging" fire, however no gun was found in the boat.Hahahah, their accuracy was truly something extraordinary. I don't remember the details, but they had a very low hit percentage even on the boat and the suspect(s) inside didn't get hit, I think.
And it's fucked up that things like that happen in the U.S. but it looks like it could be argued "deprivation of life" was legal in Walter Scott's case if it were Europe. From the little I gathered, and uncharacteristically of the justice system in the US, that officer was also charged.Laws in the countries composing Europe can be more restrictive than The European Convention on Human Rights. Most of the countries in Europe have a law about proportionate usage of force depending on the situation. Shooting hobos would most likely not be considerate proportional in Europe.
It's ok, murder is upheld in the bible, so those cops just be doing gods work, right 76% of americans?
I do not agree with what these cops did; it was cruel and very unnecessary. But I wouldn't mind if they did that to some scumbag full of shit like you.
1. Where does the Bible condone murder? Ever? Fucking idiot. I bet you'll be looking it up in thepsalmspalms lol.
2. Whether you, me, or anybody else likes it or not, christian principles are what made America the greatest nation on Earth. Doesn't mean you gotta like them, or be a christian, but its the truth. Maybe you should go back and take 1st grade history.
3. I see people like you attacking christians and beating them into the dirt, but not muslims, or Buddists, or anything else. Maybe its because most christians don't snap back and blow people up who make dirty jokes about Jesus. Its this thing called christian values. Thats why I'm defending them.
4. I don't see why there is so much hate for christians. Because they are hypocrites? Because they are right? Because they are just better people then you? What have christians ever DONE to you? And please don't give me bullcrap about crusaders or mormons or some cult. Thats like comparing Germans to Naz!s.
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I do not agree with what these (american) cops did; it was cruel and very unnecessary.
christian principles are what made America the greatest nation on Earth
I see people like you attacking christians and beating them into the dirt, but not muslims, or Buddists, or anything else. Maybe its because most christians don't snap back and blow people up who make dirty jokes about Jesus. Its this thing called christian values. Thats why I'm defending them.
But I wouldn't mind if they did that to some scumbag full of shit like you.
First of all, the Bibel is not a history book. It is a book about christian values/morals and about interpreting it right, which is simply very very hard.I am not defending my religion, I am defending another religion that is being attacked.
impl.: Obviously Polkafranzi is a legendary troll on a lvl you cant even imagine.
sec:
I promise you, he says that to everyone, and its okay because he is a good guy. I know that. promised.
> christan values hu? Okay, lets clarify this: I am no atheist, but I cant say I am christan nor muslim or whatever. Also no agnostic.
values.... read the bible first with a brain before you talk like this. As far as I understood it, the new testament aka. christian values teaches us: "forgivness of sins".
So you declare yourself as "defender of your religion" while saying
third: 50k offered to first one who finds a mistake her
[...] America the greatest nation on Earth.[...]With this you showed your narrow mindset.
With this you showed your narrow mindset.
what about Bhutan for example. they are not fighting any war. they do not exploit other countries. they made the happiness of their people a stategoal.
or what about switzerland? they where able to stay out of any armed conflicts even when everything around them was on fire.
what about your northern neighbours. they have the same freedom but a much lower homocide rate.
fuck there are so many countries you could consider greater unless your definition of great is only landmass and military power.
They are nice Countries and all, But where would the world be without the existence of America today? Would we be ruled by the 3rd Reich of Naz! Germany? Would Islamic radicals have taken over the world and forced woman and anyone who isn't "them" into submission and fear? Would Communists rule every country with an Iron fist? Would The U.S.S.R iron curtain ever be lifted? Would people still be shot died trying to climb the Berlin wall for a better life? Would Latino Americans have anywhere to run to for hope of civilization and a better life for them and their children?
Granted, America has commited some atrocities like slaughtering Indians, being Imperialistic (throughout the 1700s-1900), etc. But what nation does not have any issues? The only perfect nation would be a nation without people, and thus without human nature.
I do not question whether Switz is a great nation and all, but sometimes the ONLY way to stop evil is with strength and resolve. And so far only a few nations have shown that in recent decades against evils that could not have been stopped through smiles and sweet talking. Communism spread unchecked until Reagan finally stepped up in his famous quote: "Mister Gorbachev, Tear down this wall!" H!itler fueled the flames of a dying and dispirited nation into a facist juggernaut which seemed unstoppable, and ALL the sweet talks, and peaceful negotiations, and treaty pacts, and agreements could not stop his hungry rush for power.
America has the strength to stand up for whats right, (had) once upon the time the morals to know what was right, and (was) generous and prosperous enough to help other nations, not just their own. America has been the place of making impossible dreams possible, and it has many a time been a beacon of hope in a dark world. However, to be fair and honest, Americans no longer possess many of these qualities, and thus I do not think I can honestly say that America is STILL the greatest nation on Earth. But its not too late to turn things around for the better.
Hmm, thats new, can you please reference the verse in which it says that God hates my old friends?Really? Nobody who has ever bothered to read the bible has any doubt whether god is a homophobe. The bible is crystal clear about this, but since you asked:
I was about to start a rant and insulting your intelligence until I opened the spoiler! You got me, good one :lol:(click to show/hide)
And this is probably the highest grade historical delusion I've come across in this forum ever. It's up there with all the funny russians in the Ukraine-thread and Master Tovi... :lol:(click to show/hide)
:shock:I would like to see that question answered tbh :D
For real? :lol:
I was about to start a rant and insulting your intelligence until I opened the spoiler! You got me, good one :lol:
And this is probably the highest grade historical delusion I've come across in this forum ever. It's up there with all the funny russians in the Ukraine-thread and Master Tovi... :lol:
Made me chuckle and shiver at the same time.
I would like to see that question answered tbh :D
christian principles are what made America the greatest nation on EarthI thought that was WWII laying waste to all the other great nations, leaving the US, the late comer to the war with unprecedented geographical security, with half the world's wealth by 1945.
I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.
What I write is from the official record, nothing of it is controversial. The US kept it's economic stranglehold on the country after its supposed 'self-determination' rhetoric. That was the realpolitik imperative of the Monroe Doctrine.
I recommend reading more sources and more details about the invasion and US influence in Latin America, if you're interested.
Yes, as a simple search would have told you, the US has invaded Latin America many times.
http://faculty.chass.ncsu.edu/griffin/ps543/Timeline%20of%20US-Latin%20American%20Relations%20since%201823.htm (NC University)
I urge you to check the sources on any of the facts stated in my original post.
What I write is from the official record, none of it is controversial.Well, he's got a point that the Philippines were not a French colony as you wrote, but a Spanish one. Though perhaps it was just a typo on your part.
a product of the US school system
Btw Doom_Carrot: Do you know what a carrot injected with 'doom' actually is?
Hehe it's funny the two thing great things that america has done you listed, america was taking part in it but was not the major cause. chocolate chip cookie Germany fell thanks to USSR, america interviened in the war when Germany was already loosing to USSR. And USSR and berlin wall did not fall thanks to america but thanks to Gorbatchev and the people of Germany and Russia.
I do not question whether Switz is a great nation and all, but sometimes the ONLY way to stop evil is with strength and resolve. And so far only a few nations have shown that in recent decades against evils that could not have been stopped through smiles and sweet talking. Communism spread unchecked until Reagan finally stepped up in his famous quote: "Mister Gorbachev, Tear down this wall!" H!itler fueled the flames of a dying and dispirited nation into a facist juggernaut which seemed unstoppable, and ALL the sweet talks, and peaceful negotiations, and treaty pacts, and agreements could not stop his hungry rush for power.
America has the strength to stand up for whats right, (had) once upon the time the morals to know what was right, and (was) generous and prosperous enough to help other nations, not just their own. America has been the place of making impossible dreams possible, and it has many a time been a beacon of hope in a dark world. However, to be fair and honest, Americans no longer possess many of these qualities, and thus I do not think I can honestly say that America is STILL the greatest nation on Earth. But its not too late to turn things around for the better.
Well, he's got a point that the Philippines were not a French colony as you wrote, but a Spanish one. Though perhaps it was just a typo on your part.Ah yes, didn't even notice, was getting late. I've corrected it.
@Argantyr: Under Suharto, the suppression of politcal oposition killed even more than the ethnic cleansing of timor-east. More than 500'000 people were killed across indonesia with the support of US gouvernement.Yes, Suharto was an absolutely brutal dictator, who got British and Australian support aswell. The British even gave him aircraft during the invasion.
Probably something phallic.
Ah yes, didn't even notice, was getting late. I've corrected it.
For anyone interested in the period I can recommend Dan Carlin's podcast on the Spanish-American war and its aftermath: http://www.dancarlin.com/product/hardcore-history-49-the-american-peril/
The 'liberation' of the Philippines was brutal, destruction of villages, mass-slaughter, concentration camps and torture to such a degree it led to Senate hearings on U.S activities there.
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(http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/Christopherrolf/media/FirstBattleofBudDajo_zpsmylitlmr.jpg.html)
American soldiers pose after the massacre of Moro men, women and children.
Yes, Suharto was an absolutely brutal dictator, who got British and Australian support aswell. The British even gave him aircraft during the invasion.
They are black and white, so it is impossible to prove those are Americans
Wat...What didn't you understand, motherfucker? Don't you know what black and white means?
Wat...
The picture. Its black. And its white. Its kinda like interracial porn.
Does this mean americans can't tell the difference between ethnicities if the pictures are in nig... black and normal?Yes, obviously, do you literally not know anything?
Does this mean americans can't tell the difference between ethnicities if the pictures are in nig... black and normal?
US school system sux
I worked with a dude who was homeschooled once.
The first time I met him, went on to inform me that he was in fact properly socialized, so me and him should get along fine.
But seriously, fuck that guy. Don't homeschool your kids.
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To tell you the truth Carrot, we kinda noticed you being different quite fast. Like what ptx said, naive.
There is the actual massive flaw. Based on what you said. You were freaking lucky that you had such parents and friends. So basically however your child turns out is 100% dependent on the parents. Which, I think I dont have to tell you, why is bad. Because parents are hardly ever so wise and have enough time to fully pull it off even partially effectively. And sometimes parents who home school(even the best) are incapable of teaching their kids how to deal with assholes, schemers, peer pressure, bullies etc. It builds overall character. Yes, it might be a slightly hostile environment, but you will inevitably come across all that in later life. You think you could cope? I honestly dont.
Again to tell you the truth Carrot, you seem most likely from all of us to lose all your money in a pyramidscheme. :lol:
To tell you the truth Carrot, we kinda noticed you being different quite fast. Like what ptx said, naive.
There is the actual massive flaw. Based on what you said. You were freaking lucky that you had such parents and friends. So basically however your child turns out is 100% dependent on the parents. Which, I think I dont have to tell you, why is bad. Because parents are hardly ever so wise and have enough time to fully pull it off even partially effectively. And sometimes parents who home school(even the best) are incapable of teaching their kids how to deal with assholes, schemers, peer pressure, bullies etc. It builds overall character. Yes, it might be a slightly hostile environment, but you will inevitably come across all that in later life. You think you could cope? I honestly dont.
Again to tell you the truth Carrot, you seem most likely from all of us to lose all your money in a pyramidscheme. :lol:
And I got one of the highest scores possible on my PSAT and SAT and easily made it into the top 5 percentile.What did I talk about? I thought it was a picture. Did they not teach you the difference in the school of homes?
You have no idea what you're talking about
Being homeschooled, I feel like I must tell you that everything just said is not true. Many of my friends are homeschooled, many are not.
I have friends from many areas of life, and honestly find myself to be very busy with all the social activities I do. I learn alot more than any public schoolers, because I don't text people on my phone all day while falling asleep to a monotone teacher's voice. I got the presidential gold volunteer award 3 years in a row, and am an active part of my community. I have seen many of my friends go from public school to homeschool, but never the other way around. Also it helps keep families closer. My mom read me bedtime stories before tucking me in to bed until I was 15, and my brothers and I spent alot of days playing board games together or taking walks around the block and talking about our life goals.
However, it can be weird too, I agree. Sometimes when in public I didn't know what to say to people. I always got made fun of for hiding in my house all day by the big kids down the block. I was on an airplane once and I was scared so I brought my stuffed frog with hearts on it (a valentine's day present) and I got a lot of mean looks and glares. So people can be stupid about it but homeschooling is good. I fully support it so knock it off.
Being homeschooled, I feel like I must tell you that everything just said is not true. Many of my friends are homeschooled, many are not.
I have friends from many areas of life, and honestly find myself to be very busy with all the social activities I do. I learn alot more than any public schoolers, because I don't text people on my phone all day while falling asleep to a monotone teacher's voice. I got the presidential gold volunteer award 3 years in a row, and am an active part of my community. I have seen many of my friends go from public school to homeschool, but never the other way around. Also it helps keep families closer. My mom read me bedtime stories before tucking me in to bed until I was 15, and my brothers and I spent alot of days playing board games together or taking walks around the block and talking about our life goals.
However, it can be weird too, I agree. Sometimes when in public I didn't know what to say to people. I always got made fun of for hiding in my house all day by the big kids down the block. I was on an airplane once and I was scared so I brought my stuffed frog with hearts on it (a valentine's day present) and I got a lot of mean looks and glares. So people can be stupid about it but homeschooling is good. I fully support it so knock it off.
he's throwing bait all over the place.
he's throwing bait all over the place.
Is this trolling? I can't tell
I not only call troll, I call a returning veteran player with a new cd key since he became so active and vocal so suddenly from nowhere.I had that very same thought but his appearance here started with a bunch of question about strat that would have been quite difficult to come up with for a veteran.
Large Scale Hypocrisy: Leland Yee, Most Anti-Gun Senator in the US, Pleads Guilty to Gun Running (http://thefreethoughtproject.com/large-scale-hypocrisy-leland-yee-anti-gun-senator-us-pleads-guilty-gun-running/)
Known to be against violent video games.
Forbes, ABC, CNN
US Tax Evasion Cases: Apple, GE Among American Companies Holding $2.1 Trillion In Offshore Accounts (http://www.ibtimes.com/us-tax-evasion-cases-apple-ge-among-american-companies-holding-21-trillion-offshore-2129580)
Panem et circenses.
Accidental deaths are great, cos you get to ignore them when compiling the stats on homicides/shootings in your area.
In order to protect free speech we must have a serious discussion on this subject. Who's willing to step up and start the conversation?
A Texas state legislator wants the U.S. to stop allowing Syrian refugees into the country. His reasoning: They might be able to buy guns in his state.And what, exactly, is wrong with his logic? I think you'll find the only one that has problems with logic is you.
:D So mighty logic :D
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/11/17/3722968/nra-texas-rep-no-syrians-gun-access/ (http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/11/17/3722968/nra-texas-rep-no-syrians-gun-access/)
And what, exactly, is wrong with his logic? I think you'll find the only one that has problems with logic is you.Try again :D
A Texas state legislator wants the U.S. to stop allowing Syrian refugees into the country. His reasoning: They might be able to buy guns in his state.
:D So mighty logic :D
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/11/17/3722968/nra-texas-rep-no-syrians-gun-access/ (http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/11/17/3722968/nra-texas-rep-no-syrians-gun-access/)
Wow, just wow lol.
Aren't they ashamed of themselves?
BumpYou can't just bump this without feeding the fire...
You can't just bump this without feeding the fire...
visitors can't see pics , please register or loginunderrated reaction :lol:
You can't just bump this without feeding the fire...Oh yeah? Well, I just did. Whatchu gon' do about it... bitch?
Whatchu gon' do about it... bitch?
Oh yeah? Well, I just did. Whatchu gon' do about it... bitch?visitors can't see pics , please register or login
both 'muricans and europoors are trash tier and will be easily triggered by this fact
Oh yeah? Well, I just did. Whatchu gon' do about it... bitch?
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Your whole country is a prison.
I always wondered why so few school shootings happen in land down under. Do you go to school?
Bogan? Kinda :P
6 Casualties, no Russian casualties
No cassualties, come on Trump, isnt it the standard to at least kill 10 civilians per bomb?
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/San-Bernardino-North-Park-Elementary-School-Shooting-419054974.htmlThat wasn't a school shooting just to mindlessly kill people. The shooter knew the female teacher and apparently went there to murder her and commit suicide, 2 kids got caught by stray bullets.
That wasn't a school shooting just to mindlessly kill people. The shooter knew the female teacher and apparently went there to murder her and commit suicide, 2 kids got caught by stray bullets.
Shouldnt have let him have a gun then, stray knife swings are less scary.
Shouldnt have let him have a truck then, stray knife swings are less scary.
(click to show/hide)
Imagine what the cops would have done if he was black...(click to show/hide)
"NBC News confirms that it has positively identified the man being removed from the plane as Dr. David Dao. Dao, who practices medicine in Elizabethtown, was randomly bumped from the flight. When he was asked to deboard the plane, he refused and the ensuing scuffle was captured on multiple cell phone cameras.
It's not the Doctor's first run-in with the media spotlight. Dao's license was briefly suspended while he was investigated and indicted on 98 drug charges. He was also convicted of trading prescriptions for sex in Jefferson County."
http://www.lex18.com/story/35123225/united-airlines-passenger-identified-as-troubled-elizabethtown-doctor
He probably should have just complied and got off of the plane now his dirty laundry is getting aired.
"NBC News confirms that it has positively identified the man being removed from the plane as Dr. David Dao. Dao, who practices medicine in Elizabethtown, was randomly bumped from the flight. When he was asked to deboard the plane, he refused and the ensuing scuffle was captured on multiple cell phone cameras.The media is being shady and fucked up as hell by airing this. What does any of this have to do with his forcible removal? Hope he sues and wins.
It's not the Doctor's first run-in with the media spotlight. Dao's license was briefly suspended while he was investigated and indicted on 98 drug charges. He was also convicted of trading prescriptions for sex in Jefferson County."
http://www.lex18.com/story/35123225/united-airlines-passenger-identified-as-troubled-elizabethtown-doctor
He probably should have just complied and got off of the plane now his dirty laundry is getting aired.
(click to show/hide)
Wow.
Hard to tell anything when we cant see into the car. And his girlfriend didnt seem very upset later on, it just seems kinda fake, pulling up the phone to tape it just like its her 3rd time having her BF murdered? Kid in the car too for even more dramatic effect? Hmm, if it is real though, shame on the cop if the guy was being cooperative.
Either way Trevor Noah has a very punchable face, god i hate that guy.
did you see the live stream video? It is traumatizing for me... I cant imagine the problems that little girl is going to have, I know there was a collection gathered to put his daughter through college but I have no doubt she will have trauma for the rest of her life.
Some close friends of mine went to the protests at the governors mansion after it happened, they said all the trouble between protesters and cops was caused by anarchist types in bandanas and red/black flags who were using it to as another excuse to start shit with police when most of the other organizers were calling for nonviolent action.
Yea I saw the video and have also seen countless videos of officers being killed in the matter of seconds on routine stops. The cop should have immediately told him to keep his hands in clear view if he was that nervous about the weapon, the guy clearly did nothing wrong, but he didn't do everything right which was why the cop reacted like that. Whenever there is a weapon involved the situation is immediately escalated and if you don't 100% follow their instructions to specific detail you're putting yourself at risk.
I think it's a bad idea to gamble with the " I know my rights " stuff if you're ever in a situation like that and that's kind of narrative that the media is pushing that these people did nothing wrong, when it's not even about whether you did anything right or wrong it's about the immediate situation at hand and if you pose any % of risk to the officer, whether you intend to or not doesn't matter to the courts. You basically have no rights whatsoever during the immediate altercation because their discretion and assumptions temporarily override them.
like we do here in Swedenlol no
You can't say the driver clearly did nothing wrong, because there is no video available of his actions in the car. From what I could see from the dash cam video is a cop who felt this could be a bank robber suspect that he was stopping. He is alerted to the person carrying a gun and from his perception the man starts moving his hands out of plain view to who knows where for who knows what purpose. The cop has to make a split second decision. My first impression was he over reacted Then I thought, could he really afford to wait until seeing a weapon? That may have been too late for him, his partner, or even the passengers. Something turned that encounter from a polite, businesslike affair into life and death in an instant. The jurors had a lot more information than the public has and they came back with a not guilty verdict.
Yeah that would never happen despite how good it sounds.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/minnesota-dashcam-aclu_us_594c33b3e4b0da2c731a77e4?ncid=edlinkushpmg00000313Are you implying there's something wrong with this? The guy threatened the cop and then resisted being pulled from the car.
Its good and all, but when it gets to the point of stuff like this happening you start to wonder if they couldnt at least be armed with a tazer.And the problem here isn't that they're not armed with a taser, the problem is that Swedish feminist cuck politics have convinced the population of the fantasy that women can do the same jobs as men.
What does it matter? Some of those women look bigger than the refugee, and I'm sure they'd do better than him in physical exams too. They're still women and have no business pretending they can hang with men when it comes to violence.
Are you implying there's something wrong with this? The guy threatened the cop and then resisted being pulled from the car.If you read the article it say the idiot kid had a road rage incident against an off duty cop, (off duty being the key word, if he was off duty how would anyone know he was a cop).
And Sweden is a good model to follow if you want sky-high rape statistics, Arab ghettos and hand grenade attacks.
If you read the article it say the idiot kid had a road rage incident against an off duty cop, (off duty being the key word, if he was off duty how would anyone know he was a cop).Cops are professional thugs m8
"The Minnesota Star Tribune reported Thursday that a criminal complaint alleges Promvongsa provoked a road-rage encounter the day of his arrest. The complaint, the newspaper said, accuses Promvongsa of “several aggressive acts toward the car of an off-duty Worthington police officer, including tailgating, swerving, making hand gestures out the window and closing in at a high rate of speed before stopping just short of the officer’s vehicle.”
So he never made contact, and cops seem to think they are immune to traffic laws how does anyone know if said off duty cop didnt cut him off or something.
Now all of this happened before what we are seeing in that video. In that video the kid pulled over for them when they lit him up and the plain clothes cop was out of his car screaming obscenities immediately and was on the kid before he even had a chance to get his seat belt off punched him 4 times drug him out of the car and threw him on the pavement , you could see his head hit, then was on top off him with his knee on the kids head while the two were cuffing him. At no point does it show the kid resisting or doing anything to warrant that treatment.
So you think that cop was professional or thug?
Europe was a mistake.USA is worse.
USA is worse.Everything good that's ever happened to you happened because of America. :^)
Look at all the bullshit you export worldwide and what masters you truly obey. :v)
Everything good that's ever happened to you happened because of America. :^)Define good.
If you're an "ethnic" American and hating on Europe you're hating on your ancestors : ))All people are individuals. Ancestry and heritage are of no consequence compared to culture, nationality, confession of faith, philosophy, etc.
USA is worse.Trump proves there are no secret shadowy illuminati cabals ruling the US.
Look at all the bullshit you export worldwide and what masters you truly obey. :v)
http://nypost.com/2017/06/25/couple-viciously-beats-restaurant-owner-her-teen-daughter-over-fast-food-order/
Dont mess with black peoples chicken, better serve it hot and with plenty of fries. I wouldve probably done something similar.. If someone served me cold meatballs i would think very mild thoughts of displeasure regarding them, and maybe not eat everything served. Better be on your guard, dont ever serve cold meatballs again.You better not mess with Jimmy Jumps chicken bro he will f you up.
Disobeying a lawful order caused his death which is what mattered in the criminal court. Whether that lawful order was questionable is what they will determine when they sue the city in civil court for wrongful death and most likely win.How do you know he disobeyed a lawful order? We only have the cop and the woman's word for what transpired. What mattered most in criminal court is that traditionally the law and juries are loath to question the polices' actions. They have been given greater leeway than a citizen would be.
Dont mess with black peoples chicken, better serve it hot and with plenty of fries. I wouldve probably done something similar.. If someone served me cold meatballs i would think very mild thoughts of displeasure regarding them, and maybe not eat everything served. Better be on your guard, dont ever serve cold meatballs again.
I'll be on my guard with a 9mm in case you do anything more than think mild thoughts.
USA is worse.
Look at all the bullshit you export worldwide and what masters you truly obey. :v)
Is this school shooting topic? Please revive thread, wanna talk about guns and freedom and bald eagles.
Is this school shooting topic? Please revive thread, wanna talk about guns and freedom and bald eagles.
It was obviously an inside job to take our freedoms perpetrated by someone on the autism spectrum, also don't forget about black people being guns
Thoughts and prayersWow I didn't know Havelle was any number of braindead sluts I knew from college posting on Facebook about something they know nothing about, in the exact way that [your favorite television funnyman here] told them to, who would have thought? Or thot?
make it soDon't forget the 24-hour news cycle, fam
initial shot: for the most recent News Event (wonder whats getting shoved through Congress with stunning "bipartisanship"), i fully blame institutionalized compulsory primary education and the internal rot of the atomic family, itself mostly caused through hyper-consumptionist propaganda and group thought the likes of which drove poor Ted to bomb all those folk in airline and tech
(pls no v&)
Wow I didn't know Havelle was any number of braindead sluts I knew from college posting on Facebook about something they know nothing about, in the exact way that [your favorite television funnyman here] told them to, who would have thought? Or thot?
Don't forget the 24-hour news cycle, fam
personally i don't understand the southern hardcore republicans who keep arguing that their (nearly) military grade rifles are more important to them than the lives of students/innocent bystanders. to a canadian this is all fucked to me
i am a southern minarchist on certain days, or complete voluntaryist on others, never voted for an R. lets get into this, i'll spare u a roasting on twitter :^)
so firstly, your premise that there is a zero-sum equation stating that the citizenry of the U.S. can EITHER a) own semi-automatic rifles that bear strong resemblance to military hardware or b) experience a near-complete diminishment of "school shootings", gun violence, mass murder, et cetera is very flawed. in like 2010, there were 300+ million private firearms in the United States; some sort of manufacturing ban, purchase ban, extended tax stamp preventing middle/lower class from buying rifles, or any other measure would be ineffective at preventing your average citizen from obtaining a firearm and ammunition. the only somewhat effective measure would be a very strict clamp-down on ammunition purchasing and manufacturing, simultaneous restrictions on powder/reloading supplies, i would imagine. not THAT many people stockpile ammo, so completely disregarding political feasibility of such a measure, that'd be the only real way to even begin such a thing.
second, your premise implies that any individual located in the same nation as a murderer, also possessing a firearm(s) bears responsibility for the murderer's actions or at least partial responsibility for his capability. i find this implication (intentional or not) loathesome.
third, you've got the common "u just have to fix mental health!" or "just make some1 pass a mental health exam to buy a gun!!!" arguments that, as a pseudoscience major with a couple brain cells, makes me livid. the entire argument assumes that, in order for an individual to commit mass murder, they must be mentally ill. murderers are placed in prison all the time for their actions- only very occasionally are they subject to being labeled insane. why mass murderers? do people think its so implausible for a rare person to know EXACTLY what they are doing, be in full control of their faculties, not depressed, capable of empathy and not sociopathic- and still kill their peers en masse?
its easier to think of such inhumane monsters as crazy, of course. more natural, maybe. everyone is so emotional, crying for "someone" to "do something", they can't even fathom the logistics of the shit.
Ok, so now as a society we've decided that we will empower some new organization or give an existing organization the power to detain minors and adults with impunity- if they are determined to be "high risk" to their peers. That's what we're fucking talking about, you know. They gonna lock up every 16 year old that doodles some slavshit rifle because he's bored and talks about CSGO in class? They gonna stuff every kid that goes on imageboards and elsewhere and laughs at tragedy in a van?
And say that this exists- what the FUCK do you DO with a kid that has been detained for being a suspected future shooter? Detain him indefinately? Have a bunch of shrinks poke and prod his psyche, feed him psychotropic cocktails until they decide that he ain't gonna go blast folk? Yeah, right.
ok so thats basically why it would be ineffective at stopping mass murder scenarios in a rambling nutshell. now here's for the thing that'll really rake your leafs u canuck
Even if, hypothetically, it were magically insured that restricting access to firearms for the population would significantly reduce instances of mass murder (children or otherwise), I would still not support such measures. Firstly, I feel that the safety of one's self and one's family is that individual's responsibility; also the responsibility of kin, neighbors, community, etc. I cannot support our disarmament. Second, I feel that the public school system is babbies' very first institutionalization and generally harmful in many aspects..and more morbidly, these 4k population schools make target rich environments for scum. Third, any given non-murderous individual owning firearms bears NO moral responsibility for the actions of an unassociated individual. If the butcher's bill was 2x higher, 5x higher, 10x higher, my position would not change. Understand thats very odd, or even disturbing to others. More than happy to explain it in more detail anytime.
And anyway, children in this country are far more likely to be slaughtered by local security forces than by lone maniacs, islamofascists, white supremacists, or commies put together.
also some anti-propaganda visitors can't see pics , please register or login
https://www.activistpost.com/2018/02/3-years-cops-killed-450-citizens-4-decades-mass-shootings-combined.html
youre such an asshole you know i read at a fourth grade level
I didn't really have promiscuous, college educated women in mind, i was flippantly summing up the usual talking points in these threads that end up just being a far right echo chamber.Right, I was saying it made you sound like a basic bitch trawling for Facebook likes in a cesspool of Washington Post article comments my dude.
never voted for an R
personally i don't understand the southern hardcore republicans who keep arguing that their (nearly) military grade rifles are more important to them than the lives of students/innocent bystanders. to a canadian this is all fucked to meHi, NORTHWESTERN hardcore Republican here. This is all fucked to you because you, a Canadian, don't know what you're looking at. It's not a question of how I value the lives of strangers in relation to my firearms, it's simply the law. Not just the law, but the highest law in America, to which all our other laws are subject. This highest law invokes the natural state of Man to ensure that certain liberties are not stripped of America's citizens by their government. This highest law says that the government shall not impede me if I wish to possess and train with "arms" (just as you could not possibly begrudge anyone in a state of nature an act of self-defense, or the preparation thereof). This being the highest law, all the other little laws must follow its lead, never going against it.
If only people still hit their kids...Agreed, I was beat by my parents and grandparents and look how well I turned out.
Sanderson Jankins, you seem like a proper fellow.
Even though I dont live in the US and have not as much knowledge as people living there of how it all works in this nation, it is pretty obvious from where I stand that people are simply afraid, and want this to stop happening, and want a simple solution, while there is none.
I personally believe that there is no real way to stop people from doing mass murders.
Even if all guns/cars/knives were banned from existence, there are always ways to acquire such items or to create/modify some in the purpose of mass killing. Not to add that contrary to popular belief (at least in my country) you cant just go in a gun shop, drop money on the counter, and get out with a loaded gun. Maybe it was easier in the past, but not today.
On the subject of mental health, people do seem to think like people stroll about with a "mental health" bar on top of their head. Or that you just have to put money on the table, because 1000$ equals a sane person. To this day mental health is still very much a random science where the go-to solution is to take pills to chill the fuck down, see a shrink, be sent intoprisonisolation. Thats it.
If I wanted to commit a mass murder in France I could, and I'm pretty sure that its the same in every countries on earth.
The world is very harsh, its easy to understand that ~10-20 people every year end up doing mass murder. The definition of mental illness is so vague that its way way too easy to just say "well, they were mentally ill, so that explains".
Whatever is the reason that explains the USA has so many mass shootings compared to the total mass shootings on the planet, there is no simple answers, its a sum of things that also include stupid shit like copycats/fame/suicide per cop. Not to forget that there is a lot of mass shootings everywhere on earth and we are just too focused on the USA.
If only people still hit their kids...
Agreed, I was beat by my parents and grandparents and look how well I turned out.
Glorification of violence and crime, easy access to military grade weapons, non-existent morals.
That can explain why things like this happen regularly and more frequently while nobody is trying to do anything to prevent it. America just doesn't give a shit about bottom dwelling denizens.
I've seen some pretty dumb shit while I was living in poverty. People spending all their money on cell phones and jewelry while their kids were wearing the same clothes everyday, people banging on their neighbor's door in the morning begging for eggs instead of walking their lazy fat ass to a store, idiots who refused to pay the very small fee of like 25 cents for trash removal, yet they had a brand new car they went into massive debt to buy while they lived like pigs and couldn't afford rent (shortly wrecked it later drunk driving). People have some pretty unrealistic expectations and little to no common sense. No amount of easily exploitable charity or goodwill will fix those levels of stupidity.
Some good Samaritans took in the psychopath shooter, they also knew he was a basketcase who just got expelled from school, lost his parents and had a lengthy police record and thought it was OK that he also be allowed to bring his machine guns over. He was someone who couldn't afford a pot to piss in but still managed to own, license and maintain 10 expensive military grade assault rifles? No red flags there? The good Samaritans must have been just as crazy.
White people are violent by design its in the bibleTrue that, and violence is the only true power in the universe. That's why The Whites are the most powerful and will remain so.
True that, and violence is the only true power in the universe. That's why The Wights are the most powerful and will remain so.visitors can't see pics , please register or login
If I got to 90 with a gun I'd Hunter S. Thompson myself.
At first I was thinking about how much I hate women who swear, but then I remembered that I hate all women anyway.
No you won't James. You'll want to live for just one more day.
At first I was thinking about how much I hate women who swear, but then I remembered that I hate all women anyway.
Probably tide pod myself tbh
But what about criminal sentencing disparity
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It's just a rock
watch it, youre on thin ice Vibe
its not just a rock, its a bloody great rock that happens to orbit us
that has to be useful in some way we can exploit, right?
No, it's pretty useless, the moon is just a chunk of the surface of Earth. There's no core, there's no tectonic activity, there's no useful minerals we can't much more easily find and exploit here, it's just a big piece of Earth that got separated and entered stable orbit. There's not even trace elements of water or atmosphere. Technically we haven't really achieved interplanetary travel.
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/arts-and-entertainment/wp/2018/03/02/a-my-600-lb-life-participant-died-while-filming-his-fight-to-lose-weight/?utm_term=.7974ecb46e22>never eat anything good
Sugar kills! Enter the supermarket, check product declarations, sugar is everywhere. Salami has sugar, ketchup has ton of sugar, cakes and chips and everything like that has sugar. Yogurt has sugar. Only stuff in the supermarket manufacturers don't add sugar to are raw fruit and raw meat. Everything else is cancer pill.
Being sugar free means you lose weight MUCH faster than while having elevated sugar levels in your bloodstream. Sooner or later that will become permanent thing and you'll earn diabetes. I say earn not get, because diabetes is something you earn by living unhealthy lifestyle. It's a badge for treating your body poorly.
First of all, say no to sodas. They add the most sugar to your body because we tend to consume shitload of those. Ketchup is known for having crazy high amounts of sugar. Add ketchup to all your food, that's one way train to becoming obese.
This is very important because it seems THIRD of your beloved country are obese individuals and percentage of kids is probably even higher.
I know about this shit very well because I've lost ton of weight just by kicking products from my diet which have ton of sugar. That means I normally don't consume processed food because processed food have ton of sugar in them. When I do I get fatter fast, like 3 kilos in less than a week just because I've started piling up complex sugars in my diet. I've got away from this issue but people around me haven't yet and I'm not sure how to help them. My struggle was personal and I sticked through it and WOULD NEVER EVER come back to being obese again.
We could talk about weed but since I've never smoke weed and know just theory about it, I'd rather not engage in such discussion. Would rather someone whose had issues from weed consumption speak about it. One thing is certain, weed may not fry your brain like stronger compounds will but weed is smoked and it is not healthy to inhale combustion products. Nicotine in cigarettes gets you addicted but it's not nicotine that kills, combustion products in smoke kills. Same goes for weed or anything else really, you could smoke dry grass it would be the same. In similar vein barbeque can be problematic just like eating any food that was scortched by heat. Thing is, weed wasn't a big thing globally but now everybody does it quite often and sooner than later it will lead to new wave of lung cancer patients whose got it from smoking weed. Be smart and put your desires and pleasures on hold a bit. Weed, alcohol, sugar, doesn't matter. Overindulge and you're going to end up like the dude from linked article.
the neo dark ages are coming.
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>never eat anything good
>starve yourself
>be smug
<die anyway
>everything you eat is good, you avoid crap foodI'm not on any diet. I'm an elite specimen, I don't gain fat no matter what I eat.
>you feel hunger until you kick out poison from your system
>you're smug about being unemployed/useless to society, i just want to help people not die before their time
>everybody wants to live a moment longer, no matter how old they are, why help the nature to kill you when you can prolong your life?
By the way, aren't you on low carb diet? If you are, you should know well how hard is to get fat while eating fat and proteins. Eating fat doesn't make you fat, eating excess of sugar makes you fat. Besides, you can't eat as much fat or protein like you can sugar because neither fat or protein create addiction while sugar does.
Arteries getting clogged isn't because of eating fat. It's because of smoking, it fucks up with arterial walls then all the shit invades arteries and clog them. Food industry advocates lied to us for decade claiming how best possible food we have available is actually bad for us, the egg yolk. And that animal fat is also bad for us. But in reality fuckers couldn't produce enough animal specimen to feed the world, so they invented highly processed, almost syntethic replacements.
Today we're on a brink of being capable of creating meat without having raise living and breathing animals, to feed them, keep them in sheds, look after them. Why would we need to keep eating processed bullshit? I'd choose genetically modified meat over vegetable oil any time of the day. I'm not ignorant redneck to think they are trying to decimate population with GM meat, but not dumb enough not to realize they sold us shit food because they weren't able to produce enough good food for everybody.
90% of food you can buy at any supermarket is crap food. 90% of the food that is advertized everywhere is crap food. And since we are what we eat, that means 90% of people are crap people but I'm not entirely sure is that entirely their own fault or fault of the system throwing shit to them to ingest.
The same games are played in other countries that people dont go out and shoot-up the neighborhood or schools because they played a "violent" vidya game or watched a "violent" movie.
Average people are dumb, you can't expect them to have enough mental strength to figure out what is extremely bad for them
they will willingly poison themselves until they drop dead.
any EU's got the inside information on next italian prime minister? could make some money on a underdog ballot win.
As much Americans hate communism, it did one thing well. Dealt efficiently with fringe groups of problematic individuals such as incels, religious nutcases, white power and rest of human scum. If USA was communist country, white power organizations, incels, gun fanatics, gays, trans etc. wouldn't present themselves in global media, they would be too busy breaking big rocks into smaller ones on some remote rocky island. Oberyns, Angantyrs, Xants, Leshmas of this forum would be inmates doing involuntary work for a long time for greater good of the free workers nation.
Communism tried to create the perfect image of ideal world, where all bad influences would be heavily supressed by state control apparatus. It would never allow internet to exist in this form. Dunno why I as sympathizer of communism still visit this shithole of a forum and read deranged opinion of moronic western European youth, fully immersed into activities that only harm human rationale in the long term.
One thing worth of notice, those same black people wielding guns, eating fried chicken would wear suits and behave rationaly under communist government. As a matter of fact, in period where some African nations were embracing communism they were acting uncharacteristically civilized by their standards. Same can be said for muslims, take Afghanistan under commies and under islamic clerics.
Seems to me that all the wrong shit in this world stems from one place and that one place never embraced communism.
You want well behaved and educated 20th century man, wearing suits, not looking like a junkie with tatoos all over his body. Only one ideology can help you there. The one that turned peasants into citizens. Farm based economy into heavy industry based economy. Employed everybody, provided free housing, worked on preservation of our specie, our health, living standard, product quality, long lasting commodities. Focus on quality not on marketing. You know where to look.
*they were jews but good jews, not american jews which were purged from soviet russia because they sucked as people
As much Americans hate communism, it did one thing well. Dealt efficiently with fringe groups of problematic individuals such as incels, religious nutcases, white power and rest of human scum. If USA was communist country, white power organizations, incels, gun fanatics, gays, trans etc. wouldn't present themselves in global media, they would be too busy breaking big rocks into smaller ones on some remote rocky island. Oberyns, Angantyrs, Xants, Leshmas of this forum would be inmates doing involuntary work for a long time for greater good of the free workers nation.
Communism tried to create the perfect image of ideal world, where all bad influences would be heavily supressed by state control apparatus. It would never allow internet to exist in this form. Dunno why I as sympathizer of communism still visit this shithole of a forum and read deranged opinion of moronic western European youth, fully immersed into activities that only harm human rationale in the long term.
One thing worth of notice, those same black people wielding guns, eating fried chicken would wear suits and behave rationaly under communist government. As a matter of fact, in period where some African nations were embracing communism they were acting uncharacteristically civilized by their standards. Same can be said for muslims, take Afghanistan under commies and under islamic clerics.
Seems to me that all the wrong shit in this world stems from one place and that one place never embraced communism.
You want well behaved and educated 20th century man, wearing suits, not looking like a junkie with tatoos all over his body. Only one ideology can help you there. The one that turned peasants into citizens. Farm based economy into heavy industry based economy. Employed everybody, provided free housing, worked on preservation of our specie, our health, living standard, product quality, long lasting commodities. Focus on quality not on marketing. You know where to look.
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Leshma when he gets declared president of CRPG forums (go to 1:25 for good bit)
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"Even yoghurt has more culture than the us" :lol: :lol: :lol: (no offense NA buds luv u plznobully)
Applauding is the best part. From what ive heard they applaud after a movie and after a plane lands. Such a funny concept to me. >he applauds :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
I'm european and I almost always tip but that's because I'm well off and you gotta give some gold coins back to the peasants, otherwise they'll revolt or somethingA man after my own taste
i don't tip
Whats the taxes and the rates common workers have to pay in US? I know its varied, but generalize.Consider the following:
my own State is unusual in that it has no State income tax, for instance, though we pay much more in sales and property taxes (which vary further by county) than most other States.
you can just buy stuff in Oregon
dropped
As sad as it is, tipping is what keeps people with shit jobs from doing a shitty job. At least in theory. I tipped at the snipper and still got both ears.
Whats the taxes and the rates common workers have to pay in US? I know its varied, but generalize.
The fees for the University of Helsinki Master’s Programmes are 13,000, 15,000 and 18,000 EUR per academic year, depending on the programme.
Please note that there are no tuition fees for:
- exchange students
- PhD students
- citizens of the European Union (EU), the European Economic Area (EEA) and Switzerland and those who have a permanent residence status within the EU and EEA.
I also don't understand why it's a hard concept for some non-USers that waiters and waitresses get paid less than minimum wage here and it's being grubby to not tip. I thought it was part of some service fee in the EU so you could pay a baseline rate to the employees? Is it better or worse? That's probably up to the workers, I'm sure some enjoy it here. Depending on the location and based on the restaurant they could potentially go home with a lot of money.
Theres also an issue with taking out larger loans. I doubt tips, being as stable of an income as they are, are counted in there during the process.
FBI raided the El chumpo's lawyers house, lol.
Luckily his jump suit will match his skin tone.
FBI raided the El chumpo's lawyers house, lol.
Luckily his jump suit will match his skin tone.
faint slurping noisesvisitors can't see pics , please register or login
if you pay attention you can see how popular movies in the US get ruined by *most likley* CIA influence on hollywood.
example #1 alien vs aliens: alien.. no us miltary presence, aliens.. heavy us military presence
example #2 AlienvsPredator(AVP) vs AlienVsPredator Requeim(AVP requeim): AVP.. no us military, AVP reqeuiem.. heavy us military presence
example #3 28 days later vs 28 weeks later: 28 days later.. no us military presence (anti miltary aspects), 28 weeks later.. heavy military presence (pro military aspects)
example #4 pacific rim(PR) vs pacific rim 2(PR2): PR.. anti authoritarian plot; just monster vs robots, PR2.. proauthoritarian plot, heavy us military presence.
I could go on, but why in a country where we are supposed to be free from our own governments propaghanda we have too deal with this kind of shit.
also feel free to add to the list.
Syria is reciving more Freedom as we speak. Thank God for Freedom!
Edit: It's funny because I overslept this morning and had a dream about nasty alien invasion, some sort of shape shifters having enourmous physical power with rabbid dogs as their sidekicks. Bunch of alien planes on the sky, people running everywhere. Going to underworld tunnels, children being ripped by said dogs all over the place. Sureal dream, kinda like War of the Worlds set. Must be PTSD from previous events I've already encountered.
I dreamt i gave birth through my asshole.
zip zop
zoopity bopBut why does it matter? It's a given that our military will have some sort of PR apparatus, and in a cesspool culture that places inordinate value on entertainment flicks this PR scheme very likely includes partial funding of the odd media project that portrays the military in a positive light. Wasteful, perhaps, but hardly insidious. The vast majority of entertainment media still portrays the military negatively or at least without realism, if anything causing a vast net increase in the civil-military divide (possibly one of the biggest challenges facing our military this century tbh). If some glow-in-the-dark friend needs to visit the Shekelstein film studio and drop off some cash for the average mutt to learn what an MRAP is then I guess that's just the gay world we live in. Myself personally, I'm much more spooked by what the entertainment industry as a whole supposedly does for free than what our spooks allegedly pay it to do.
But why does it matter? It's a given that our military will have some sort of PR apparatus, and in a cesspool culture that places inordinate value on entertainment flicks this PR scheme very likely includes partial funding of the odd media project that portrays the military in a positive light. Wasteful, perhaps, but hardly insidious. The vast majority of entertainment media still portrays the military negatively or at least without realism, if anything causing a vast net increase in the civil-military divide (possibly one of the biggest challenges facing our military this century tbh). If some glow-in-the-dark friend needs to visit the Shekelstein film studio and drop off some cash for the average mutt to learn what an MRAP is then I guess that's just the gay world we live in. Myself personally, I'm much more spooked by what the entertainment industry as a whole supposedly does for free than what our spooks allegedly pay it to do.
I'm not even sure if I'd call these alleged marketing efforts "propaganda" (though I've admittedly only seen Alien and Aliens out of all of those movies), but by the way http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/07/14/u-s-repeals-propaganda-ban-spreads-government-made-news-to-americans/ (http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/07/14/u-s-repeals-propaganda-ban-spreads-government-made-news-to-americans/)
i don't agree that most media depicts the military poorly- could you give me some examples there?Avatar, the highest grossing movie of all time, is a decent example off the top of my head. If you saw it you may recall the grizzled hardass villain trampling upon the poor indigenes and their quaint way of life in service to corporate greed. The (disabled) protagonist goes native and must defeat the militant, imperialistic, evil
Mostly I'm mad becuase they ruin good movies.I think the last good movie I saw was No Country for Old Men tbh and that was a decade ago
Avatar, the highest grossing movie of all time, is a decent example off the top of my head. If you saw it you may recall the grizzled hardass villain trampling upon the poor indigenes and their quaint way of life in service to corporate greed. The (disabled) protagonist goes native and must defeat the militant, imperialistic, evilwhiteshumans with the help of a diverse band of his fellow turncoats, scientists (I fcking love science btw), and tall blue niggas that probably smoke a lot of grass and get along really well with animals and shit. Our hero naturally faces additional adversity from the warrior class of tall blue niggas, who take umbrage at an outsider culturally enriching their princess like the bigoted jarheads they are. These are tropes you often see repeated, no? In science-fiction and fantasy, aren't military organizations usually depicted as backwards, incompetent, overreaching? War films sometimes glorify their subject matter but I can think of more that focus on depravity and pacifist messaging than otherwise. These are the depictions that people like Archibot enjoy, and by reinforcing them a movie studio can make something culturally relevant (maybe even woke) that talking heads will write about and encourage people to see. I have no problem* with any of this by the way, I don't watch movies often and even many of the few I like are decidedly anti-war or anti-military in tone, I just think media more often portrays military matters negatively than positively.
Entertainment media being such a huge part of the way people understand the world and conceptualize real-life situations is what I find unfortunate.
*I think the last good movie I saw was No Country for Old Men tbh and that was a decade ago(click to show/hide)
I think the last good movie I saw was No Country for Old Men tbh and that was a decade ago
Part of the civilian/military divide is because the military encourages looking down on "dirty, nasty, disgusting" civilians. Another part is the consequence of an endless
Part of the civilian/military divide is because the military encourages looking down on "dirty, nasty, disgusting" civilians. Another part is the consequence of an endless war on terror which has come to a proxy war for resources and pipelines. I do agree on the smut that passes for mainstream entertainment but the military basically only lets you use their toys and equipment if you shed a positive light on the institution.
Or can't find any other job. By far the dumbest people I've met belonged to military and police enforcement.Funny, the dumbest people I've met have been the software slaves that congregate around Jeff Bezos' giant balls. Materially knowledgeable and satisfied, but always like deer in headlights in any situation other than clickity-clack codewriting or Seattle Sounders games. Maybe that's just attributable to there being more of them where I live than where you live, eh?
furthermore Sam Hyde is, as always, very prescientI still think that Ted talk bit is some of the best content he's put out, I hated that pretentious savior-complex shit. His lampooning of it was perfect.
Why aren't you over there fighting again?Possibly because I was 13 when the last American combat troops withdrew from Iraq and and when our withdrawal from Afghanistan was announced three years later I made the mistake of committing to a number of years of community college which my high school graduation would then be dependent on. Been working on remedying that mistake lately, been meeting with a recruiter the past few months. But that's more of my life than you really need to know about :^)
you tellin' me there are things of significance in the USA outside of guns, big tiddies and cheeseburgers ??
@WestwoodSo you think chemical weapons are worse than non-chemical weapons? Based on what logic? It's fine to kill people with normal explosives, like a civilized dictator, but god forbid you kill people with chemical weapons!
What's your stance on Chemical Weapons?
A) Just 'big TNT'
B) Not all weapons are created equal
(this might be on the test)
So you think chemical weapons are worse than non-chemical weapons? Based on what logic? It's fine to kill people with normal explosives, like a civilized dictator, but god forbid you kill people with chemical weapons!
Because chemical weapons are double stage.Yes, I, too, wonder which one is objectively shittier. The conclusion I've come to is that the answer is, and must be, "neither."
You throw a grenade, it explodes and kills a person.
You hook a grenade up in a tripwire and it kills a person 20 years after the conflict.
You use a chemical weapon, it kills a person, it poisons the environment and affects several generations after the conflict.
You lose a chemical weapon, it leaks, it poisons the environment and affects hundreds of generations after the conflict.
Yeah, Xant, I wonder which one is objectively shittier.
edit: It's like you don't read the AIR2.0 thread
If a CM kills 200 people, how is it better than a chemical weapon killing 20 now and 40 later?
200
20 + 40 = ?
Believe me I wish people could stop killing each other, but if you think there is no difference I encourage you to go look up some pictures of the effects on people caused by chemical weapons, a bullet does seem civilized compared to these things.Oh, so it's just an aesthetics issue, then? That's an interesting theory of ethics, but I'll bite. Have you seen pictures of the effects on people caused by regular old bombs?
even the cultural trauma of being attacked with chemical weapons?LMAO
LMAO
I think Xant's point is that the nitty-gritty of war is a dirty nightmarish thing no matter the tools used and it's only sanitized in media and treaties for optics to better sell it to the public at large.From reading a few of his earlier posts it seemed like to me he was justifying chemical weapons because of the use of conventional weapons.
From reading a few of his earlier posts it seemed like to me he was justifying chemical weapons because of the use of conventional weapons.
But conventional weapons are not going to go away, at least not til the inhabitants of this planet decide to just nuke it back to the stoneage.
Trying to say the use chemical weapons is no worse than the use of conventional weapons isn't valid. So lets just validate nukes now too.
Unless you are trying to say chemical weapons were not used in this incident and the powers to be just embellished it so they could invade.
I don't think the treaties that were made after WW1 over the use of chemical weapons and there ban were agreed to for no reason.
The only difference between "conventional weapons" and "chemical weapons" is semantics.
It's anything but that. In the first, you are injuring people. In the latter case, you are injuring people as well as injuring their ability to heal.
LMAO
Obviously this assumes that you think about war as an event, something that happens between peace. If war is just an ending to you, then sure, lets nuke the planet. Semantics indeed.Your posts are so unbelievably dumb I'm going to go ahead and assume you're trolling.
Your posts are so unbelievably dumb I'm going to go ahead and assume you're trolling.
LMAO
so unbelievably dumb
hey sixthumbs i'll play xant defense force with you right quick. i'm pretty sure something similar to "what does a dead man care about his method of death?" is germane here.Sorry I was only using nukes as a hypothetical situation because at this point that is the only thing that is going to stop conventional arms, but I am sure as the survivors leave the bunkers the cycle will start again. And if you start ignoring stuff like chemical weapons and such how long till nukes come into it.
besides, chemical weapons are not prohibited by international treaty solely because the death itself is horrifying, painful, brutal, or anything else like that. a larger part of it is the environmental impact. bit difficult to obtain proper statistics, but Agent Orange use in Vietnam (hurrrr its JUST a defoliant and its fiiiiine, how else we gonna get fire-lanes set up in the jungle??) has promoted a large increase in birth defects, cancers, miscarriage, et cetera. even if not using something thats gonna have an impact that far down the road, bio-chem weapons aren't exactly "precision"
of course, not that strikes termed "precision strikes" are very precise either but that probably has much more to do with shit-tier intel sourced from unvetted local tribal fucksticks.
your comment about nukes is silly; even compared to Sarin or hyper-botulism or whatever in Christ's name humans have cooked up that ain't straight up Captain Trips nuclear exchange is pretty much the worst thing for the whole world that can happen.
anyway HEY IS ___ ALLOWED TO GAS PEOPLE? WHOS GONNA STOP HIM? ARE WE SUPPOSED TO DO *NOTHING*? is not important frankly
Golem wakes up in a hospital bed, all his limbs amputated and both eyes gone. He asks the doctor if chemical weapons were involved. When the doctor says no, Golem lets out a whoop of joy. The doctor is confused. Golem asks how long it takes for humans to regrow limbs and eyes. The doctor is even more confused and says humans can't do that. Golem is also confused, didn't the doctor just say no chemical weapons were used? The doctor tells him that humans actually have a very limited ability to heal, even if chemical weapons weren't involved.-excerpt from a short story called "Golem Learns Medicine"
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Maybe we'll live to see a reminder in our own cities of why Chemical Weapons were banned in the first place.
We can build a better leg, we can't build a better nervous system.Star Wars isn't real life, alas. You probably shouldn't use it to figure out what science can do.
Or the runner banned from the Olympics for his prosthetic limbs.Yes, wheelchairs also practically make you a cyborg, otherwise why wouldn't we see people in wheelchairs in the NFL?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/olympics/athletics/7141302.stm
Ive been laughing at the words "muh ability to heal" all day.It doesn't make any sense from any kind of angle, but there's no point in thinking too deeply about that, because like everything else Golem's said, it's completely retarded.
who cant do like half the exercises in the gym without immense pain, because of some long ago basic af accident
Yes, wheelchairs also practically make you a cyborg, otherwise why wouldn't we see people in wheelchairs in the NFL?The NFL is a hoax, like pro wrestling. Regardless I don't think they will allow this bad boy anytime soon.
Depleted uranium is depleted of radioactivity and therefore not chemical weapon. You can ask Pentagon million times and this is the answer they'll always give you.
Imagine if they told you simple truth that depleted uranium is actual nuclear waste from nuclear powerplants which makes it extremely cheap plus it is very effective at breaking thick armor. Cheap and effective, better lie about it not being environmental hazard just like Ruskies lie about Sarin attacks in Syria. Because coating missile in radioactive waste isn't like spreading radioactive waste all over the place.
Please stop with chlorine gas nonsense, no one capable is using that shit, this isn't WWI anymore. Reasons being it stinks and is yellow-green color therefore kinda easy to spot. Sarin is 500 times more effective, odorless and colourless. I dunno why Assad ever used chlorine when he has access to Russian produced Sarin.
We westerners aren't the good guys, our governments are just there for the cash to be made, or for influence games.These aren't mutually exclusive :^)
I dunno why Assad ever used chlorine when he has access to Russian produced Sarin.Because he didn't. Why would he do a chemical strike when he knows what it'll lead to? It's a false flag op by his opposition, Assad isn't going to use chemical weapons for the lulz (he's been doing a good job of killing far more civilians in a civilized, conventional manner) when he knows he'll get his shit bombed by NATO -- for absolutely no benefit. Meanwhile for his enemies in the region, all they have to do is spill some chemicals to call down a few hundred cruise missiles on Assad.
The minorities are ruining my life so much I had to shovel a rink on the lake and spend the weekend skating and drinking beer.
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Oberyn was right. We've made a terrible mistake.
...while the CIA program ultimately failed in its objective of removing Assad from power, it was hardly "bootless": "The program pumped many hundreds of millions of dollars to many dozens of militia groups. One knowledgeable official estimates that the CIA-backed fighters may have killed or wounded 100,000 Syrian soldiers and their allies over the past four years."
Trump notoriously eager to be more deeply involved in Middle-Eastern conflicts, and equally-famous for being eager to worsen relations with Russia.
I dont agree with the conspiracy theorists on this one. For it to be faked by Syrian rebels you have to rely on France, UK and US intelligence all independently reaching the same wrong conclusion, for it to be faked by one of the western powers lying to the others that relies on the others not noticing or caring that they've been tricked into taking military action or being convinced enough by their own intelligence that it was genuine. And there's no benefit for the nations taking part. If the agenda was trying to oust Assad or change the course of the war the strikes were never going to achieve that.
So what's the agenda? What's the big hidden benefit for Trump, Macron and May to fire missiles at just a couple of sites in the territory of a Russian ally? The only bonus outcome I'm seeing is that Jeremy Corbyn's reaction is losing any vestiges of support from his party and the general public.
So there's that secret agenda, or the obvious fact that the entrenched militants in Douma surrendered within 24 hours of the chemical attack. Hmmm, why would Assad possibly use chemical weapons...
@Oberyn Maybe you should stop following what the situation was 'for YEARS' then and follow what the situation is right now. The West has basically given up trying to remove Assad from power
I do give a shit that an unstable country is producing and stockpiling these weapons. A country that nearly fell under full IS control. You dont need to be an edge-lord to know that's a bad thing.
I'm sure all the militia rebel "commanders" that would've been at the peace table and the government afterwards are all humanist progressives with a deep commitment to multicultural democratic rule, lol.Well, obviously. The west wouldn't be backing them if the militia commanders hadn't passed the written democracy test with flying colors.
When you spill milk do you grab a cloth or do you just stare gormlessly at the milk and muse on the historical context and chain of events that inevitably led to this mess, and all the different outcomes if you could only go back in time, as the milk slowly drips onto your lap?
Maybe you're also helpful if someone else tries to clean it up for you "Oh, oh how precious, you grab a cloth now but you didn't grab one whilst the milk was in the process of falling or whilst I was about to spill it", or "Oh you'll clean milk but you wont pay my rent for me! Also how can you be thinking about milk whilst MILLIONS of refugees are continuously entering Europe every single minute?!?!".
"President Trump, we have reports of a Chemical attack in Syria"
"I can't believe that the previous administration interfered in Syria trying to depose Assad!"
"... yeah... so about this attack?"
"Just think about all these different outcomes if only we could go back in time..."
"... are we going to do anything?"
"All these different outcomes..."
Yeah, you're really working for the betterment of mankind Oberyn xD Captain Hindsight over here. Help me out here, I'm hungry now what should I have had for breakfast last Tuesday?
Well that's fun, I just want to point out H.R. 5373 2018 got introduced last month. Asheram you should write Scott Peters and tell him he is a good boy.http://www.nwherald.com/2015/04/30/holiday-hills-shooting-scott-peters-found-guilty-of-attempted-murder/awnt6ua/
Ok, thanks for the interlude, proceed with the squabbles.
The traditional definition of U.S. interests in the Middle East has centered on ensuring the free flow of natural resources and maintaining relationships with key allies and protecting them from external threats, in part to ensure access for U.S. military operations.
The political arrangements of the Middle East look vastly different now than they did when President Barack Obama took office. Popular uprisings in Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Syria, Bahrain and Yemen, three of which evolved into civil wars, have altered the landscape. These have resulted in occasional opportunities... But more often, this tumult has strained relations between the United States and its partners. This is largely attributable to Middle Eastern allies’ reduced faith in the U.S. security commitment... In the eyes of Arab rulers, not intervening to save Egypt’s president Hosni Mubarak, chastising Bahrain for its crackdown on Pearl Square demonstrators, intervening in Libya’s 2011 civil war without a plan for postwar stabilization, allowing the chemical weapons red line in Syria to be crossed without going to war against the Assad regime, and ultimately concluding a nuclear deal with Iran are all evidence of the same sin: abandonment. It is hard to overstate how strained relations became with Ankara, Jerusalem, Cairo, and Riyadh in the second term of the Obama administration. Turkey alleged U.S. involvement in a coup against the government, felt betrayed by the United States partnering with Kurdish forces in Syria, and has now taken to coordinating its own cross-border operations with Russia. Israel publicly opposed the Iran nuclear deal... Riyadh mounted a military campaign in Yemen against U.S. urging and has prosecuted it in a way that Washington considers escalatory. And Egypt accused the previous American administration of cozying up to the Muslim Brotherhood while failing to recognize the legitimacy of the 2013 “corrective revolution.” These partnerships have always been rocky... But whether the state of relations between Washington and Middle Eastern capitals is at an exceptionally low point or not, it is objectively poor.
The role of building partner capacity, while grinding and often uncelebrated, is crucial for addressing another key challenge: assuring American allies that the United States remains committed to their security. What the Saudi-led operation in Yemen, UAE involvement in Libya, and Turkish operations in Syria should teach us is that in the absence of American actions that signal a commitment to partner security, local actors will deploy their military forces in ways that will sometimes be escalatory and threaten to draw the United States into broader conflicts... investing in reassurance ...is about mitigating the potential for independent action that undermines U.S. interests ...avoiding substantial involvement in the region, however appealing, is not likely to be possible, and the U.S. military needs to be ready for such contingencies. In such cases, both past experience and ongoing changes in the strategic landscape of the region argue in favor of military interventions that are limited in scale and modest in ambition.
The sad reality of international relations is that interests trump humanitarianism. The Security Council has deliberated, released statements and resolutions, and watched on as numerous cases of crimes against humanity came before it. Assad is not the first despot to inflict egregious crimes against his own people, and seemingly get away with it. When it serves the interest of a great power, morality is a footnote. And Russia is not the only party to the game—it is the standard conduct of all great powers.
If it is solely for humanitarian purposes, the United States will abstain every day of the week. It is necessary, thus, to determine what America’s interests are in the Syrian civil war, which remain unclear. Obama’s failure is not in that he has refused to intervene, but that, after five years of war, he has yet to clearly articulate what America’s interests are in this war.
very good post redacted for sake of preventing eye-rape
did you mean that there existed no solid plan for Syrian regime change under the Trump administration? or no solid plan under Obama?Both. There were certainly government officials and NGO talking heads saying "hey we should do this" but they had no plan beyond arming Syrian rebel groups. We couldn't even decide properly at the time who to arm, and it's far too late now.
also (and i actually dont remember) what was Bremmer's major fuckup? was it something to do with essentially cleansing Baghdad and surrounding area of its Sunni population in Iraq War 2.5 in an effort to empower the new Shi'a leadership even though a large stated goal was, as always since '79, limiting the influence of Iran? like holy fuck boys why would you support a bunch of Shi'a militias genocide against the local Sunni and expect the Sunni to be ok with it and also the Shi'a to bend over and be good puppets. ain't like Iran is the de-facto religious leadership of the Shi'a or anything nah, those Mullahs ain't shit right?That's basically right, the process of "de-Ba'athification" that Bremer oversaw largely created the insurgency with the stroke of a pen. The Ba'athists were forced underground and took the Sunni community with them.
Media coverage of these events is its own reward for media companies, things that trigger an emotional response in the average consumer of news media, like gassed children, generate interest, discussion, and ad revenue. The media doesn't need an ulterior motive, they'll pump up whatever story leads them to cash, and dead kids makes people click.
If you're dead set on your milk metaphors, then it is entirely accurate to say that this milk was spilled several years ago by a different President. Except the milk glass is bottomless and has been pumping milk into our dining room continuously all those years. Also the milk is actually piss. We are now up to our eyes in piss. It is at this moment that news media looks in the window and says my God! There's a puddle of piss on the dining room floor, won't someone think of the children? We grab an air-to-surface mop and begin to fruitlessly swish it about in our dining room full of piss.
If the crux of that post is to inform me that Trump wanted to show he'll follow through and actually take action, that's what I have been saying. I found it refreshing that for once words translated into action, we don't all subscribe to the school of though that just cos the old President wouldnt act the new one should never act and just watch the milk run. It's hardly a hidden ulterior motive, I'd even say fairly explicit in the action that was taken that this was a statement to the whole region or possibly wider. I'm glad you aren't in the camp of the chemical-weapon deniers, rebel-blamers or Oberyns trying to convince himself that Trump planned to replace Assad with strikes on a couple of facilities.
As your prize for being so much smarter than me I invite you to take up your rightful place on the underside of my shoe. It's where all the things that 'know better' than me are permitted to live.
And conveniently the usual suspects online are pushing the pro-Russia narrative.
I think I have a healthy amount of suspicion over conspiracy theories that would require the collaboration of multiple western nations and possibly UN for very little gain, where the alternative narrative would coincidentally be incredibly convenient for... only Russia + friends. And conveniently the usual suspects online are pushing the pro-Russia narrative.
I will read the articles, but I cba to check their sources right now. What I will say is that I'm coming into these articles about why the US shouldnt have interfered with the understanding that this site even describes itself with the following:
"Our goal is to unite the libertarian movement, and more importantly, to realign American politics — prioritizing opposition to the worst of state power: the permanent war state, the prison and police states, and corporate welfare, corrupt contracts, and bank bailouts that rig the economy for the political class. The Libertarian Institute’s mission is to prioritize these issues and work with other groups from across the political spectrum against the greatest of abuses by the State. The Libertarian Institute is a nonprofit, 501(c)(3) organization formed in association with Taxpayer Education Foundation."
I can't imagine then writing an article applauding Trump's military action, frankly under any circumstances.
Nah, I consider the potential agendas of both sides of the story and see that the West doesn't profit hugely in any way from attacking Syrian compounds whether a gas attack happened or not.
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More reporters, photographers and cops there than actual KKK neo-chocolate chip cookie bundle of stickss. Sad, demand for scary hwhite supremacists far exceeds the supply.
Get a million of them with a million type-writers, and you could create the next Great American Novel. Eventually.
Dude is double or tripple agent. At 2:25 he says how you need to suppress capitalism to save the country from communism lmao
gay cakes
Lanny Davis, attorney for Michael Cohen, tells @maddow that his client has information that should be of interest to the special counsel and is "more than happy to tell the special counsel all that he knows.
wassup ni🅱️🅱️az
Some shit going down with all of Trumps peeps lately huh?
A couple of his closest (former associates) all pleading guilty or convicted:
National Security Advisor Michael Flynn - pleaded guilty.
President Trump's Personal Attorney Michael Cohen - pleaded guilty.
Foreign Policy Advisor George Papadopoulos - pleaded guilty.
Deputy Campaign Chairman Richard Gates - pleaded guilty.
Campaign Chairman Paul Manafort - convicted on 8 Federal counts.
The biggest one here being his former personal attorney Cohen, who is ready to spill all the beans on Trump to Mr. Mueller:
This is better than House of Cards.
Discuss
wassup ni🅱️🅱️az
Some shit going down with all of Trumps peeps lately huh?
A couple of his closest (former associates) all pleading guilty or convicted:
National Security Advisor Michael Flynn - pleaded guilty.
President Trump's Personal Attorney Michael Cohen - pleaded guilty.
Foreign Policy Advisor George Papadopoulos - pleaded guilty.
Deputy Campaign Chairman Richard Gates - pleaded guilty.
Campaign Chairman Paul Manafort - convicted on 8 Federal counts.
The biggest one here being his former personal attorney Cohen, who is ready to spill all the beans on Trump to Mr. Mueller:
This is better than House of Cards.
Discuss
this isn't really my area of interest, but as far as i understand, charges against Cohen and the plea deal are related to campaign finance n' shit with the pornstar payoff, right?
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/24/longtime-trump-organization-cfo-weisselberg-granted-immunity-in-cohen-probe-dj-citing-sources.html
Seems like more Trump people are ready to snitch
"On Thursday, Trump friend David Pecker, chairman of publishing giant American Media Inc., received immunity as part of the Cohen investigation.
Pecker shared information with prosecutors about the payments to former Playboy model Karen McDougal and porn star Stormy Daniels in exchange for immunity, including details about the president's knowledge of the payments. The White House denies Trump had affairs with the women."
"On Thursday, Trump friend David Pecker
Man fired for farting at work.
https://mashable.com/2018/08/23/paul-flart-fart-videos-fired/#pOqBsP7PQOqm
if you think you are free just because you are allowed to carry firearms, you are fucking delusional. if it was written in the constitution that it is every americans right to stare into the sun for 2 hours, every single one of you would be blind. i bet your firetrucks is full of jet-fuel and not water. you believe in fighting fire with fire. years of manipulation and control have degraded your minds. you are perfect tools for the powers that be. you have become stupid.
if you think you are free just because you are allowed to carry firearms, you are fucking delusional. if it was written in the constitution that it is every americans right to stare into the sun for 2 hours, every single one of you would be blind. i bet your firetrucks is full of jet-fuel and not water. you believe in fighting fire with fire. years of manipulation and control have degraded your minds. you are perfect tools for the powers that be. you have become stupid.jokes on u IDIOT cos jet fuel cant melt steel beams!!!!11111111111111111111111111111111111111111
Black dudes getting killed by the police every day in the USA, this one is being used for the election campaign. In the USA, nothing is sacred.
that would explain the random piles of bricks (always accompanied by at least two traffic cones) that somehow appear close to bigger riots, with no sign of a construction site nearbylol yep and not just that also in those stackable recycling bins strategically placed on nyc corners.
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shit is getting fucking grizzly over there
https://hoodsite.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/graphic-white-man-dies-trying-protect-business-looters-dallas.mp4?_=1 (https://hoodsite.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/graphic-white-man-dies-trying-protect-business-looters-dallas.mp4?_=1)
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes, running towards a mob with a sword is one of em