Author Topic: Meanwhile in USA  (Read 71874 times)

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Offline Sandersson Jankins

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #660 on: April 14, 2018, 09:34:04 am »
0
if you pay attention you can see how popular movies in the US get ruined by *most likley* CIA influence on hollywood.

example #1 alien vs aliens: alien.. no us miltary presence, aliens.. heavy us military presence

example #2 AlienvsPredator(AVP) vs AlienVsPredator Requeim(AVP requeim): AVP.. no us military, AVP reqeuiem.. heavy us military presence

example #3 28 days later vs 28 weeks later: 28 days later.. no us military presence (anti miltary aspects), 28 weeks later.. heavy military presence (pro military aspects)

example #4 pacific rim(PR) vs pacific rim 2(PR2):  PR.. anti authoritarian plot; just monster vs robots, PR2.. proauthoritarian plot, heavy us military presence.

I could go on, but why in a country where we are supposed to be free from our own governments propaghanda we have too deal with this kind of shit.

also feel free to add to the list.

the very first time i've agreed with anything you've posted- Zero Dark Thirty is the most obvious example of mil-ind propaganda, but there are plenty. a guy from the UK does a whole lot of analysis on intelligence shops' influence on media like film. he's pretty great, although his topics of focus sometimes frustrate me as he's a really intelligent, driven guy that never got over his childhood James Bond fascination. he would nail a lot of shit in the terror war and other topics but he sticks to strictly proven or reasonably speculative spook shit, mostly. https://www.spyculture.com/podcast/
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Offline Leshma

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #661 on: April 14, 2018, 02:01:04 pm »
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Syria is reciving more Freedom as we speak. Thank God for Freedom!

Edit: It's funny because I overslept this morning and had a dream about nasty alien invasion, some sort of shape shifters having enourmous physical power with rabbid dogs as their sidekicks. Bunch of alien planes on the sky, people running everywhere. Going to underworld tunnels, children being ripped by said dogs all over the place. Sureal dream, kinda like War of the Worlds set. Must be PTSD from previous events I've already encountered.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2018, 02:08:45 pm by Leshma »

Offline Gravoth_iii

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #662 on: April 14, 2018, 03:03:28 pm »
+1
Syria is reciving more Freedom as we speak. Thank God for Freedom!

Edit: It's funny because I overslept this morning and had a dream about nasty alien invasion, some sort of shape shifters having enourmous physical power with rabbid dogs as their sidekicks. Bunch of alien planes on the sky, people running everywhere. Going to underworld tunnels, children being ripped by said dogs all over the place. Sureal dream, kinda like War of the Worlds set. Must be PTSD from previous events I've already encountered.

I dreamt i gave birth through my asshole.
Paprika: ...the Internet and dreams are similar. They're areas where the repressed conscious mind escapes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VXQSs1Qfcc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LW6y-kgKtA
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Offline Bittersteel

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #663 on: April 14, 2018, 03:09:24 pm »
+2
I dreamt i gave birth through my asshole.

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Offline Westwood

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #664 on: April 14, 2018, 11:38:11 pm »
+1
zip zop
zoopity bop
But why does it matter? It's a given that our military will have some sort of PR apparatus, and in a cesspool culture that places inordinate value on entertainment flicks this PR scheme very likely includes partial funding of the odd media project that portrays the military in a positive light. Wasteful, perhaps, but hardly insidious. The vast majority of entertainment media still portrays the military negatively or at least without realism, if anything causing a vast net increase in the civil-military divide (possibly one of the biggest challenges facing our military this century tbh). If some glow-in-the-dark friend needs to visit the Shekelstein film studio and drop off some cash for the average mutt to learn what an MRAP is then I guess that's just the gay world we live in. Myself personally, I'm much more spooked by what the entertainment industry as a whole supposedly does for free than what our spooks allegedly pay it to do.

I'm not even sure if I'd call these alleged marketing efforts "propaganda" (though I've admittedly only seen Alien and Aliens out of all of those movies), but by the way http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/07/14/u-s-repeals-propaganda-ban-spreads-government-made-news-to-americans/
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Offline Drunken_sailor

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #665 on: April 15, 2018, 04:51:36 am »
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Mostly I'm mad becuase they ruin good movies.
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Offline Asheram

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #666 on: April 15, 2018, 05:01:59 am »
+1
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Offline Sandersson Jankins

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #667 on: April 15, 2018, 06:11:04 am »
+1
But why does it matter? It's a given that our military will have some sort of PR apparatus, and in a cesspool culture that places inordinate value on entertainment flicks this PR scheme very likely includes partial funding of the odd media project that portrays the military in a positive light. Wasteful, perhaps, but hardly insidious. The vast majority of entertainment media still portrays the military negatively or at least without realism, if anything causing a vast net increase in the civil-military divide (possibly one of the biggest challenges facing our military this century tbh). If some glow-in-the-dark friend needs to visit the Shekelstein film studio and drop off some cash for the average mutt to learn what an MRAP is then I guess that's just the gay world we live in. Myself personally, I'm much more spooked by what the entertainment industry as a whole supposedly does for free than what our spooks allegedly pay it to do.

I'm not even sure if I'd call these alleged marketing efforts "propaganda" (though I've admittedly only seen Alien and Aliens out of all of those movies), but by the way http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/07/14/u-s-repeals-propaganda-ban-spreads-government-made-news-to-americans/

good points as always- and important to make distinction between fairly innocuous spook shit and REAL spook shit, u knawmean? i would do well to remember that.

a small counterexample: the film United 93 came out in 2005; the air traffic controller scenes weren't actually scripted per se. they were like, semi-improv with Pentagon bois sitting in and coaching the actors. the biggest discrepancy is the ATC guys in the movie being calm, cool, and collected but totally blindsided, ignorant, and helpless (and thusly absolved of all potential guilt or responsibility) when in reality there are several statements from .mil officers claiming that ATC was aware of the hi-jacked plane, and either was absolutely negligent (SOP for reporting a plane hijacking at that time was literally 1 minute delay if the frontline ATC guy can't "fix it") in reporting to NORAD.

for a much better and more fleshed-out analysis: https://www.spyculture.com/clandestime-080-united-93/

its only 25 mins or so, pretty interesting listen.

i don't agree that most media depicts the military poorly- could you give me some examples there?
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Offline Westwood

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #668 on: April 15, 2018, 08:37:36 am »
+3
i don't agree that most media depicts the military poorly- could you give me some examples there?
Avatar, the highest grossing movie of all time, is a decent example off the top of my head. If you saw it you may recall the grizzled hardass villain trampling upon the poor indigenes and their quaint way of life in service to corporate greed. The (disabled) protagonist goes native and must defeat the militant, imperialistic, evil whites humans with the help of a diverse band of his fellow turncoats, scientists (I fcking love science btw), and tall blue niggas that probably smoke a lot of grass and get along really well with animals and shit. Our hero naturally faces additional adversity from the warrior class of tall blue niggas, who take umbrage at an outsider culturally enriching their princess like the bigoted jarheads they are. These are tropes you often see repeated, no? In science-fiction and fantasy, aren't military organizations usually depicted as backwards, incompetent, overreaching? War films sometimes glorify their subject matter but I can think of more that focus on depravity and pacifist messaging than otherwise. These are the depictions that people like Archibot enjoy, and by reinforcing them a movie studio can make something culturally relevant (maybe even woke) that talking heads will write about and encourage people to see. I have no problem* with any of this by the way, I don't watch movies often and even many of the few I like are decidedly anti-war or anti-military in tone, I just think media more often portrays military matters negatively than positively.

Entertainment media being such a huge part of the way people understand the world and conceptualize real-life situations is what I find unfortunate.

*
(click to show/hide)

Mostly I'm mad becuase they ruin good movies.
I think the last good movie I saw was No Country for Old Men tbh and that was a decade ago
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Offline Sandersson Jankins

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #669 on: April 15, 2018, 10:40:27 am »
+2
Avatar, the highest grossing movie of all time, is a decent example off the top of my head. If you saw it you may recall the grizzled hardass villain trampling upon the poor indigenes and their quaint way of life in service to corporate greed. The (disabled) protagonist goes native and must defeat the militant, imperialistic, evil whites humans with the help of a diverse band of his fellow turncoats, scientists (I fcking love science btw), and tall blue niggas that probably smoke a lot of grass and get along really well with animals and shit. Our hero naturally faces additional adversity from the warrior class of tall blue niggas, who take umbrage at an outsider culturally enriching their princess like the bigoted jarheads they are. These are tropes you often see repeated, no? In science-fiction and fantasy, aren't military organizations usually depicted as backwards, incompetent, overreaching? War films sometimes glorify their subject matter but I can think of more that focus on depravity and pacifist messaging than otherwise. These are the depictions that people like Archibot enjoy, and by reinforcing them a movie studio can make something culturally relevant (maybe even woke) that talking heads will write about and encourage people to see. I have no problem* with any of this by the way, I don't watch movies often and even many of the few I like are decidedly anti-war or anti-military in tone, I just think media more often portrays military matters negatively than positively.

Entertainment media being such a huge part of the way people understand the world and conceptualize real-life situations is what I find unfortunate.

*
(click to show/hide)
I think the last good movie I saw was No Country for Old Men tbh and that was a decade ago

ah, i getcha. point taken; makes me wonder if the script/plot was focus-grouped to tap into that cultural zeitgest in order to rake in those bucks or if they just decided to hatchet-job Pocahantas' tale because lol why not thats easy and HOLY SHIT LOOK AT THE MONEY WE ARE MAKING

off-topic, but you might really enjoy this book. if you've ever read Moon is a Harsh Mistress by Heinlein it is similar. a lot of realistic lampooning of "disability acceptance" and other social justice movements in addition to the lovely space ancap fever dream fantasy
https://www.amazon.com/Powers-Earth-Aristillus-Book-ebook/dp/B005JPPMS6

furthermore Sam Hyde is, as always, very prescient:

skip to 6:00 if you'd like. "The west’s sick addiction to fossil fuel ss going to make this planet uninhabitable for the future generations. Uhh. You’ll know what I’m talking about if you’ve seen the movie “An Inconvenient Truth”. It’s essentially what’s going on is we’re too selfish, and we’re driving our cars too much, and that’s getting nature out of the picture.

Now we looked at the data, we looked at the data, and what we found surprised us. What we found, right there, what we found was that culture is a sewer. We’ve got lewd media. We’ve got nasty bedroom things on TV. And they’re sexualizing young girls, and it’s getting to the point where even I have a problem with it. And that, it shouldn’t be that way.

Folks, we’re all world citizens. Is there another…? There we go. We’re all world citizens, living together, with one social contract, one economic future, we’re all tied together. There’s no more individual anymore, it’s just the hive. So we have to stick together. We have to stick together, and learn how to share. We have to learn how to share.

Now studies show that we work hard. It’s true. Everybody in this room’s a hard worker. You’re a hard worker, you’re a hard worker, you’re a hard worker. I know cuz you’re here, okay? But studies show that we don’t play hard enough. We gotta play harder! It’s, because "it’s that sense of childlike playing, ehh, that’s gonna save us in the end"- Albert Einstein.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 01:45:40 pm by Sandersson Jankins »
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Offline SixThumbs

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #670 on: April 15, 2018, 04:42:18 pm »
+1
Part of the civilian/military divide is because the military encourages looking down on "dirty, nasty, disgusting" civilians. Another part is the consequence of an endless war on terror which has come to a proxy war for resources and pipelines. I do agree on the smut that passes for mainstream entertainment but the military basically only lets you use their toys and equipment if you shed a positive light on the institution.
And how!

Offline Drunken_sailor

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #671 on: April 15, 2018, 05:35:01 pm »
+1
I think the last good movie I saw was No Country for Old Men tbh and that was a decade ago

Dunkirik was good also pro military

Part of the civilian/military divide is because the military encourages looking down on "dirty, nasty, disgusting" civilians. Another part is the consequence of an endless

I disagree, the military does not encourage your to look down on civilians, they do try to convince you it easier to be in the military than to go back to being a civilian.  being enlisted is a very tight nit society, which can be mistaken for snobish eliteism.  The majority of military members eat-live-sleep-work-play ect with other military personel because of the demanding nature of the job.

Avatar was just a Dances with wolves rip off.  The movies are a much better medium for showing military as evil, the discipline and orginization can be visually intense and scare most people.  For realism in military you have to read books, they are much better at portraying the good and bad sides as well as the subtle balance between people who are in the military becuase it is a job and those who are there because they are intesley patriotic.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 05:45:59 pm by Drunken_sailor »
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Offline Leshma

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #672 on: April 15, 2018, 08:47:21 pm »
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Or can't find any other job. By far the dumbest people I've met belonged to military and police enforcement. Policemen are worse and sticking together is more prouncenced among them. They are also more corrupt than army officers.

I'm surrounded by former military types, because I live in a building which was intended for military personnel. Bunch of retired generals and colonels are my neighbours. There's atomic shelter beneath me as well, relic of previous cold war.

Avatar was popular because it was technically well done, nothing to do with storyline.

Military/police are just dumb people given power. They aren't necessary evil, their evil actions comes from their stupoidity. Truly evil people are politicians and those who join secret service. They are nasty folks. Half criminals, half politicians, think of Putin and you've got the picture.

At leasts how it works in (former) commie state.

Offline SixThumbs

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #673 on: April 15, 2018, 09:49:24 pm »
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Boot camp is literally about stripping away individuality to fit into a hierarchical structure and obeying orders from the top-down based mostly on time spent in the apparatus. The first thing they want out of your head is that you're not a dirty civilian anymore and their rules are no longer your rules. You don't need to be patriotic, mostly you need to have run out of options and opportunities elsewhere in society; serving the country, or at least Joe on the street, is probably the last thing you end up doing any good for.
And how!

Offline Westwood

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Re: Meanwhile in USA
« Reply #674 on: April 15, 2018, 10:20:52 pm »
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Part of the civilian/military divide is because the military encourages looking down on "dirty, nasty, disgusting" civilians. Another part is the consequence of an endless war on terror which has come to a proxy war for resources and pipelines. I do agree on the smut that passes for mainstream entertainment but the military basically only lets you use their toys and equipment if you shed a positive light on the institution.
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There's nothing wrong with wars for resources, they're an important part of the human experience and we've divided finite resources through them for millennia. Proxy wars are a natural consequence of the concentration of global power in two or more nations and always have been, but especially since the Peace of Westphalia, like everything else.

Or can't find any other job. By far the dumbest people I've met belonged to military and police enforcement.
Funny, the dumbest people I've met have been the software slaves that congregate around Jeff Bezos' giant balls. Materially knowledgeable and satisfied, but always like deer in headlights in any situation other than clickity-clack codewriting or Seattle Sounders games. Maybe that's just attributable to there being more of them where I live than where you live, eh?

furthermore Sam Hyde is, as always, very prescient
I still think that Ted talk bit is some of the best content he's put out, I hated that pretentious savior-complex shit. His lampooning of it was perfect.
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