Author Topic: [NEW] Commander Mode  (Read 10801 times)

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Offline Ronin

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #45 on: May 18, 2013, 03:47:07 pm »
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After going through the stats of nords, rhodoks and sarranids; some things I have noticed:

In general, ranged units has the best athletics values. Infantry has the second best, and of course cavalry has the third best athletics values.

Sarranids
-Have very good armors and weapons, but have very low power strike values. Their archers have 0 and their inf/cav has 3. What they lack in stats, they make up with their equipments though.
-Their units have lower athletics compared to nord and rhodoks.
-Their infantry and cavalry uses spears and one handed swords.
-Their archers' rate of fire is quite good too, and have good armor to keep them alive. Also they use barbed arrows, horn bows or nomad bows. Can spawn with a knockdown weapon.
-One thing to mention, their infantry can use jarids.

-What makes this faction good is their equipment mostly. They have very good armors, good weapons, their cavalry rides destriers and overall their unit setup can support each other nice.


Rhodoks
-Their crossbowmen are simply perfect. They use sniper crossbows, military picks, military hammers, medium armor and high tier pavise shields. They have 4 power strike, which is better than sarranid infantry. Looks a bit OP probably, but their weakness is their rate of fire and the required stationaryness of crossbows. Can be susceptible to cavalry charges (they eat nord scouts alive though).
-They have very strong infantry as well.
-Their cavalry has the same stats as nord scouts, but they use light lances instead of war spears  and they don't have javelins (hardly matters anyway).

-Seem like the best on paper, but they rely on stat strength  in my opinion. Their weakness is they have weak cavalry and vulnerable crossbowmen (while reloading, due to AI behaviour). Might be better than nords, but I believe they are evenly matched towards sarranids.

Nords
-They have very strong infantry, which can also use throwing weapons. They can spawn with a knockdown weapon.
-Their archers use longbows, but they don't have enough archery skill to handle those bows. They suffer highly from rate of fire and accuracy. They use long bows and bodkin arrows.
-Their archers can use two handed axes and have very good melee stats. What they lack in archery, they can make up in close quarters.
-Very weak cavalry.

-Less useful archers combined with very weak cavalry makes this faction only competent at infantry charges, which; in my opinion, is a very straightforward strategy. They have the potential of becoming a strong infantry faction, but pure infantry tactics are bound to lose without proper ranged or cavalry support in my opinion. I think the problem with them is, their units do not supplement each other.


Edit: Didn't play with vaegirs yet, but I can imagine the rage in khergit games. The thing is; khergit horse archers have 150 archery, vaegirs have 140 archery, sarranids have 130 archery and nords have 120 archery. (xbow wpf works a bit differently to compare)
« Last Edit: May 18, 2013, 04:22:19 pm by Ronin »
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Seems the fascists are gaining ground once again in UKR... right vving politics is SO bad for the general populace but STILL in times of trouble the uneducated turn to them for help, simply because they are so amoral they vvill supply those vvilling to fight vvith vveapons rather than knovvledge.

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Offline Teeth

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #46 on: May 18, 2013, 03:49:43 pm »
+1
Why am I playing Nords vs Rhodoks all the time by the way? I have seen Sarranids quite a few times as well and Vaegirs once. Also, sometimes it weirdly stacks 4 against 6 players and that sort of crap.

Offline Ronin

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #47 on: May 18, 2013, 04:11:11 pm »
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There is one interesting thing I have found:

Every faction uses their face code, but sarranids use swadian face codes. (swadian_face_young_1, etc.)


Edit: Did anyone play with swadians, khergits or vaegirs so far? I have seen some interesting item usage: vaegir and swadian infantry have pikes in their item pools, and nomad bows for vaegir horseman. Seems interesting.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2013, 04:27:28 pm by Ronin »
Quote from: BlindGuy
Seems the fascists are gaining ground once again in UKR... right vving politics is SO bad for the general populace but STILL in times of trouble the uneducated turn to them for help, simply because they are so amoral they vvill supply those vvilling to fight vvith vveapons rather than knovvledge.

My UU key is broken incase you can't tell :D

Offline Drehar

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #48 on: May 18, 2013, 04:41:33 pm »
+2
Pro's
Large scale battles are fun

Con's
To win you wait for flags
Long matches make for bad multi's (This is why new siege is dead)
Repair costs
No custimization
No fighting


Offline Algarn

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #49 on: May 18, 2013, 05:16:10 pm »
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we need to be able to play with our char ... BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO PAY THIS PLATE AGAIN !!   :wink:
2000 gold gone :/

Offline Smoothrich

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #50 on: May 18, 2013, 05:37:07 pm »
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Why the hell can't we use weapons, not even things we pick up?  Kills the mode.  I totally loved the Fire and Sword commander mode because I felt like a sergeant of a pro pikesquad or a captain leading cav charges from the front and it was rather immersive.  I don't even understand why holding a weapon is disabled?  That's what we play this game for, the combat engine, silly devs!
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Offline chadz

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #51 on: May 18, 2013, 05:52:49 pm »
+10
Because one player can easily kill 20 or even more bots himself. It would totally move the focus away from the tactical game.


Offline Panos

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #52 on: May 18, 2013, 06:03:52 pm »
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chadz, I have two questions

1. on the troop menu, ranged has WPF for all classes, but melee-cav has one tab that says wp_melee 

E.G

Quote
"swadian_crossbowman_multiplayer_ai","Swadian Sharpshooter","Swadian Sharpshooters",tf_guarantee_ranged|tf_mounted|tf_guarantee_boots|tf_guarantee_armor|tf_guarantee_helmet,0,0,"fac_kingdom_1",
   ["itm_bolts","itm_arrows","itm_crossbow","itm_crossbow","itm_heavy_crossbow","itm_sword_medieval_b_small","itm_sword_medieval_a","itm_voulge","itm_tab_shield_heater_c",
    "itm_haubergeon","itm_sleeveless_mail_coat","itm_leather_boots","itm_mail_chausses","itm_kettle_hat","itm_helmet_with_neckguard","itm_leather_gloves"],
   str_14 | agi_10 | int_4 | cha_4|level(24),wp_one_handed (100) | wp_two_handed (100) | wp_polearm (100) | wp_archery (100) | wp_crossbow (120) | wp_throwing (100),knows_common|knows_power_draw_3|knows_ironflesh_1|knows_power_strike_1|knows_athletics_2,swadian_face_middle_1, swadian_face_older_2],
 

AND

["swadian_infantry_multiplayer_ai","Swadian Infantry","Swadian Infantry",tf_guarantee_all_wo_ranged,0,0,"fac_kingdom_1",
   ["itm_pike","itm_bastard_sword_a","itm_tab_shield_heater_c",
    "itm_studded_leather_coat","itm_ankle_boots","itm_flat_topped_helmet"],
   def_attrib|level(19),wp_melee(105),knows_common|knows_ironflesh_5|knows_shield_4|knows_power_strike_5|knows_athletics_4,swadian_face_middle_1, swadian_face_old_2],


Is this a code that affects all melee skills (1h, 2h and poles) or something else??

and


2. The names of their equipment , are the Native ones, or the c-rpg ones??


edited for grammar correction  :mrgreen:
« Last Edit: May 18, 2013, 06:08:29 pm by Panos »
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Offline Tibe

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #53 on: May 18, 2013, 06:09:06 pm »
+1
Because one player can easily kill 20 or even more bots himself. It would totally move the focus away from the tactical game.
yea, but its painfully boring tbh. Nothing you can do about it thou. Its ze engine. I insanely loved the commander in NW. Cause charging like an insane commander there always ment you got shot in the face with a cannonball or turned into swish cheese, by a musketvolley. It was fun, tactical and you got to fight.

Offline chadz

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #54 on: May 18, 2013, 06:15:40 pm »
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def_attrib = str_7 | agi_5 | int_4 | cha_4
wp_melee = 1h/2h/polearm (but not exactly)
items are all from crpg

Offline Ronin

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #55 on: May 18, 2013, 06:16:06 pm »
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Please keep the commanders like this, a real commander does not fight like a regular soldier. The best way I've seen this implemented so far.

panos, wp melee effects only melee wpfs. Isn't it obvious :P


One question though,

When customizing troops do we take into account of PD/wpf penalties, HA/wpf penalties, armor penalties and such? Also the arrows being used weight 10 kilos and have the same ammo?
Quote from: BlindGuy
Seems the fascists are gaining ground once again in UKR... right vving politics is SO bad for the general populace but STILL in times of trouble the uneducated turn to them for help, simply because they are so amoral they vvill supply those vvilling to fight vvith vveapons rather than knovvledge.

My UU key is broken incase you can't tell :D

Offline Panos

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #56 on: May 18, 2013, 06:20:46 pm »
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def_attrib = str_7 | agi_5 | int_4 | cha_4
wp_melee = 1h/2h/polearm (but not exactly)
items are all from crpg

Danke, gonna give it ago and try to balance the troops   :mrgreen:



panos, wp melee effects only melee wpfs. Isn't it obvious :P


Better being safe than sorry  :wink:
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Offline Tydeus

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #57 on: May 18, 2013, 06:34:40 pm »
+1
Going to try and balance these factions out. Might be better to just create our own factions as suggested by Jacko. We have enough armor sets in crpg to come up with some custom themes. If that's the case, what are some themes people would be interested in(again, based only on what we already have in game)?
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Offline Thomek

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #58 on: May 18, 2013, 06:41:16 pm »
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Creating factions based on a pool of money would be interesting.. :) just sayin!

Or a hp vs armor pool.. I'm sure people would find "OP" combos quite fast, but then that could be balanced..
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Offline Bjord

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Re: [NEW] Commander Mode
« Reply #59 on: May 18, 2013, 07:14:31 pm »
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cool idea! would be fun if it would work properly like in NW. If you guys aren't already doing it, I'd suggest asking the devs of NW for some advice on how to do it.

also first!!!

I'd be ashamed for chadz if he ever asked anything from those cocksuckers at NW dev team. They have no taste for quality, no sense of direction. It's just a bunch of kiddies killing bots.
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