The cav problem, Induced by GK

[Protemus]

say whatever you want,I still demand blanket ban for all GK's for that raping yesterday

[Chagan_Arslan]

Do we... um... really upset you that much guys ? should we not do any teamwork would this help community ? should we let them kill us so they can finally get a smile on their face ?

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[Lactose_the_intolerant]

you dont seem to get. this is not purely about banner balancing clans together. but baner balancing class together

On one side we have mercs that gang up. They show a pretty good display of teamwork, there are some with an insane amount of skill.
But you can overcome them

On the other we have GK that gang the same class on one side + randoms. there are some skilled lancers but many of them are just another cavplayer lost in the mass taking advantage of the high mobility, bump damaging, one hitting lance all that covered by the constant sound of hooves...and that is just near impossible

[Torost]

I got raped by GK yesterday.. was sorta impossible to do anything, lances and head-seeking-arrows from every direction.

And thats ok.. they play to win..

What bothers me is that GKs teamplay no matter what team they are on.
They softplay eachother when on opposite teams. Not uncommon, many clans do this... and it is a shamefull practice.

The most frustrating part is when I work hard to take down a GKcav, dehorse him.
And one of my teammatesGK .. runs towards them ... to offer them their horse..and all my work was futile..since he is back up again on a full health horse.

I wont say that this is SOP..but I have seen it enough times in the past to distrust the GKs on my team when the main GKclan is on the other.

[CrazyCracka420]

I do not know how they are supposed to fix this balance thing though, because I reckon many people want to keep the clan banner balance. But I guess there is a solution to be found.

Also ranged being stacked should be fixed.

That's the problem is the banner balance.  Teams should TRY to balance by the banner, but only after first making sure that the classes are relatively even first.  If there's 30 cavalry on a server, and 25 of them are in the same clan, then at least 10 of them should be on the enemy team.   The team balance system is fucking shit and I've been (and others have been) saying it for a long time.

These are public servers after all...c-rpg is the only game I know that encourages pub stomps. 

[Joker86]

Then points I want to add to this discussion, as my first post got ignored by everyone except of Cracka:

1st: telling people to change their class (take a shield/spear) is absolutely inacceptable

2nd: yes, in other games a balanced army is best, but in cRPG, for various reasons, your army grows stronger the higher the percentage of archers and/or cavalry. That's a fact.

3rd: you can't expect random players to organize themselves and play in a team. At least not on short or medium term.

4th: why does the enemy team have to play tactically, but the cav stack has only to ride around and stab? 

5th: not only open plain maps are well suitable for cav. Town, forest and ruin maps often are even better

6th: the additional effectivity which is added by mounting a horse is balanced a tiny little bit by the riding skill investment, and the rest is balanced by upkeep. Then the devs decided to implement the marketplace... 

7th: the game mode is an additional problem, because it involves killing the entire enemy team. This leads to a lot of fail behaviour, and grants the more mobile and more flexible classes like archers and cavalry advantages over infantry.

8th: the developers completely ignored that teamplay part of cRPG. All they added was that shitty flag feature and those incredibly annoying sounds, which are totally worthless. Another reason to not expect teamplay on public servers

9th: it should indeed be possible to balance both by class and clan. I wrote down an example for a system here. It might be a little bit outdated (as the point of "faction balance" got implemented actually), but it should still be valid.

10th: please DO care about the fun of others, as it directly affects the fun YOU have.

Summary to my solution:

- implement class balance next to clan balance (it is possible)
- change the game mode to something which favours infantry more, like conquest
- add a commander feature which works well with random players
- balance cavalry another way than by upkeep, but without further nerfing it, the stats of both archers and cav are heavily UP. (Doesn't make them UP on the servers, though. Yes, it's complicated  )

[Hunter_the_Honourable]

a class balance would be better, so if there are 30 cav on one team they get split so its 15 on both teams, and what banner they have should have no effect on what side they go on because when one team has the clan that's stacking one team its never fun if the other team only has random people regardless of what clan is on the other. I don't really have a problem with GK's because

1. I'm a former GK ^^
2. I hardly play on EU_1 I play on smaller servers
3. I don't enjoy cRPG much anymore so I hardly play anymore 

even if your a hoplite its hard to take down more then 1 cav when around 5 are charging you because even if you stop one, the time you do that the next one will bump you then they all have a stabbing frenzy at you then even IF you survive they just repeat the process.

Just be happy that most gk are mediocre cav, they are annoying on mass but most of the cav players i really feared dont play much and are spread across the clans, its not like your facing leed tommy torben tuonela etc on the same team everyday :-P

Take away tommys fairy horse and his just a standard random cav player, Torben is better I guess but Id still fear the more unknown GK's more and tuonela.........isn't he like some guy from mercs or something? idk.

1. Heav lances were designed to not break, even great lances. This was only for jousting tournaments to reduce the impact and even to make the impact more effectful. However, that's realism and not balance.
2. Agreed.
3. I assume in the nerf direction, in which case only the Arabian. Others are fine.

For the first time ever I actually have to agree with bjord  *sigh* can't believe this........ his actually talking sense.........what the fuck is cRPG coming to? 

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

a class balance would be better, so if there are 30 cav on one team they get split so its 15 on both teams, and what banner they have should have no effect on what side they go on because when one team has the clan that's stacking one team its never fun if the other team only has random people regardless of what clan is on the other. I don't really have a problem with GK's because

1. I'm a former GK ^^
2. I hardly play on EU_1 I play on smaller servers
3. I don't enjoy cRPG much anymore so I hardly play anymore 
I'm grateful you hardly play anymore, now if we could just change that hardly to never.
even if your a hoplite its hard to take down more then 1 cav when around 5 are charging you because even if you stop one, the time you do that the next one will bump you then they all have a stabbing frenzy at you then even IF you survive they just repeat the process.
With a big amount of ath you can dodge most cav as an inf, and while yes, even as a hoplite it's extremely hard to do well against a GK style gank of lancers then it is still mostly easier than to survive a gank of equal size from melee players.
Take away tommys fairy horse and his just a standard random cav player, Torben is better I guess but Id still fear the more unknown GK's more and tuonela.........isn't he like some guy from mercs or something? idk.
This is pure bs and just you being to retarded to realize that the arabian really isn't that great, that destrier my old friends like you get to take half a guys health away in one bump even if you suck to hard to hit whith the lance, and that both the destrier and the arabian ain't got enough maneuver to really dodge arrows that great, I highly doubt any of the best cav could dodge more that many arrows from a guy like blackbow as all you need is a tiny amount of enemy prediction, to be shooting at medium or less range, and to be using arrows/bolts and not throwing weapons along with a decent aim and most guys dodges won't mean shit, TomMyyY is by far one of the best cav players out there and he could easily rape you and half of GK and you on a fucking sumpter if need be.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

4th: why does the enemy team have to play tactically, but the cav stack has only to ride around and stab? 

The main reason the GKs do well is in fact because they rely heavily on teamplay, one by one they gank every player in the enemy team, but first after quickly getting all the easy kills like bad archers, peasants, and afks at spawn... ...I recall countless times where I've hit a GK HA with a throwing lance only to have him W key as fast as he can out of there and quite a few GK HAs arriving to gank me, and if I hit any one of them, won't really change much unless I headshot, as they'll ride off as a slightly injured but still fully functional HA and another guy will arrive to shot at me.

[Hunter_the_Honourable]

-snip-

I forget how you suffer from a mental disability so I wont reply to your silly comments 

[Assarhaddon]

I was playing last night while this all happened, *snip*.. Last night as mentioned in the OP, the balance did however put all us GK's on the same team. Brilliant, I want to play together. It did also put maybe 3-4 other cav players on our team that I remember, most of whom weren't using a clan banner.

I was one of em .. and i have yet, not.. stopped.. laughing. 

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Cav dragoon unit riding under the cover dunes, thunder of hoofs echoes around the desert. Arrows flying, spears striking, death and chaos everywhere.

More serious note:
I was playing against the team that had "all cav" aswell, and our team won some, lost some. (No more than usual, neither way.)
Yet to see the problem as HUGE this post seems to paint.

[BattalGazi]

Apparently, we are an evil clan for some. I suggest them to open another topic like "GK-A" like AA and keep on whining there. I really wish this topic to come to a fair discussion ground, otherwise it is just becoming a fun topic for us.

And gentlemen, please before throwing poop at any other class, or claim it is easy mode, please try to play with it for a couple of weeks first. Otherwise you are just putting yourself in funny positions.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

I forget how you suffer from a mental disability so I wont reply to your silly comments 

I forgot that you're somewhat of a retard and will just post something like the above when you can't make up an actual reply.

[NejStark]

I recall countless times where I've hit a GK HA with a throwing lance only to have him W key as fast as he can out of there

nerf common sense

[Arrowblood]

I dont want to hear the  whine if someone creates a pure archer clan with only rusbow and bodkins. Or a piker clan or....