Why do we even need upkeep anymore?

[Frederick]

At an average of X2 modifier it has been found that you can support about 47K of crap, as opposed to pre-major patch that was 50K.

So for every multiplier, it is supposedly 23.5K

Hm... Where did i go wrong?

[Bobthehero]

How about a system which doesn't have any upkeep at all, but you have to invest skill points to exceed a certain value of equipment? This way we have all dice rolls removed, your performance ingame will be more predictable, and in theory you can run around with whatever equipment you want, AS LONG as you want. New players won't suffer so much from this system, and characters of same levels will have about the same power. Which is also better for auto"balance" calculations. Because players who decide to go without expensive equipment are rewarded with better skills and vice versa. Which means that you can ride around with your plated charger as long as you want, but because of a few spent skill points to increase your budget you will be crap once dismounted. Sounds fair to me.

Implying price = better gear.

[Tears of Destiny]

Hm... Where did i go wrong?

I dunno, you may have been right and the other people were wrong.

[Joker86]

Implying price = better gear.

What do you mean? (I am no native speaker)

[Leshma]

Joker is back, damn...

[Bobthehero]

What do you mean? (I am no native speaker)

Basically saying plate armor is not worth lower your character stats to wear.

[Joker86]

Joker is back, damn...

Yeah, sorry, you will have to bear my bossy postings again, unless you put me on your ignore list. 

Basically saying plate armor is not worth lower your character stats to wear.

Everyone needs to decide this for himself. In the end you can balance everything by changing the value anyway.

[Kophka]

I know it's fun to play a game that has no limitations on anything, but upkeep was introduced due to mob rule honestly.

Most of the people begged for some way to get rid of the "all plate/all day on an armored horse" thing that was a constant. Before that, everyone dressed the same, there was no variety in the game at all. It's sad to say, but the min/maxers brought it on themselves, and it worked great for awhile.

A little time had gone by, and people started finding ways around the limitation, so a new way to bring some variety and common sense into the game was made. This was the loved/hated slots patch. Min/maxers screamed bloody murder, and some innocent hybrids got hurt as well, but it's still pretty playable. Pocket pikes are a thing of the past, archers can't carry a huge melee weapon and be effective archers, and Cavalry can't lance you, switch to sword, then lance you again.

It didn't address the issue with the upkeep workarounds, so we are back to "all plate/all day" though armored horses are lot less common. So I wouldn't be surprised if another upkeep increase is incoming in the future, since min/maxers are going to be min/maxers, and nobody likes them.

In my opinion, (not that it's worth a crap ) it extends the longevity of this game that there are limitations to what you can do. Slots makes people plan their load-out instead of the best of everything, and upkeep keeps endgame gear semi-rare (or at least, it's supposed to).

[Joker86]

You know, my suggestion with the skills for value doesn't exclude two-slot-items or unsheathable weapons.

My idea is more or less the same like shortly after the upkeep patch was released, the topic is to be found here. If you mind you can read through it. Some parts are surely outdated, but most of it should still be valid, nonetheless.

Balancing would be accomplished by tweaking the ingame item values. (Which is not the same like the buying price - read my topic  ).


Especially that part with min/maxing you were speaking about would be taken care of with my suggestion, as you will (hopefully) see on the diagrams.

[Kafein]

I know it's fun to play a game that has no limitations on anything, but upkeep was introduced due to mob rule honestly.

Most of the people begged for some way to get rid of the "all plate/all day on an armored horse" thing that was a constant. Before that, everyone dressed the same, there was no variety in the game at all. It's sad to say, but the min/maxers brought it on themselves, and it worked great for awhile.

A little time had gone by, and people started finding ways around the limitation, so a new way to bring some variety and common sense into the game was made. This was the loved/hated slots patch. Min/maxers screamed bloody murder, and some innocent hybrids got hurt as well, but it's still pretty playable. Pocket pikes are a thing of the past, archers can't carry a huge melee weapon and be effective archers, and Cavalry can't lance you, switch to sword, then lance you again.

It didn't address the issue with the upkeep workarounds, so we are back to "all plate/all day" though armored horses are lot less common. So I wouldn't be surprised if another upkeep increase is incoming in the future, since min/maxers are going to be min/maxers, and nobody likes them.

In my opinion, (not that it's worth a crap ) it extends the longevity of this game that there are limitations to what you can do. Slots makes people plan their load-out instead of the best of everything, and upkeep keeps endgame gear semi-rare (or at least, it's supposed to).

Upkeep doesn't increase the longevity of the game. If you ask me it's more like the opposite. Before, you had to have patience to get that new piece of equipment you wanted. Now you can get everything very fast, but you are soft capped at 47,5k (afaik that's the break even value with 50% win rate). Going over that is temporary. Before, the game remained undiscovered for people because each piece of equipment took hours or days to buy, and thus it was indeed longer than now. Now when you reach the gear you want to use roughly around 45k or less, that's it, you "finished" the game, it's pretty much like Native after that.

[chadz]

How about a system which doesn't have any upkeep at all, but you have to invest skill points to exceed a certain value of equipment? This way we have all dice rolls removed, your performance ingame will be more predictable, and in theory you can run around with whatever equipment you want, AS LONG as you want.

When you put it like that, it doesn't sound so horrible. Might consider it if we ever decide to completely change the game again

Upkeep doesn't increase the longevity of the game. If you ask me it's more like the opposite.

Wrong. cRPG was dying before the upkeep patch. We lost like 10 to 50 players per day. People lost interest in the senseless grind, new players left right away. That big patch has caused a boost in players, and kept the playerbase at a constant level since that day, more or less, with a bit of an longterm increase.

I has numbers to proof!

[Joker86]

I would be honoured if you brought up the time to have a short glance at my topic 


Regarding the long term motivation:

Can't you implement a big long quest story in Strat somehow, with items as rewards? You know, epic swords and shit. (WITHOUT magic attributes, of course). The collector's urge is a big motivation. Ask Blizzard 

[Corrado_Decimo]

When you put it like that, it doesn't sound so horrible. Might consider it if we ever decide to completely change the game again

oh no please... upkeep is fine. skill based equip will just screw the game. and once the builds are completed, we just go back like in 2010...

[Arrowblood]

i want upkeepless days.

[Gorath]

Implying price = better gear.

Oh Bob.  You are so silly.