Author Topic: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?  (Read 39285 times)

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Offline polkafranzi

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #300 on: September 10, 2011, 03:27:49 pm »
+1
i want upkeepless days.

epic idea.

Back when the devs were nice, dunno if you all remember, but there was like "double xp on siege" weeks and shit.  Little things go a long way.  Upkeepless Tuesdays ftw.
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Offline Corrado_Decimo

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #301 on: September 10, 2011, 04:12:36 pm »
+1
epic idea.

Back when the devs were nice, dunno if you all remember, but there was like "double xp on siege" weeks and shit.  Little things go a long way.  Upkeepless Tuesdays ftw.

but a lot of players will just play on tuesday to farm gold (and that day, new players will just see lots and lots of lolly tincans) the servers will be overpopulated, (with all the network lag problems).

nekkid battles were fun... i don't think upkeepless battles will bring the same fun.

Offline Frederick

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #302 on: September 10, 2011, 06:13:43 pm »
+1
Why not just establish a system where a player's strength attribute limits the maximum weight that all of his equipment combined can sustain. Such that, for example, a player with a strength level of 18 might theoretically be able to wear any piece armor he wanted, but he could by no means wear every piece of armor he wanted.

For a player to run around in fully plated armor carrying a large weapon or a sword and shield, that might require a strength of 30 [or more, this would need to be balanced and calibrated by the devs, but i find 30 to be a nice round number], which even at level 35 only gives them an agility of level 10 [for simplicity i'm ignoring skill-attribute conversion], which limits any agility-based skill to 3 at a maximum. Notice immediately that a player wanting to go full-armor could not simultaneously ride on a fully-armored horse.

If such a player wanted to specialize in polearm combat, he would be capped at 138. Whereas a player at level 35 who stopped at strength level 20 would have an agility of 20, and might have to limit himself to medium or medium-heavy armor, but would also have cavalry options that the previous player did not, likewise his wpf would give him a combat speed bonus.

Most players who had reached a maximum level would not choose to max-out on armor simply because of how difficult hitting other players would be with their slow movement speeds [high weight with low agility] and their slow attack speeds [low WM]

Players who want to use a heavy-armor and heavy-horse [warhorse, cataphract, or plated charger] combo will probably not be able to do it unless they find a particular armor combination, they might have to forgo a helmet or use a very light helmet, they might also/alternatively use lighter leg armor. Either of these would make them vulnerable to perceptive players who would see that their tin-can has a weakness and would exploit it.

An interesting alternative to this is to have a system whereby players with heavier armor [in weight terms] without the necessary strength would [due to being less able to support the weight of their armor] be 1. more likely to be knocked down by certain weapons 2. take longer to get up after being knocked down

If the devs coded this properly, most people very likely would not gravitate towards the heaviest armor, horses, and weapons, due to the opportunity costs being too great. All of which could be done without the accountancy of the upkeep system.

So what would the role of Heirlooms be in such a system? I envision heirlooms being equipment that imposes less of a weight penalty on the player [for the heaviest of armors] and-or being MORE EFFECTIVE for the same weight as a regular piece of equivalent equipment [for the less-heavy eqipment]. [and thus serving the same function] In other words, if a lordly set of medium-heavy armor has roughly the same defense capabilities as a regular set of standard heavy armor, and a lordly set of heavy-armor [i'm thinking plate armor] might have slightly more defense, but more importantly, lower weight.

One possible role for upkeep in such a system would be the penalty players have to pay over a period of time if they want their heirloom equipment to have those bonuses. [such upkeep would probably be greater than it is presently, since most players would not be using a full set of heirloom equipment]

If they do not maintain upkeep on the heirlooms, said heirlooms will not 'break' but will revert back to an inert state where their stats are equal to those of their regular counterparts. [an unfixed heirloom sword might be called a 'chipped masterwork sword' in order to differentiate it from a regular sword] This is similar to the principle of many RPGs where players must pay someone or something money in order to have their special weapons 'enchanted'


Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #303 on: September 10, 2011, 06:16:24 pm »
+1
So basically you want one more reason why Players should take strength, and ... not give another reason to take AGI as a balance?
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Offline Torp

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #304 on: September 10, 2011, 06:25:03 pm »
+2
but a lot of players will just play on tuesday to farm gold (and that day, new players will just see lots and lots of lolly tincans) the servers will be overpopulated, (with all the network lag problems).

nekkid battles were fun... i don't think upkeepless battles will bring the same fun.

if they made a no upkeep day, tehre shouldnt be any gold gain

Offline Formless

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #305 on: September 10, 2011, 06:31:43 pm »
+3
When you put it like that, it doesn't sound so horrible. Might consider it if we ever decide to completely change the game again :P

Wrong. cRPG was dying before the upkeep patch. We lost like 10 to 50 players per day. People lost interest in the senseless grind, new players left right away. That big patch has caused a boost in players, and kept the playerbase at a constant level since that day, more or less, with a bit of an longterm increase.

I has numbers to proof!

chadz is right and I remember CRPG the way it was before the major patch, crpg was dying, there were fewer and fewer players playing.  Most people that started soon got frustrated and left.  The big patch did save the game and the discount price on vanilla warband helped.  But while the patch did save the game it also drove some of the old players out (they got frustrated that all their previous work was invalidated and they could no longer wear their hard earned gear all the time).


As a gaming community its in our best interest to expand our player base.  My suggestion is to make leveling up as pain free as possible.  I am one of those guys that constantly creates new characters and there is nothing more painful then grinding to level 30.  I can just imagine some newcomer getting repeatedly mowed down by a high level character over and over again for hours at an end and only seeing a slow progression in performance in exchange. How frustrating.  Make the leveling up from level 20 to 30 the same as leveling up from 20 to 21.  It would give a nice progression without all the rage. 

If want to control the amount of heirlooms simply keep the leveling from 30 to 31 the way it is now.

Like I mentioned before, its in our best interest to keep growing our player base and the best way I can think of doing that is reducing the leveling grind.  The upkeep system I think is fine.   


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Offline Frederick

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #306 on: September 10, 2011, 07:54:43 pm »
+1
So basically you want one more reason why Players should take strength, and ... not give another reason to take AGI as a balance?

Now that you mention it, my post could possibly come off as that. Maybe it is simply my personal bias that I view agility as being more important for higher level players than maxing out strength. Players without an adequate agility run slower, attack slower, and also lack the ability to use bows and thrown weapons with any degree of accuracy.

But the idea of making strength more important relative to agility didn't really cross my mind when I wrote this. My thinking was, to create an opportunity cost 'curve' that sufficiently penalizes the use of the heaviest armor by virtue of having to sacrifice movement and attack speed [and horse riding abilities]. Most players would not consider using the heaviest armor worth this penalty.

 

Offline Allers

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #307 on: September 10, 2011, 07:55:24 pm »
0
I SAY REVERT BACK TO THE TIMES WHERE YOU HAD TO WORK TO LEVEL UP AND GAIN MONEY
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Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #308 on: September 10, 2011, 08:00:22 pm »
+1
I SAY REVERT BACK TO THE TIMES WHERE YOU HAD TO WORK TO LEVEL UP AND GAIN MONEY

I SAY HELL NAW
I'm not normal and I don't pretend so, my approach is pretty much a bomb crescendo.
Death is a fun way to pass the time though, several little bullets moving in staccato.
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Offline DrKronic

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #309 on: September 10, 2011, 08:05:22 pm »
+2
only whiners hate upkeep, I have no problem wearing anything, if u can't win enough to wear good gear, you're the problem

it gives money value to have it decrease this way, I like upkeep it actually makes "sense"
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Offline Memento_Mori

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #310 on: September 10, 2011, 08:07:01 pm »
+1
Only reason I came back to C-rpg was because of the upkeep patch, screw fighting armies of tin cans in your pajamas with a sword made of aluminum.


(now I'm not the only one in low tier equip ! :D)

Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #311 on: September 10, 2011, 08:08:10 pm »
+1
if u can't win enough to wear good gear, you're the problem


Strange... chadz says the same thing....
I'm not normal and I don't pretend so, my approach is pretty much a bomb crescendo.
Death is a fun way to pass the time though, several little bullets moving in staccato.
The terror of my reign will live on in infamy, singing when they die like a dead man's symphony.

Offline Leshma

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #312 on: September 10, 2011, 08:14:11 pm »
+1
so many plated chargers these days thanks to no upkeep for first 25 lvls of 1st gen players. nubs trampling nubs, feeling powerful. that was a terrible idea.

you want to make it so that everyone not just nubs can use plated chargers.

HELL NO!

Offline DrKronic

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #313 on: September 10, 2011, 08:17:33 pm »
+1
Strange... chadz says the same thing....

great minds think alike
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Offline polkafranzi

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Re: Why do we even need upkeep anymore?
« Reply #314 on: September 10, 2011, 08:19:38 pm »
+1
Only reason I came back to C-rpg was because of the upkeep patch, screw fighting armies of tin cans in your pajamas with a sword made of aluminum.


(now I'm not the only one in low tier equip ! :D)

don't know whodafak you are, but you must be NA to come out with such an inaccurate statement about Eu cRPG like that.
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