Author Topic: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!  (Read 34525 times)

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Offline Banok

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #60 on: July 15, 2011, 04:31:56 am »
0
epic post epically posted with epic points.

for a start xbow need armour penalty like everything else.

oh and one of the biggest problems is the xbow looms were crazy op, they got toned down but my x2 sniper is still sick and the x3 is still op.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2011, 04:35:51 am by Banok »

Offline Rumblood

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #61 on: July 15, 2011, 04:58:13 am »
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I have an archer that is going to have both 7 powerstrike and powerdraw, and prof in both 2 h and bow, right now its at level 20 somethings, works wonder.

2 hander? Way to not be an archer. They have to carry arrows you know  :lol:
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Offline Thomek

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #62 on: July 15, 2011, 05:08:39 am »
+1
Katanas already get double cost (not only repair) because of the weeaboo factor. ;)

And so much other weaboo stuff get's away. This is in best case in inconsistant. Fasader, please please please. It got nerfed last time because one Ninja went crazy, and started a retarded discussion which I could not stop personally since I was away for 3 days. He immediately left the clan and cRPG altogether after the incident.

Dear Fasader, I started a Guild and a playstyle around the Katana.. Seeing it nerfed to pieces like now just makes me sad. It's part of cRPG soul ffs!

I do understand you might "hate" the people dreaming around the katana and it's popcultural position, but believe me, I'm not some kind of dreamer having 4 katanas on the walls, meditating in a Kimono.. Ninjas got started since I hated Archers! And as a protest towards the influx of tincans offering a different way of playing!

So please please please, again. Put it back in top tier swords. Put a ridiculous price tag on it, so only ninjas will actually use it, I don't care, just make it reasonably good again.

Sorry for Hijacking thread..

Thomek
« Last Edit: July 15, 2011, 05:11:17 am by Thomek »
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Offline Loki

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #63 on: July 15, 2011, 05:52:32 am »
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really nice job Elerion.
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Offline Fandrall

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #64 on: July 15, 2011, 06:07:18 am »
+1
If we're gonna talk about reality the devs have clearly never aimed and shot with either a bow or a crossbow. If we're talking about reality the devs have clearly chosen to ignore the laws of physics on how projectiles act. If we're talking about reality the devs have clearly replaced the reality with their own...

Elerions awesome work clearly shows a huge disadvantage for archers compared to crossbowmen. It is really silly how you can even defend this as there is no thing that supports this either from a realistic or game balance point of view. Archers where a big part of medieval warfare and the bow have always been superior to the crossbow when it comes to range, reloading speed and accuracy. The thing that made the crossbow thrive was the fact that you could use it with very little training. The aerodynamics of the arrow compared to the bolt is way way better which gives it better range and accuracy and damage at longer range than 30 meters. But enough about the bow vs the crossbow. As stated above these should not go at each other. The real problem is the ranged vs the melee. In reality ranged should be superior, for game balance they should be equal.

Have you any idea how much power a crossbow or bow put out? With such a small hit area as the tip of a arrow or bolt it has way way more power than a human can ever muster in a swing or thrust. If you had ever been hit by a two handed sword while wearing a plate you would know it doesent do that much damage unless it hits where you dont have protection. Guess what, the arrow/bolt works the same way only difference is that the arrow/bolt actually penetrates breastplates and even helmets. I was reading this thead http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,10358.0.html and in it Paul gives alot of pseudo science argument backed up with youtube clips of how the bodkin didnt penetrate armor. Well I dont think they did either as I know a thing or two about steel but im also convinced that no melee weapon in this game can penetrate that breastplate. The power of a human is simply to low. So if the bows are to be nerfed by the fact that the arrows cant penetrate modern steel on youtube then all the melee weapons should also be nerfed. But seriously...

Crossbows should have higher dmg and lower missile speed compared to bows. This to replicate the fact that bows are more accurate and effective at longer distance while the crossbow has higher v0 due to pure power. Crossbows should be easier to use and need less skillpoint investments. This to replicate the faster time to learn to use crossbows.

Conclusion: Revert bows to what they where before patch and keep crossbows the same as they are now.

@Elerion: Thank you for taking your time presenting this positive criticism in such a clear way.

@Devs: Keep up the good work! This is the best game/mod I've ever played but plz fix this as its breaking the game.

Offline Bobthehero

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #65 on: July 15, 2011, 06:50:37 am »
+1
2 hander? Way to not be an archer. They have to carry arrows you know  :lol:

horn bow arrow longsword ----> horn bow arrow flamberge black plate armet heavy gauntlet black greaves, once I get the cash for the flamberge and the plate.
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Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #66 on: July 15, 2011, 06:56:24 am »
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horn bow arrow longsword ----> horn bow arrow flamberge black plate armet heavy gauntlet black greaves, once I get the cash for the flamberge and the plate.

You are going to lolshoot in black plate? 14 wpf per PD remember? And armour subtracts from it   :shock:
If you have the wpf, this is going to look hilarious and awesome plus brownie points to you good sir.

Also flamberge can not be sheathed.

Regardless... You are a hybrid then, psh psh psh.
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Offline Bobthehero

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #67 on: July 15, 2011, 07:00:10 am »
0
The wpf thing is bugged, I was shooting my bow today even with the red "not enough prof" with my gauntlets/greaves/armet.

And it worked suprisingly well.

Edit: Damnit, now I need another silly weapon, maybe a bec de corbin... nah bad anims in first person...
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGH :(
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Offline Gorath

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #68 on: July 15, 2011, 07:16:10 am »
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In reality ranged should be superior
Play any standard FPS and this is already in place.  lolknifing?  Shotty to the face.
for game balance they should be equal.
For the above it means that ranged damage must be MUCH lower in all around capability than melee damage, because it is ranged and therefore capable of killing from absolute safety at any time while melee has to get within arms reach.

Which sounds alot like what all the ranged players keep complaining about tbh.
And I should be nice or polite to anyone.... why exactly?

Offline Soldier_of_God

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #69 on: July 15, 2011, 08:47:16 am »
+1
BlackRose_Edwin  (Ranged STF)

Strength   26   
Agility   12   

Weapon proficiency
Available points: 1
One Handed   78   3 points per wpf
Two Handed   1   1 point per wpf
Polearm   1   1 point per wpf
Archery   123   7 points per wpf
Crossbow   1   1 point per wpf
Throwing   1   1 point per wpf

Skills
 Available points: 0 Iron Flesh   0   3 strength per level
Power Strike   8   3 strength per level
Shield   1   3 agility per level
Athletics   4   3 agility per level
Riding   0   3 agility per level
Horse Archery   0   6 agility per level
Power Draw   8   3 strength per level
Power Throw   0   3 strength per level
Weapon Master   4   3 agility per leve;

Mail with Tunic, Chain gloves, chain coif, Longbow, Arrows, fighting pick

funny thing is... i couldnt use my fucking longbow because of WPF. actually, i could with a ridiculous penalty.
oh, and i find it funny that bows get progressively slower...

I have to say from a shielder point of view even, archery has been chaz'd. archery has got to be the most useless battle skill ever for CRPG.

dont get me wrong, i hate archers shooting me and running away and shooting me again, but bows tickle when im in my coat of plates in siege; a-typical gear... hell, i cant even 2 hit naked people running around.

Offline Gnjus

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #70 on: July 15, 2011, 08:59:38 am »
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2nd point: First lets dispell this myth: "before the patch archers were sharp shooters"  Pre-patch we were anything but sharpshooters. I really don't think that people who don't play as archers get this. Pre-patch you were having a good day as an archer if 1 in every 4 of your arrows hit its mark. We always had crap accuracy which is why no pure archer build was ever one of the top 20 players (based off k/d ratio) of cRPG.

The Fallen archers do fight as archer squads, you should know that from the clan battles. We wounded or killed our prey with coordinated volleys at designated targets even then most of us would miss.  Now...  anyone can lazily move out of the way of our snail slow projectiles and even a mass of arrows is easily dodged. All the archery nerfs were bad but the biggest slap in the dick with this patch is that we do next to no damage now. So archery is a complete joke now that has no accuracy or damage output.

Being an archer in a coordinated squad is the most fun I've ever had in cRPG until the patch.. now it hurts to play.

First of all: there is no myth, archers (most of the cRPG time) WERE Rambo Sharpshooters, able to do hits from miles out with deadly accuracy on a regular basis, I don't know how long you've played this mod and on what servers but that's a fact. Scoreboard is not important here since assists don't count, maybe you didn't one-shot a lot but you sure as hell got your fair and square amount of unrealistic (to say the least) hits from your safe position miles away from combat. I repeat: if there is a group of archers (5-10 +) shooting from far away they will hit things but 1 or 2....i mean seriously ? They shouldn't be able to hit a standing elephant let alone a moving target from way out.

Second: I have already written down a solution that would be perfect for you and your friendly....friends, but you failed to comprehend it. I said "make everything as it should be" which means: your arrow speed back to normal, pierce damage instead of cut but less accuracy. It would made your squad highly effective but it would hurt Rambo Snipers. That's the way it always was and that's the way it always should be: ranged weapon is deadly when it hits, you can't run away from bolts & arrows but....a big BUT: its not that easy to hit, especially on your own.

Anything else then this means we are playing medieval-fantasy themed third-person shooter. As we are.
Do you honestly think you have any sort of moral authority, Reyiz? Go genocide some more armenians and deny it ever happened, please, and stay in the middle east.
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Offline RagnarLodbroke

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #71 on: July 15, 2011, 09:42:02 am »
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Xbows, always been OP!
Archery was OP, now UP! Reason, nerfed like hell after the patch release in Janurary, and even more now!

Offline Shablagoo

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #72 on: July 15, 2011, 10:26:24 am »
+1
http://nacrpg.net/serverStats.php?order=KDR&search=no&mode=all&region=NA&page=1

Top 50 contains 2 archers and 1 xbow.  You idiots can't see the forest for the trees.  "Archery sucks now!  Solution?  NERF XBOWS AGAIN!!"  It's a thread about archery and xbows and half the thread consists of bitching 2h and polearm spammers.

All range sucked before the patch.  It all sucks now.  Because the khyber knife is better than the long dagger, does that make it overpowered?  No.  It just makes one slightly crappier than the other. 

Who wins games with an xbow?  Who?  I've never seen it.  And the number of games archers have won I can count on one hand and still have fingers left over.  Yet people can moosh their face against the keyboard and roll it back and forth to get first place with a polearm or 2h.  I don't understand how people can be so obtuse. 

Offline Gnjus

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #73 on: July 15, 2011, 10:41:16 am »
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Top 50 contains 2 archers and 1 xbow.  You idiots can't see the forest for the trees.

Those 1 or 2 on that list are 1 or 2 too many.  :wink:
On EU servers 70% of people shoot something and in most scenarios they are the last survivors, in the end you have either firing squads shooting at unlucky melee survivors of the enemy team or a bunch of monkeys spread out on the roofs picking off miserable chaps below. On the open plains maps they usually stack on some hill and do their shit. You NA lads are lucky if you don't have so many ranged there, if there wasn't for the ping problem id honestly be playing there most of the time.
Have in mind that servers don't show deadly assists and ranged score loads of em.




Who wins games with an xbow?  Who?  I've never seen it.

Fasader does. Happened several minutes ago on EU1. Also, WhineUKR does, Ronald CampioSandro does, Wolves Black Widow does, this list goes forever as far as EU servers are concerned.





Do you honestly think you have any sort of moral authority, Reyiz? Go genocide some more armenians and deny it ever happened, please, and stay in the middle east.
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Offline Bromagi

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Re: Meet the Archer and Crossbowwoman!
« Reply #74 on: July 15, 2011, 10:42:22 am »
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Buff bows!!! Or Brogg will get angry! 
« Last Edit: July 15, 2011, 10:43:36 am by Bromagi »
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