not really. crushthrough is almost as silly as polestagger is
There is no melee weapon except for the long maul ingame that is slower than the Great maul.
Nothing should have crush through. It is a cheap spec and every kill with it is cheesy. Yes, they would be useless without crushthrough- which is why I advocate removing them altogether.
Maul counters almost everything though. How is it anything like your signature?
They're slow as sin and you can chamber overheads if you're desperate.
What? People are starting to complain about mauls now too? Geez, what is happening to this community?
Mauls can definitely be dangerous if teammates are helping, alone tho you cant do much and will have a hard time running away with the high weight and usually strength build. All i do against a mauler is side swing untill he dies, they usually cant attack back with their slow speed. Because of their heavy weapon you can easily outrun them if you have a balanced build so you dont have to fight them. On siege tho they can become a big problem but with a good defence you can kill them before they can hit anyone.
I dont see mauls countering archers/xbowmen/cav/pikes.. Maaaybe 2h/pole without shield but that depends alot on who is using it and who he is fighting so id say not. It is a good counter to melee if, like i said, is used with the help of teammates.
Problem with the g-maul is that it turns a shitty player that you don't really have to worry about into a juggernaut of destruction.
It's simply too good and too easy to completely rape with imho.
Now, I'd really like to see CT mechanics changed:
Make the mauls much better all around weapons, but limit CT to shields. Then you'd still have a support function (forcing people to put their shields on their backs), while stopping them from being the ridiculous bullshit that they are now.
Now, I'd really like to see CT mechanics changed:
Make the mauls much better all around weapons, but limit CT to shields. Then you'd still have a support function (forcing people to put their shields on their backs), while stopping them from being the ridiculous bullshit that they are now.
not really. crushthrough is almost as silly as polestagger is
Interesting. Didn't you convert to 1h + shield lately?Nope, still a 2hander.
As others mentioned crushthrough weapons are not that frightening solo, but I need to completely change my fighting style whenever I fight a mauler so it's a nice change of pace. But if I'm outnumbered by enemies, and one of them has a maul, I'm in trouble.
A great support weapon but not very good 1v1. Kinda like pikes/long spears. I think they're fine as they are.
1. Make a STF mauler, 39/3 or whatever
2. Buy a Great Maul, naked is fine armor-wise
3. Stand on top of a ladder in siege, just off to the side so ranged can't get you
4. Close your eyes and mash overheads for the entire round
5. When round ends, open eyes to see your 10+kills
On any siege maps where ladders are primary, 4 maulers can ENSURE victory for the defenders, with no counter. I'm sure they are fine on battle, but I've seen half the siege server GTX just because a few maulers coordinated on defense.
I don't know the solution, but it needs to be fixed. Maybe some kind of endurance bar so they can't just repeatedly overhead for the entire round?
(click to show/hide)
Imo, the scariest maulers are not the STR ones, but the 21/18 ones.
Imo, the scariest maulers are not the STR ones, but the 21/18 ones.
If using a short weapon, spam.
If using a long weapon, range.
With my katana, I can spam them whenever they do an overhead and hit first, I only need to block sideswings. Seems fair to me. Both are forced to block. My katana gets stunned most of the time i block aswell.
A mauler crutches and generally takes a butt load of hits. You miss or glance once and you are dead. You use an overhead-dead, thrust-dead. Fighting multiple people? Dead. There is just so many ways to die without you being able to do anything about it. All because of crush through.
I find it funny that the long maul is terrible against anyone with a heavy shield or heavy weapon (great maul), yet the great maul rapes those same things. The long maul weighs 1 less kg than the great maul, and has a longer handle for a harder hit.
If I don't have any problem with them, why do you?
Phyrex' Very Short Guide to Maul Defence
Never thrust or overhead.
Spam left and right slashes while watching for Maul side slashes. Should you somehow fail your spam or perhaps do a thrust by mistake, kick-slash him.
As a solo-mauler, aggression and constant W-key spam is a must. Heavy armour and the slow, short weapon requires constant 'up in your face' combat tactics. An easy prey for back-peddling, spam and kick-slashing.
An experienced mauler will try a side slash and see if you block or not. If you do block it, you should, he might try doing it again, but this time do a holded side slash. This will stun your weapon and he'll try an overhead straight away, keep the kick-key ready or simply backpeddle away.
The mauler isn't that awesome at taking out turtles, it's far better at taking out support players. Flamberge, Pikes and all the 2-attack direction polearms, slow polearms, defensive/str-whore players and newbie/clueless players.(Who got none but themselves to blame.)
And of course, throughout this thread, the people who complain wield the weapons/fit into the categories mentioned above. Amusing. Would be like me complaining at archers shooting me in an open field. Guess what? They're my counter-class, the maul might just be yours.
A mauler crutches and generally takes a butt load of hits. You miss or glance once and you are dead. You use an overhead-dead, thrust-dead. Fighting multiple people? Dead. There is just so many ways to die without you being able to do anything about it. All because of crush through.As a mauler and two hander myself, this is very true. But there are underestimating your own power against those maulers as well.
When that happens, this happens (nords teamplaying with decent tactics): http://i.imgur.com/OCXbB.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/OCXbB.jpg)
If using a short weapon, spam.
If using a long weapon, range.
With my katana, I can spam them whenever they do an overhead and hit first, I only need to block sideswings. Seems fair to me. Both are forced to block. My katana gets stunned most of the time i block aswell.
Totally inapplicable for the Siege situation I described (maulers on top and to the side of ladders). The ladder/castle geometry nullifies your reach and speed by funneling you under their maul.
When you find yourself closed in anyhow circle around them.
Maul counters almost everything though. How is it anything like your signature?
A mauler crutches and generally takes a butt load of hits. You miss or glance once and you are dead. You use an overhead-dead, thrust-dead. Fighting multiple people? Dead. There is just so many ways to die without you being able to do anything about it. All because of crush through.
Get a few heavy shielders to push through while everyone follows behind them. Problem solved. With the attackers faster spawn times if you keep pushing you'll make it through.
Well, the obvious solution would be to play battle if you cant handle maulers...
Yes, maulers have some weaknesses in the open field, but they are just too strong on siege defense.
I know right, I mean how dare an item be very strong in a very specific niche instance!
Same with damn pikes, in the open field against a single horseman pikes are like mega OP at rearing horses!
Against stationary targets archers can like be mega OP at hitting them from ranged, while the stationary target can't attack back!
Yeah I suggested stamina a while back for all weapons (when people were brainstorming ways to buff agility). That seems to be lacking in this game for all attacks. But it wouldn't necessarily be based on agility alone because obviously the stronger you are, the longer you can swing heavy objects around. It would need some heaving tweaking to be viable.
That being said, it would also be nice if stamina was added to horses based on their "breed" and how much weight they are carrying (rider's equipment weight + horses armor if it has any).
The thing is though, even if both of these could be implemented, it would completely change how people are used to playing warband. This is more one of those things I wish taleworlds implemented from the start, or in a patch.
Cav can avoid pikers and be successful, attackers can't avoid ladders and doorways in siege without leeching. Defending a castle from siege isn't a "niche instance"; half the server is doing it at any given time.
Come to NA siege when Occitan is playing defense and tell me there isn't a problem with mauls. Their 5-6 maulers could easily repel 5x that number of attackers, by standing stationary and performing a single attack repeatedly. Other clans and random folks are starting to pick up on this insta-win tactic. Extrapolate out the current situation (every pole and 2h player spawning with a maul on siege defense), and everyone will just quit playing siege.
My best suggestion for a fix is to implement a stamina bar that depletes as a function of weapon weight. Would be hard for the devs to implement though.
Is it impossible to chamber mauls? Just wondering. It's an unreasonable standard to expect every player to chamber, but it seems to me that if a ladder is guarded by a mauler then somebody should just chamber the mauler.You can chamber a maul just like any other weapon, but they can still crushthrough your chamber, so you'll end up taking the hit first anyways rendering the attempt moot.
I blocked a maul today with a pike. WITH A PIKE. I felt like a wizard. :mrgreen:
If maulers are so OP in siege defense, why do attackers still mostly win?
Nerf maul! Yesterday I was using my plate armor, 54 body armor, and a guy with a maul 1 hit me with full health. The guy had 12PS but c'mon, thats silly that a fully plate man can get 1 hit by a mauler, AND I also had 7 IF (70) hitpoints
Cry more noobs. When using a maul you cant do so much againts skilled people so if u are crying here looking for a crushtrough nerf u are a noob (and u deserve to be smashed again and again and again and again until you learn how to play).
:rolleyes:
on eu mostly won defenders, because when maulers and ranged camp ladders it is hell gate for attackers :twisted:
Cry more noobs. When using a maul you cant do so much againts skilled people so if u are crying here looking for a crushtrough nerf u are a noob (and u deserve to be smashed again and again and again and again until you learn how to play).
:rolleyes:
Thanks for the constructive comment.
But seriously-maybe not imbalanced, but still cheap and skill-less.
Lol L2p maul noobcake
But seriously-maybe not imbalanced, but still cheap and skill-less.
I'm rarely one to say this but... wanna go brah? I'm an okay 1h and shield and believe I could beat your 'skill-less' maul.(click to show/hide)
Any weapon that allows a naked newbie to top the scoreboard while performing only a single attack without even moving needs some adjustment.
That's the siege attackers fault in almost any circumstance. Of course there's a meatgrinder element to siege when defenders are doing their job. There are only balance problems when it is unreasonably difficult to get by a player on siege. But mauls on siege are in their best environment, so of course we can expect that they'll do well. So, the real question is: is it effectively impossible for reasonably skilled players to get by an average mauler atop a ladder? Absolutely not. Two sensible players marching together up a ladder can overcome a mauler in most cases.
Again, I'd be happy to demonstrate this with willing volunteers. Often I can get by maulers guarding ladders on my own, so it shouldn't be difficult to demonstrate my point.
I'm rarely one to say this but... wanna go brah? I'm an okay 1h and shield and believe I could beat your 'skill-less' maul.(click to show/hide)
I didn't say they were good for dueling. But go ahead and troll.
Skilless, unrealistic and not needed since we need more shielders ingame. Remove mauls.No
I'm a pretty terrible 1h without my shield, and since i'm always on horseback my manual blocking sucks, but I'm betting I could take a skill-less mauler with 1h without a shield. Hell I'll even use my 73 length 1h broad battle axe and show this guy how to counter a "skill-less" mauler. Both cases I would use the speed to my advantage.So you think Mauls are balanced cause shitty players suck with them?
Or I could go the other direction and use an 89 speed long bardiche (140 length) and show that even 89 speed you can out spam a mauler, or use reach to your advantage.
It´s not easy to fight ANY decent player, that beeing said.
I have yet to see newb being deadly with any greatsword, they are pretty much easy prey, even in groups.
I have yet to see newb being deadly with any greatsword, they are pretty much easy prey, even in groups.
on eu mostly won defenders, because when maulers and ranged camp ladders it is hell gate for attackers :twisted:crap Agor found his way into the forum and now i have to look at his bs here too ;) ... so how do i mute players ingame forever out of my chatsystem :lol:
Some may think it is fun to have this wildcard mechanic as an added footwork and spam mini-game the attack-block melee aside, and I can to some degree understand that. I can also understand that people think it is a fun weapon to use. Though I personally don't like it much for having an auto-win on hit attack I've tried it a few times and yes it is fun to klonk people over their heads, even if I feel a bit cheesy when doing so.
Think what you will about lolhammers, they are still the only melee weapon that allows a player to kill a more skilled player with an unblockable attack and are also the only completely fantasy weapon in the mod. Either way, I don't care much and I'm also one of those who think the mod is pretty balanced overall, it's not like it's OP or anything, just has a bit gamey mechanic. Let it stay as is if people are so attached to it - but at least change the in-game model to a real Medieval mace of sorts.
skilled players dont block up vs maulsYeah sure, they block the hit with their face like a boss... :rolleyes:
personaly i think that the mauls need some work done, I really don't mind they have crushthrough but on the other hand how come polearms and other 2h axes don't have it? i bet your ass that a really strong person can cleave through a shield if standing stationary?
the other thing that is bothering me its a problem in Warband itself, when someone miss his swing with a maul and then just turns and still hits you and get a crushthrough hit?
I really don't mind they have crushthrough but on the other hand how come polearms and other 2h axes don't have it?
I really don't mind they have crushthrough but on the other hand how come polearms and other 2h axes don't have it?
Stop nerfing shit, learn to counter a weapons strengths and learn some tactics.
Akynos what your asking for is silly because u forgot how hard it is to get close enough an perform a overhead on anyone who aint a complete noob..
Also you idea would make the maul useless because it´s really hard to perform good with a maul outside siege an it takes some really good timing just to get that 1 overhead in on an aware opponent..