Hey Sauce_of_Ghayos, if you don't like it just stfu and play another game okay?
Typical response, but I can't be the only one playing that feels like the combat has lost a lot of it's fluid mechanics.he's like http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=N1KvgtEnABY#t=68s
right swing is so damn slow -.-
I hear you brother. Speak up fellow soldiers/warriors/heroes and serve up the truth about these combat mechanic patches.I don't think I've even seen you use a weapon with horizontal attacks in over 6 months. You must have been put up to this! Surely it's not possible that we might have an unbiased opinion upon our hands!
Dear Devs,
Please stop altering the game mechanics. Combat is getting worse with each new patch. We know you mean well, but the fixes are severely detrimental.
Kisses and Cross-bolts,
Sauce_of_Chaos
The speed of battle compared to Native or other mods feels..... SlowPlay Vikingr, have fun! :wink:
Its a bit too slow, but apart from that the class balance is better than ever.
Dear Players,
Please stop complaining about us altering the game mechanics. Combat is getting closer to our vision with each new patch. We know you mean well, but you have to consider your opinion may not be shared by everyone, be it a dev or a player.
Kicks and Bans,
cmpxchg8b
Dear Players,
Please stop complaining about us altering the game mechanics. Combat is getting closer to our vision with each new patch. We know you mean well, but you have to consider your opinion may not be shared by everyone, be it a dev or a player.
Kicks and Bans,
cmpxchg8b
If the community is not complaining about current combat - By that I mean a concentrated effort to change a game mechanic.
Then why bother changing it? Or have you pushed the needs and wants of the community aside for your own desires?
Huseby, what is the message you are trying to convey?
You are saying that changes need to be made in some cases, but not others and that there is a need to balance but balance can never be fully achieved. You don't like that people have to adapt to changes but tell the devs to focus on changing things.
I am not understanding what you are getting at.
chadz has said from the start that he is developing the mod to what he wants it to be, not what the community wants it to be. Paraphrased.
I generally think that's a good idea. But they really should have a handful of their most trusted, respected, and "smart" players, on some sort of "steering" committee to brain storm pro's and con's before they make real big "balance" changes. Basically a cross-section of players, dev's, admins, etc who can give their input (and the dev's and chadz specifically can take it or leave it).
We have that, it's called item balance team.
Combat is getting closer to our vision with each new patch.
well there are many classes that have been heavily nerfed before. The game isnt 2h vs everyone else.I'm not a 2h. I play every weapon class. My problem is that every single weapon class is easy to block at the moment - even 101 speed one-handers. Reducing the right swing speed just made this even worse.
2h got a tiny nerf compared to what throwers took and you think losing a little speed was harder to take then lancers losing most of their range. and yes lancers still pwn but so do 2h. Your class hasnt suddenly been nerfed to the ground..
Slower combat just increases the importance of teamplay.Teamplay remains important irrespective of whether or not individual combat is slow. Reducing combat to backstabbing is neither fun nor particularly interesting.
Reducing combat to backstabbing is neither fun nor particularly interesting.
Dear Devs,
Please continue nerfing cav. Cav is only getting easier for players such as myself and it is only becoming more and more of a problem.
Teamkills and HomosexualityCavalieres_Huey_Newton
This. It's not there yet, but that's basically what Phew is saying is ideal (apparently?). Making it a numbers game, all about backstabbing, would be the most boring thing ever.
The most effective combat tactic since the beginning of warfare has been flanking (which is what you refer to as backstabbing, I believe). M&B is meant to roughly capture the essence of medieval combat, where most battles were probably decided by whichever side had the most effective flanking maneuvers, not who had the one guy with the best fencing skills.Sorry, but reducing things to the point where player skill has little impact on victory makes for a terrible game. If you minimize the effect of individual skill, there is literally no reason to play the game - you may as well just have every battle autoresolve based on class composition.
(click to show/hide)
Maybe where you are wrong is: there is no big red button labeled "BALANCE" and when you push it the game is all of a sudden balanced.
Balance requires changing little things, one or a few at a time. When the effects are as desired, move on to the next changes. When the aftermath is lacking (e.g. a change is abuse able or imbalances something else), the change needs to be reverted or something else changed accordingly.
This all takes time an effort and I say:
Draw your verdict of the game when everything is set and done and the dev team releases the mod. Everything before that is just irrelevant.
Sorry, but reducing things to the point where player skill has little impact on victory makes for a terrible game. If you minimize the effect of individual skill, there is literally no reason to play the game - you may as well just have every battle autoresolve based on class composition.
Tactical aptitude is a 'skill' just like twitch reflexes. Up combat speed, and you over-emphasize the twitch reflex skill while under-emphasizing good tactics. I think the current combat speed strikes a good balance between the two. Up the combat speed, and whichever team lucks into getting the one guy with Jedi-like reflexes is nearly assured victory. The slow combat speed puts a cap on how much impact those Jedi can have on the overall battle, allowing a team with superior tactics but inferior reflexes to have a chance.
Increased combat speed could result in every battle being "autoresolved" just based on whichever team has the best ping values. Do you want that?
Up the combat speed, and whichever team lucks into getting the one guy with Jedi-like reflexes is nearly assured victory.A group of players can kill an individual player regardless of how fast the game speed is. A single player isn't going to kill forty other players.
Increased combat speed could result in every battle being "autoresolved" just based on whichever team has the best ping values. Do you want that?Native 'faster' speed is perfectly playable at 80 ping. There really isn't much point in balancing the game past that point.
Many of us quickly reach a cap where continued practice does not improve our 1v1 combat ability; our reflexes and hand-eye coordination simply do not allow further improvement. I understand that for an elite few, that cap is not imposed by their reflexes, but by the game mechanics.When i play on siege i rarely go for flag (unless really necessary)
When I hit my reflex cap, I just decided to focus on improving my tactical awareness. So I respecced to shield (to help overcome my reflex handicap), and now focus on being in the right place at the right time.
There are several 'Jedi' duelists that usually provide zero contribution to their team's objectives. Perhaps they should focus on honing their tactical awareness instead of mastering the latest abuse of melee mechanics (hiltslash, spinthrust, etc).
For those of you that have mastered both the twitch reflex and tactical awareness elements of this game: Congrats, you won the game. Now let the other 99% of us try to improve and have fun at the current combat speed.
Many of us quickly reach a cap where continued practice does not improve our 1v1 combat ability; our reflexes and hand-eye coordination simply do not allow further improvementThis is a cop-out. Even at 'faster' speed, the reaction time required is still nowhere close to human limits. The vast, vast majority of players are perfectly capable of becoming really good given enough practice.
This is a cop-out.
that's saulcanner, he can
I've seen him lose against EU players, on the NA duel server, so no, I don't think so.I've also beaten quite a few EU players on the EU server :D
that's saulcanner, he can
probably the top 10% of players can block standard attacks indefinitely at this point
Tactical aptitude is a 'skill' just like twitch reflexes. Up combat speed, and you over-emphasize the twitch reflex skill while under-emphasizing good tactics.
When I hit my reflex cap, I just decided to focus on improving my tactical awareness. So I respecced to shield (to help overcome my reflex handicap), and now focus on being in the right place at the right time.
I've seen him lose against EU players, on the NA duel server, so no, I don't think so.
Here (http://www.xfire.com/video/52dda5/) is a video of me trying to block as best I can with the 25 FPS my video recording software gives me. My opponent is using a masterwork longsword.
Good blocking. A bit boring, but mostly because that guy's attacking style is even more boring.I'm fairly certain he was just getting bored stiff by the end of it.
The only exception to fixing the combat is making longspears/pikes make sense.
That is why I do not duel anymore on Crpg
Meh, do as you like CMP, well as long as you stay away from my damned 1H
I can see coming a lot whining about 1h(left swing) in next few months, after 2h/pole right swing nerf and incoming archery nerf is 1h new op thing.
So this change - bigger stun for attacker after he is blocked will prevent 2h, pole castor swings and 1h left swing spam.
Hope this changes will be done on very sensitive way or dueling in crpg will die.
So this change - bigger stun for attacker after he is blocked will prevent 2h, pole castor swings and 1h left swing spam.
Hope this changes will be done on very sensitive way or dueling in crpg will die.
It won't prevent anything, it will make them harder (less hard then the current change, probably).Will this make sideswing chamberblocks more likely to hit? Because that would be awesome.
And no, it won't give free hits when blocked.
Problem is, duelling the *good* players today doesn't make for that much intense gameplay (which is what it should do imo), but rather we're like two walls for eachother.You have a large ego.... Put it back in ur paints man. Also it takes one Bolt to tumble that wall.
Have you ever considered mastering an offensive style too? Might not be as effective as yours, but maybe, just maybe, it could be more fun?
Offensive style is great fun, if you're dueling another offensive master. But once you're dueling a defensive player you'll just get bored and start spamming and throwing all kinds of shit on your target just to finish the duel before you die of boredom.There are no duels only dead archers (unless your in a duel server)
My view.
Offensive style is great fun, if you're dueling another offensive master. But once you're dueling a defensive player you'll just get bored and start spamming and throwing all kinds of shit on your target just to finish the duel before you die of boredom.
My view.
Yes, but that might also be because you can still improve. Many of the top players (at least on the EU side) use an offensive playstyle and they don't seem to have too much trouble dealing with defensive players (apart from some block machines... cough... Urist... cough..., but that's an anomaly).
I have yet to duel a player that I couldn't block when I was playing completely defensive. Not even those 16 ping fancy uberfeints get me (Atze style).
Don't believe you, sorry.
just for future reference, saul blocks better than the best autoblock program.
get out
Not true, autoblock has a mode that can block everything, even 5 guys attacking you at once (as long as you turn towards them). It's "a little bit" easy to notice, though.
:lol:
Probably, because it's similar to the built-in Autoblock feature?
At the moment, melee is so slow that it is trivially easy to block a single player indefinitely, no matter what weapon they are using (this was an issue before the right-swing nerf too). This pretty much turns melee fights into a test to see who gets bored first.Yes indeed, and these developers who consistently over the years made the game slower and slower, easier and easier, are to be trusted with making a new, skill-based combat system in Last Oasis? When in cRPG, they had a good foundation from Warband, and eroded the skill in it as best they could? No, I thinks not.
I would have hoped that the developers would have been focused on making player skill more important, rather than less.