Is this just me or has there been another archery nerf, as if there has not been enough already. Such BS.
No problem, we will nerf cav to compensate. Thanks for bringing this up.
http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,15838.0.html you people read forums sometime?I guess I must have actually been playing while you all were bitching and whining on the forums about getting killed by archery, until it got nerfed again for the 100th time.
Its rather funny now seeing archer still trying it and dying in process with a big question mark on his face.
Fucked over? eh you have only had the abilty to jump and shoot taken away and lets face it jumping with a longbow and trying to shoot in mid air while turning around is quite silly and i would like to see if you can hit the target properly!! or how about this run away and instead of jumping and shooting just turn and shoot and run away again!!I don't use a longbow, never have. It is not about shooting while in the air, that never worked. Jumping and turning around allowed you to narrow your reticule while still moving, now you have to stop and wait about 3 sec for your reticule to narrow. This is significant, as 3 sec can make a big difference at times. And, yes I am mad, but not just about this, its all the nerfs all the time that I hate.
P.s you sound very mad
Fucked over? eh you have only had the abilty to jump and shoot taken away and lets face it jumping with a longbow and trying to shoot in mid air while turning around is quite silly and i would like to see if you can hit the target properly!! or how about this run away and instead of jumping and shooting just turn and shoot and run away again!!
Yes, I can understand you being quite mad for not being able to kite and shoot at chasing infantry forever.I am not a kiting archer, I use a strongbow and I carry a mace. Anyone who plays with me can attest that I am not a kiting archer.
I am not a kiting archer, I use a strongbow and I carry a mace. Anyone who plays with me can attest that I am not a kiting archer.I can vouch for this: Damatacus is a beast in melee. Maybe dropping out of melee to fire a shot or two, but certainly not "a runner".
There is no problems with lolstabsThe fact that it exists is the problem.
jumping is necessary for melee to get out of bad situations.
I don't use a longbow, never have. It is not about shooting while in the air, that never worked. Jumping and turning around allowed you to narrow your reticule while still moving, now you have to stop and wait about 3 sec for your reticule to narrow. This is significant, as 3 sec can make a big difference at times. And, yes I am mad, but not just about this, its all the nerfs all the time, that I hate.
And jumping and hitting with plate or heavy chainmail together with a big polearm/2h or a heavy shield and 1h is better and more realistic than jumping with a bow? :shock:
Oh comeon guys, for once in your life turn your brains on and make some thing equal in this game. Stop complaining about realism etc etc etc if you just want it the way that you get most profit by your so-called "realism" :rolleyes:
The fact that it exists is the problem.
I quite obivously meant irl jumping around with bows and shiz but never mind...lulz
Being able to jump in mail/plate is quite realistic... full plate would be a problem due to weight however!!
They aren't completely different things. They are both as retarded as the other. As if a guy in full plate can jump the full height of a horse and get maximum damage on a swing. That's if we take the realism road.
The other road is that it looks retarded...which it does.
I love xant insisting that kiting archers are retarded and that they won't be able to do it now. They will...it will have just prolonged your pain because they will have to run that much further.
You make no sense.
The whole point of removing the ability for archer to prime their shot while jumping was because it made them 10x times better at kiting inf to death without giving them a chance to fight back.
You think its about look?
Anyways your dumb and are now trying to hijack threads about jump shooting to try and remove melee chances of taken your team bumping clan mates and other cav players down by aiming for the rider...
They aren't completely different things. They are both as retarded as the other. As if a guy in full plate can jump the full height of a horse and get maximum damage on a swing without causing himself some serious damage. That's if we take the realism road.
The other road is that it looks retarded...which it does.
Both arguments apply to both sets of actions.
Attacking in the air needs to be completely removed or not at all.
I love xant insisting that kiting archers are retarded and that they won't be able to do it now. They will...it will have just prolonged your pain because they will have to run that much further. Jump shooting had nothing to do with kiting...it helped...but kiting is still 100% viable.
let me get this straight, i didnt played game lately so i dont know
archers cant jump and attack now but everyone else can ?
really ?
Ok, maybe people in the heaviest of armors wouldn't be jumping around. That still leaves 95% of melee players that could viably do it. Sure, the jump animation isn't the most beautiful one but that's hardly a large issue.
Why does attacking in air need to be completely removed or not at all? What's with the "all or nothing" attitude?
When did I say that kiting archers are retarded, much less insist? :lol:
Yes, I can understand you being quite mad for not being able to kite and shoot at chasing infantry forever.
You didn't say retarded. But you still think they won't kite you any more. Which they will.
No, I did not say that. I said "kite and shoot" which implies they are doing both at the same time; jump shooting allowed this. Moving away from your foe while drawing your bow and shooting instantly upon touching the ground. I never said they still wouldn't kite. And yes, you are correct: archers can still run and gain distance to shoot. This is all well and good.
Ok so which argument are you basing this on? It seems there are about 10 people arguing strongly for this, all from different angles.
You're saying your fine with archers kiting you. Just not jump shooting? Yet half of your arguing in that other thread was raging about kiters.
Yet others are saying they don't want jump shooting and they think jump shooting will stop kiting.
Some are saying it's not realistic.
Some are saying it looks stupid.
And I'm sure there are others.
Jump shooting is what made kiting so retarded. It made it impossible for anyone without a shield to kill a half-decent archer. Normal kiting is fine, even though I don't think that archers should be able to run so fast. But it's pretty well balanced now.
Who said that jump shooting will stop kiting?
The devs did not state their reason for removing jumpshooting. I'm like purdy gosh darn sure that they didn't do it for it "looking stupid" but for balance reasons.
Even if you succeed in hijacking the thread to try and make infantry unable to jump and slash at cav its not gonna happen the dev´s arent that stupid.
Quite a lot of people have said jump shooting will stop kiting or near enough make it useless. Mostly infantry seem to be arguing that. Whilst a lot of archers have just said they will run for a bit longer just to gain the extra distance they need rather than jump shooting.
Archers usually run so fast because most inf wears heavier armour. It's not overly to do with athletics. I have 24 agi but 0 ath in my HA and can out run 90% of inf in my steppe armour.
It's got nothing to do with that Tzar. As I stated in my other post.
Ok, quote "quite a lot of people." You've already shown that you put words into people's mouths, so forgive me for being skeptical.
Archery is doing fine, on Pecores right now the whole fucking server is ranged nearly, hell even Atze's using his xbow alt. Who needs to jump when the end of the rounds in cRPG look like this these days? Oh and the yellow team? ALL ranged.
Hell just see Tzars post in reply to mine on the last page.
Uh. What about them? Tzar's posts on the last page do not say this will stop archers from kiting.
Kiting is fine so long as you are running to your team, if you the last alive then there should be a rule against kiting.
No but from his post he still seems to think that removing jump shooting will magically give infantry a chance to fight back. Which suggests archers either won't be able to kite, or they will stop.
Wait, what was your original argument again? You seem to have lost whatever point you might've had.
Yes because you keep picking on random little points rather than sticking to the main point.
The main and original point being that all jump attacks should be removed if they are going to be at all. And just to throw it out there so that I'm not lobbying, I don't mind not being able to attack whilst jumping on my horse.
I just think you can't remove one without removing all. Even from a balance perspective.
No because you keep making claims that have no factual basis. Tzar saying that jump shooting made kiting archers 10x better at killing infantry while kiting somehow translates to archers not being able to kite at all for you, for example.
So read through my random claims. It's not as if 100's of people on this forum don't do it. Like quoting random statistics that they've made up in their head.
Is this just me or has there been another archery nerf, as if there has not been enough already. Such BS.
Kiting is fine so long as you are running to your team, if you the last alive then there should be a rule against kiting.
Your defense for lying is "other people do it too"? H'okay.
Meh it's an internet forum. Few arguments on any internet forum have any form of factual basis. It's all opinion. I don't count opinion (seeing as saying quite a lot is entirely a subjective quantity, as are reading different things from posts) as lying.
It's not an opinion when you say that X has said Y when X has not said Y. That's a lie.
No...it depends on how you interpret something. The same way passages in a bible can be interpreted many different ways. Not everything is clear cut and people rarely write things to be so. I simply interpreted Tzars post as thinking Kiting would pretty much be useless and finished now.
This isn't the bible and most of the posters in this thread are still quite alive I'd hope, and therefore you can't simply go and decide what people meant. Tzar did not say what you claimed he said. You can admit you were wrong, but you can't go and say "BUT I CAN CHOOSE TO BELIEVE HE SAID THIS! IT'S A MATTER OF BELIEF DUDE, I CAN JUST BELIEVE HIS WORDS TO BE DIFFERENT!"
Frankly, I hope you're trolling because if you are not, you've lost the ways of logic bro.
It's not a matter of belief. It's a matter of interpretation. And it's not deciding what people mean. It would take far to long a post to explain to you the ins and outs of this, as it is a fundamental aspect of human behaviour. But you obviously don't quite understand it, or I am not conveying it simply enough for you. So like I said. I am done with this thread because it's a massive derailment and a pointless argument.
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I don't see jambi top the scoreboards every map, and even so jambi is a damn fine archer and that's why he tops scoreboards regularly.
Also the shooting over a wall, with xbowers and thorwers while jumping ? not possible for archers anymore either.I dont think xbows can do that either now.Think all ranged cant jump shoot.
If cav gets some kind of maneuverability nerf then it should be balanced.
Everyone campaigns for nerfs for everything. It's getting a bit silly.
or maybe instead of nerfing archers, actually fix bugs? like the arrow pick up bug etc?
finally! maybe we actually have a chance of catching them now. :rolleyes:
They should have melee attacks cancel while jumping too then. Make it even.
we should throw our 2h greatswords/morningstars/greatmauls ( :shock:) with pinpoint precision over 50 meters... make it even.
finally! maybe we actually have a chance of catching them now. :rolleyes:
good point Carrado
This would make us all happy, throwing great mauls which crush through shields. If you reach PT 14 you get to throw a Phyrex.
Good mod so far, devs. Keep up the good work. There's a reason I still play this game, and it's the changes.
I guarantee you a successful game like TF2 (and this) wouldn't be doing so well if it didn't keep changing. If it wasn't people bitching about the change, it'll be people bitching about the lack of it.
tl;dr THIS At fifteen, I had the will to learn ; at thirty, I could stand ; at forty, I had no doubts ; at fifty, I understood the heavenly Bidding ; at sixty, my ears were opened ; at seventy, I could do as my heart lusted without trespassing from the square..
Slashing with a Sword is quite possible while jumping(Not very effectively, really, but its possible) while its REALLY hard to draw an arrow, turn around and shoot precisely with a bow whilst jumping.
Also it was OP.
you mad? only a ninja can catch an already far archer with 8ATH, light gear and weightless bows (warbow weight is 1.5)
you will still not catch em but at least archers will not kite soloing an entire team.
I've never fought with a sword IRL before, so I have no idea if this is accurate at all: http://www.wikihow.com/Win-a-Swordfight (http://www.wikihow.com/Win-a-Swordfight)
"Never jump or take both feet off the ground. Try for 2 feet at all times. While jumping may look cool, it will get you killed as you cannot change direction in midair and your balance is gone. You are using a sword as well and therefore you need extra stability and balance. Keeping your feet planted and on the ground is very important. Also, when stepping slide your feet instead of lifting them, this way you can change direction or plant them quickly."
"Let your opponent do all the jumping and running around; if you do you will wear out fast which is extremely fatal."
Well if we are basing this game on real life then how come people can swing weapons underwater,why cant people swim,why dont people drown, why don't people in plate get tired, how come crossbow speed is so fast, why dont you actually reach into your quiver when reloading, blah blah more ranting and stuff
This is a game its supposed to be balanced and fun so deal with it.
I'm more than comfortable killing people in melee, even with the hammer, but now I'll just run without shooting until the infantry doesn't want to follow me anymore, just to be annoying. :lol:damn right agree on this:D
Archery is so badly nerfed that if you go to eu1 or pecroes etc late at night at least 50% are archers it must suck! A couple of archers on a server of around 30 players is so nerfed that they can rape the enemy team and make them rage quit! (yes it happend ^^)
Archery isnt exactly weak so get over it :P go talk to cav and older throwers about being nerfed :P at least you can stand and spin around shooting unlike cav :P
A couplethree tempLOLar archer alts + crossbowman + heavy cav clanstacking on a server of around306 players is so nerfed that they can rape theenemy teamrandom infantry ( :lol:) and make them rage quit! (yes it happend ^^) (guess why... hint: not for the "rape" but for the annoying style)
If archers can't charge a shot while jumping lets see what else shouldn't be allowed while jumping:
Jumping then slicing with a 2-sworded sword, these things were bloody heavy.
Cav jumping with plated armor, again heavy.
pole-arm lol stab while jumping backwards.
Archers are gonna need a lot more athletics now because kiting is virtually impossible now without 5+ athletics. This forces some archers to have less PD which is again A NERF. Thanks
my crpg today :
Spawn a bunch of times and get unluckily slaughtered
-GTX.
I always lol inside and facepalm whenever I see someone say two handed swords were heavy.
Ok so thats another archery nerf. How about nerfing weapon swings while jumping also ? Especially overhead jump swing... that also seems unrealistic etc etc QQ
or maybe instead of nerfing archers, actually fix bugs? like the arrow pick up bug etc?
Still havent learned, adding more bullshit content to a game thats already full of bugs
And do you realise that nerfing jumpdraws.. actually buff the faster bows again, by giving them a big advantage over slower bows ?
Also the shooting over a wall, with xbowers and thorwers while jumping ? not possible for archers anymore either.
You didnt nerf 1 thing... you nerfed ALOT more
lmao i think chadz and alot of you other noobs should srsly L2P.
7/10 people still outrun me... while they having 5 times more the weight in armor then me.
And no, im not butthurt.... just dissapointed in the community again.
I always lol inside and facepalm whenever I see someone say two handed swords were heavy.
:D me too, me too
http://www.myarmoury.com/review_at1592.html
No, they weren't heavy. Do research first.
I totally agree with what Jambi said.
And chadz, your answer on the thing with "take care about bugs instead of putting new stuff in" is just stupid, sorry :/
Expected more from you...
And chadz, your answer on the thing with "take care about bugs instead of putting new stuff in" is just stupid, sorry :/
Expected more from you...
I've never fought with a sword IRL before, so I have no idea if this is accurate at all: http://www.wikihow.com/Win-a-Swordfight (http://www.wikihow.com/Win-a-Swordfight)
"Never jump or take both feet off the ground. Try for 2 feet at all times. While jumping may look cool, it will get you killed as you cannot change direction in midair and your balance is gone. You are using a sword as well and therefore you need extra stability and balance. Keeping your feet planted and on the ground is very important. Also, when stepping slide your feet instead of lifting them, this way you can change direction or plant them quickly."
"Let your opponent do all the jumping and running around; if you do you will wear out fast which is extremely fatal."
Only one of those is applicable in Warband, since there is no stamina system. If there was no way of facing a different direction after you jump (something you can do in Warband that is kind of in defiance of all laws of physics) it would be "realistic". There's no "air time" when you jump in cRPG, in the sense that you can start a 360 degree spin after having already left the ground. Again, REALISM IS A HORRIBLE STANDARD FOR BALANCING, I'm just interested in the side discussions focusing on the issue, since so many people think that jump shotting got nerfed on the basis of realism, and feel that doing the same to melee/cav would be equitable. I don't think it has any bearing on balancing in any case.
And chadz, your answer on the thing with "take care about bugs instead of putting new stuff in" is just stupid, sorry :/
Expected more from you...
Any of you guys ever had a sword in your hand?
Ofcourse it's possible to jump with a sword and it's also possible to swing, but you hardly do any damage or whatever with it and you hardly block and the possibility that you stumble because of the weight affecting your jump is very high.
We are talking about european swords, not about asian sabres :rolleyes:
I totally agree with what Jambi said.
And chadz, your answer on the thing with "take care about bugs instead of putting new stuff in" is just stupid, sorry :/
Expected more from you...
Any of you guys ever had a sword in your hand?
Ofcourse it's possible to jump with a sword and it's also possible to swing, but you hardly do any damage or whatever with it and you hardly block and the possibility that you stumble because of the weight affecting your jump is very high.
We are talking about european swords, not about asian sabres :rolleyes:
Yes, I have held a sword that isn't a cheap piece of replica shit that weighs more than a real, balanced sword. Even the biggest european swords only weighed about 8lbs, wielded with two hands by someone who has trained for year after year with it, it isn't going to feel heavy at all. And 8lbs is the most extreme,alot of the larger two handed swords weighed between 4-6lbs.
It isn't going to effect your jumping at all, but I don't really see the issue here, jumping ingame in a melee battle results in death most of the time unless you are fighting an unskilled opponent, anyone with an ounce of skill will easily defend or counter such stupid attacks. Where as jump shooting with a bow was beyond ridiculous and allowed infinite kiting, it is much more believeable to jump and swing with a sword than it is to jump, knock an arrow, pull back bowstring and fire upon landing.
Also, recently watched an excellent documentary where they demonstrated alot of stuff, like a guy in a 40lb suit of full plate armour made to fit him, was running across a field with a sword at a decent pace, was very agile and could easily run up to and mount his own horse.
exactly... and 40lbs = 18 kilograms.. so like a rus scale armor / lamellar armor. a full plate would weight about 55-60lbs. the game measurements aren't so wrong. the sword of war is very similar to the one i have and is nearly 2-3 centimeters longer. i don't have a scale so i can't weight it but i think it's around 1.5-1.8 kgs. (3.3-3.9 lbs)
So YOU killed Meredith Kercher...
Too soon?
I just want to point out, in an actual game, Jumping will likely get you killed too. I fail to see why people are bitching about jump slashing. I mean, unless you totally want cav to get a free couch off anyone without a polearm, go right the hell on. Lobby for your ridiculous nerf.
i have a kind of greatsword made by a local smith. is not keen but is made with the blade in stainless steel, iron hilt, iron grip covered by several layers of synthetic leather. weights about 1.7 kilograms and is 118 centimeters long. sometimes i go in the garden random swinging around. today i tried to jump forward and side slash. is possible BUT you can't stop the swing mid air (i think it's because you need waist force together with firm legs on the ground). doing a overhead jumping is easy. swinging sides is a bit weird but doable... without stopping it (like unbalanced weapons) and the thrust is comfortable BUT in the landing part. thrusting in the first part of the jump feel a bit stupid.
i don't have a cam so don't troll me about "no proof".
I believe you have tried all that, but now think how it would be with an enemy who blocks your hit or you really aiming for someone and the guy dodging so you just miss. Hitting through the air is one thing. But aiming for something and then not hitting cause of a dodging target is something completely different. I know what I'm talking about as I'm doing martial arts for more than 12 years now.
Hard to explain everything on my mind in English, can't we just speak German?^^
If you jump and a person blocks your hit, all your energy is stopped or redirected to another direction. As you are midair, you have no ground to get a stable position, means you are like a ball getting a hit midair. You change your direction and the chance you land on your feet without stumbling or falling is very small in that case. ---> makes it more or less impossible to use that in a fight ;)
What happens when you jump and hit with all your power and your target is just ducking under your swing so it continues, you can figure our yourself^^
Fact is, jumphitting might be possible, but it is useless and not doable while fighting
i really dont see why this change was made or why ppl rage so much about it, havnt changed enything