Author Topic: Satiric newspaper attacked in France  (Read 23359 times)

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Offline Leshma

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #165 on: January 08, 2015, 02:04:41 pm »
0
On the other side the middle age provided us with important juristic regulations and not to forget groundbreaking technology like printing. One can't stress enough how important the ability of printing and thus for other people than highest of society to read was for the development of our culture.

Note that this all are very complex themes I tried to simplify in short sentences.

Complex themes they are, as Yoda said would but... you're not doing yourself a favor mixing different periods. I'm talking about early middle age known as Dark Age, and you are mentioning late middle age just before period of Renaissance, which is the period when printing press was invented.

Offline Xant

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #166 on: January 08, 2015, 02:10:17 pm »
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Cool fictional story bro, but some random copied books by Christian monks weigh nothing on the grand scale of things.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Baghdad_%281258%29

Those kind of things do.
Meaning lies as much
in the mind of the reader
as in the Haiku.

Offline Leshma

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #167 on: January 08, 2015, 02:15:10 pm »
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The dark ages because of relgion is a debunked myth, in truth the monasteries and clergy were centers and keepers of knowledge. The difference in advancment is because since the invention of printing the knowledge became easier to spread and available to much more people. Before that it was meticulously and painstakingly copied by hand by the same clergy that people ironically now comdemn as the reason for dark age "igrnorance".

How is that different from what it was written in history books for elementary school 30-50 years ago? First you start with debunked myth, then you write the same knowledge that was always presented to kids in every school worldwide. Don't get the where the catch is?

They were called Dark Ages because barbarians pillaged and burned down advanced society that proceeded them, nowhere I mention it is because of religion. Muslim fundamentalists of today (talibans for example) aren't much different than Vandals, Visigoths and Huns from Asia. What characterizes them is complete lack of respect for different cultures.

Offline Xant

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #168 on: January 08, 2015, 02:18:59 pm »
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They were called Dark Ages because barbarians pillaged and burned down advanced society that proceeded them, nowhere I mention it is because of religion. Muslim fundamentalists of today (talibans for example) aren't much different than Vandals, Visigoths and Huns from Asia. What characterizes them is complete lack of respect for different cultures.
And incompetency and the inability to actually do what they threaten they're going to do.
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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #169 on: January 08, 2015, 02:19:44 pm »
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Scientist were harrassed by religious... DAT is dark age of Science in Europe.

Arabs were very much OP in science in these times because they got the ancient Greek knowlege science and philosophy books)
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Offline The_Bloody_Nine

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #170 on: January 08, 2015, 02:23:33 pm »
+1
Complex themes they are, as Yoda said would but... you're not doing yourself a favor mixing different periods. I'm talking about early middle age known as Dark Age, and you are mentioning late middle age just before period of Renaissance, which is the period when printing press was invented.

mh?

What I am mainly talking about in my post is that the first unification of Europe after the Roman Empire done by Charlemagne in the 8th century would have been unthinkable without the christianization.

printing was just an additional example for the middle age in general being not so dark.


They were called Dark Ages because barbarians pillaged and burned down advanced society that proceeded them

That's just really outdated, leshma. Historians don't think about it that way anymore.

Offline Leshma

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #171 on: January 08, 2015, 02:30:35 pm »
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Please, enlighten me? That is natural cycle that is happening for centuries. For example when partisans defeated Wehrmacht soldiers and entered their houses and houses of other wealthy Germans that lived in occupied area, they burned down expensive furniture to heat themselves during winter. And held cattle in areas designated for humans. That is because they lived in the forest for half a decade, they were basically cavemen. After some time them and their kids became 'culturally advanced'.

Now you want to tell me how barbarians who pillaged Roman Empire were actually more culturally and technologically advanced than high classes of Roman society? Is that your inner German pride speaking or you're just trollling me?

Offline Umbra

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #172 on: January 08, 2015, 02:35:08 pm »
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Cool fictional story bro, but some random copied books by Christian monks weigh nothing on the grand scale of things.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Baghdad_%281258%29

Those kind of things do.

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Offline FleetFox

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #173 on: January 08, 2015, 02:44:07 pm »
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Historians named that period of early medieval and post Roman as dark ages simply because there are very few academic and primary sources for historians to analyse. Like Casimir said there have been new ones found but they mostly come from church records and can be very inaccurate and bias, for example the Anglo Saxon Chronicle and later contemporary texts illustrating the vikings as spawns of satan devil types who were all giants etc.

Nowadays the correct term is Early Middle ages or Early Medieval.

but yeah back on topic, religion has caused some horrific wars and conflicts, the 30 years War as mentioned saw the most people killed in a religious war, if I remembered correctly from my history class, just brutal, a seriously bad time for people who lived in what we know as modern day germany especially.
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Offline The_Bloody_Nine

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #174 on: January 08, 2015, 02:49:17 pm »
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Please, enlighten me? That is natural cycle that is happening for centuries. For example when partisans defeated Wehrmacht soldiers and entered their houses and houses of other wealthy Germans that lived in occupied area, they burned down expensive furniture to heat themselves during winter. And held cattle in areas designated for humans. That is because they lived in the forest for half a decade, they were basically cavemen. After some time them and their kids became 'culturally advanced'.

Now you want to tell me how barbarians who pillaged Roman Empire were actually more culturally and technologically advanced than high classes of Roman society? Is that your inner German pride speaking or you're just trollling me?

who is mixing historical periods now?

I still try to keep this simple:

1. What exactly is your point? That every human becomes barbaric under certain conditions? No disagreement there.
2. My initial argument was that christianity proved to be very helpful in many periods of history (example charlemagne) to establish political and civilizing structures.
3. Historians don't refer to the early middle age as Dark age anymore because of various reasons, for example while there has been a lot of destruction there also has been a lot of continuation and development.

Offline Swaggart

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #175 on: January 08, 2015, 02:55:28 pm »
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You're right, this would stop all terrorist attacks, how simple. It never occurred to me that treating all religions like shit and outlawing them would stop all terrorist attacks, rather than cause extremists of all religions to engage in similar acts of terrorism. Also you'd be lowering the bar on 'extremism' since you'd be giving them a legitimate reason to fight back, people who are more than content to live normal peaceful lives now would be pushed to desperate means. Hell i'm an atheist and i wouldnt stand for that shit, i'd want to do everything possible to ensure that anyone instituting that policy did not enjoy a long and happy career.

And there was me thinking that it was the stupid 'them or us' philosophy that made us backwards and underdeveloped, turns out it's just 'their' fault. I thought i was challenging you to stop it *without* implementing hilariously similar values to the extremists that made life worse for everyone.

At least the violent backlash would be enough to make sure no politician ever has the balls to do the same thing ever again, regardless of how small-minded or racist they are.

Wow. Quite a response. I'm surprised there is anyone left to defend religion other than the people involved in the delusion. What's the point of defending practices and beliefs that do nothing except hold back human progress and are exclusionary and sectarian in nature? Just because some people believe in them? People used to be convinced the earth was flat.

We would ridicule anyone that believed in the 1600 or so "gods" that humanity has cooked up in the past, why are we holding onto this last one?

Offline LordBerenger

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #176 on: January 08, 2015, 03:09:21 pm »
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Scientist were harrassed by religious... DAT is dark age of Science in Europe.

Arabs were very much OP in science in these times because they got the ancient Greek knowlege science and philosophy books)

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Offline Oberyn

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #177 on: January 08, 2015, 03:12:28 pm »
+2
Everything about this subject has already been said on this forum. I'll just say it again. Western cultures are the most peaceful, tolerant and prosperous on the entire planet. Admitting as much is racist though, and must be riddled with caveats about how we don't really deserve it and the only redeeming feature of western civilization is blind fucking luck. The usual fucking suspects crying about "racism" (Islam isn't a RACE YOU FUCKING MORONS) were predictable. It's the Neo-white man's burden retard script, the europeans with their colonialism and warmongering are responsible for all the evils of the world, muslims are absolutely not responsible in any way for the mores and ideals they enshrine in law everywhere they are a majority. And then you fuckers wonder why 2nd and 3rd generation children of immigrants are even more radicalized than their parents.
A lot of the "moderates" response is basically "Horrible! This is not Islam! These are not muslims! But you know, that's what happens when you play with fire". Then there are the ones straight up celebrating. And of course the usual "This is a CIA/Mossad false flag attack to make Islam look bad!". You fuckers need to start exploring the "arab" portion of the internet, google translate works good enough. This shit is all over the place. Belligerent islamic self-pity, blaming everything but the obvious, the go-to response anytime stuff like this happens.

In contrast, look to the vietnamese immigrants in France and their descendents. Strange, a people from a land that was colonized, brutally exploited, occupied and are from a different "race" (in fact much more distinct. Muslim immigration in France is largely maghrebin. A huge number of maghrebin are "white". They could easily pass as italian, spanish, portuguese, south french, mediterranean in general, and some of them indeed do that. A lybian guy I know likes to pass himself off as italian in clubs and bars, and fuck I gotta admit it works. Italian is a sexy language). It's almost as if there is a common denominator for immigrants refusing to integrate, who hold mores and ideals anthetical to their host nations and in fact loathe the identity itself, eventually leading to political acts of violence. I WONDER WHAT IT IS.
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Offline Oberyn

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #178 on: January 08, 2015, 03:24:40 pm »
+3
who is mixing historical periods now?

I still try to keep this simple:

1. What exactly is your point? That every human becomes barbaric under certain conditions? No disagreement there.
2. My initial argument was that christianity proved to be very helpful in many periods of history (example charlemagne) to establish political and civilizing structures.
3. Historians don't refer to the early middle age as Dark age anymore because of various reasons, for example while there has been a lot of destruction there also has been a lot of continuation and development.

Leshma thinks he's being clever with the whole cyclic nature of history thing, but if that was true you'd be able to easily map and identify the cycles with the historical knowledge we have. Much smarter and knowledgeable people than him have tried, and have failed. I think it's just because he's a coward defeatist piece of shit. It's just his way of saying it's inevitable and we should just bend over and get fucked by muslim immigrants and get it over with.
Which I think is passing ironic: "Ugh stupid evil racists are afraid of muslims for no reason, it's just because they're naturally evil and racist" followed by "Anyways, it's normal to have "barbarians" take over "advanced" cultures, this is just a natural historic cycle, your cultures and identities will disappear and that is normal". It's the logical conclusion of multicultural political correctness. It's a deliberate attempt to make cultural melting pots, but I guess the fucking idiots forgot you need a pot to melt them in. If you break the pot, shatter it, say it's a worthless piece of shit and any other pot in the world is just as good, there is nothing that makes this pot unique or good, OF COURSE the ingredients aren't going to mix. You're just going to have competing pots each simmering off on their own corner.
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Offline WarLord

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Re: Satiric newspaper attacked in France
« Reply #179 on: January 08, 2015, 03:25:59 pm »
0
Everything about this subject has already been said on this forum. I'll just say it again. Western cultures are the most peaceful, tolerant and prosperous on the entire planet. Admitting as much is racist though, and must be riddled with caveats about how we don't really deserve it and the only redeeming feature of western civilization is blind fucking luck. The usual fucking suspects crying about "racism" (Islam isn't a RACE YOU FUCKING MORONS) were predictable. It's the Neo-white man's burden retard script, the europeans with their colonialism and warmongering are responsible for all the evils of the world, muslims are absolutely not responsible in any way for the mores and ideals they enshrine in law everywhere they are a majority. And then you fuckers wonder why 2nd and 3rd generation children of immigrants are even more radicalized than their parents.
A lot of the "moderates" response is basically "Horrible! This is not Islam! These are not muslims! But you know, that's what happens when you play with fire". Then there are the ones straight up celebrating. And of course the usual "This is a CIA/Mossad false flag attack to make Islam look bad!". You fuckers need to start exploring the "arab" portion of the internet, google translate works good enough. This shit is all over the place. Belligerent islamic self-pity, blaming everything but the obvious, the go-to response anytime stuff like this happens.

In contrast, look to the vietnamese immigrants in France and their descendents. Strange, a people from a land that was colonized, brutally exploited, occupied and are from a different "race" (in fact much more distinct. Muslim immigration in France is largely maghrebin. A huge number of maghrebin are "white". They could easily pass as italian, spanish, portuguese, south french, mediterranean in general, and some of them indeed do that. A lybian guy I know likes to pass himself off as italian in clubs and bars, and fuck I gotta admit it works. Italian is a sexy language). It's almost as if there is a common denominator for immigrants refusing to integrate, who hold mores and ideals anthetical to their host nations and in fact loathe the identity itself, eventually leading to political acts of violence. I WONDER WHAT IT IS.

wow much racist ban he !111 he must not say something like that, it's so racist .... chocolate chip cookie, racist.
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