Crossbow heirlooming.

[Tomas_of_Miles]

have about 85 hp and 78 body armor 1 loomed xbow took me down to 10 hp with 1 bolt... balanced my ass

Headshot? Shot in the foot?

[Tzar]

body

Headshot??? are we playing the same game??  pretty sure no1 can survive that..

[Darkkarma]

body

Headshot??? are we playing the same game??  pretty sure no1 can survive that..

You're crazy/working with a terrible build/gear if you get 1 shot by any bow regardless of masterwork level.

[Cepeshi]

With the pierce bow i get half hp down whilst hit in my triple loomed plate and gloves that got totally like 70body armor, but, on the contrary to the xbow, the bow can shoot me three times in the time it takes the xbower to reload, so yeah, its fine.

[Phew]

have about 85 hp and 78 body armor 1 loomed xbow took me down to 10 hp with 1 bolt... balanced my ass

A Masterwork Arbalest with MW Steel bolts at pointe blank range does an average of 34.5 damage to 78 armor, with a maximum damage of 48.

Even a head shot has zero chance of one-shotting you unless you are wearing below a Spiked Cap (32 armor). Again, that's from a 6-times heirloomed weapon at pointe-blank range.

[Dravic]

Phew, there was a post by Paul where he says that headshot from ranged is... 200% or 210% dmg


And there are different bones and places on human's body with different dmg possitive or negative bonus, so...

;)

[Jacko]

Yeah, not sure about the rest but head shot, as far as I have experienced, always kills with a mw arbalest and bolts.

[Tavuk_Bey]

(click to show/hide)

xbows cost any skill points? Bows need like 7pd to deal crazy damg like your xbow
do you even need wpf to use it at all? bows need like 100wpf+ to even get ok aim... your xbow has better aim at 0wpf then my long bow at 126wpf....

its is op because anyone can pick it up and 1 shot people... Great range weapon for no trade off...

lol xbow is better cuz it's a fukken xbow, have you ever tried to use a real xbow? noob archers..

[Rumblood]

With the pierce bow i get half hp down whilst hit in my triple loomed plate and gloves that got totally like 70body armor, but, on the contrary to the xbow, the bow can shoot me three times in the time it takes the xbower to reload, so yeah, its fine.

Blatant lie. Long bow takes 2 weeks to draw and THAT's the bow with pierce. 

[Bulzur]

Back to the main post :

I clearly understand why xbow's heirlooms give so much damage (no benefit from anywhere else), and i agree with it.
BUT, cause there is a but, i don't understand why their other stats got so much benefits.

Let's compare it with the heirloomed bow (wich are REALLY interesting also) : (all stats BUT damage will be compared)

Heavy Crossbow (Masterwork)
Accuracy : 94 (97)           => +3  (+3,2%)
Speed rating : 23 (26)    => +3  (+13%)
Missile speed : 56 (60)   => +4   (+7,1%)

Strong bow (Masterwork)
Accuracy : 97 (99)           => +2  (+2,06%)
Speed rating : 63 (65)    => +2  (+3,17%)
Missile speed : 51 (54)   => +3  (+5,9%)

So... hum... basically, normal crossbows are balanced because they take lots of time to reload, compared to bows. But thoses heirloomed crossbows are 13% faster. o_O
Also, it's always possible to dodge arrows even at close distance, whereas it's close to impossible for crossbows. So why give heirloom crossbows so much better missile speed, speed rating and accuracy ?

I understand for damage, because wpf doesn't give any profits from it, but what about accuracy and reload time ? And may i remind people, that for bows, the more PD you have the less accuracy gained from wpf you have.

I really feel like masterwork xbows got the stats of a 4 times heirloomed (except for damage, wich is... fine.)

PS: I don't have longbow nor Arbalest, and didn't want to buy them just for a post who will be seen by may 40 people, 30 of them actually caring about balance, and 1 of them (hopefully) having a vote in it. So i don't know for other bow/xbows.

[Paul]

Missile speed is increased with powerdraw and it is a relative increase depended on the base projectile speed the bow provides.

[Bulzur]

Missile speed is increased with powerdraw and it is a relative increase depended on the base projectile speed the bow provides.

I didn't know missile speed was increase by power draw !
Thanks for this information.

But it's not that big of an increase, since even with 6 PD and a mw strongbow, i "feel" like my arrows are less faster than a bolt shot from an xbow. It must be just a feeling though, i'll pay more attention to it ingame.

So we can say this missile speed "bonus" from PD, negates the "malus" for effective wpf from the same PD.
Wich still puts heirloomed xbow with greater accuracy and speed rating, wich are one of the (if not "THE") two most important things for a ranged weapon.

[Gurnisson]

Wich still puts heirloomed xbow with greater accuracy and speed rating, wich are one of the (if not "THE") two most important things for a ranged weapon.

Situational. Crossbows rock in sieges and some urban maps, while the higher rate of fire and maneuverability of the bowmen kicks arse in other types of maps (open fields, some urban etc.)

Also, bolts speed seems to drop a lot from medium range, making it deal quite a bit less damage. Nekkid people surviving shots from fully loomed Arbalest & Steel Bolts and such. Crossbows are awful in rain as well.

[Tears of Destiny]

Situational. Crossbows rock in sieges and some urban maps, while the higher rate of fire and maneuverability of the bowmen kicks arse in other types of maps (open fields, some urban etc.)

Also, bolts speed seems to drop a lot from medium range, making it deal quite a bit less damage. Nekkid people surviving shots from fully loomed Arbalest & Steel Bolts and such. Crossbows are awful in rain as well.

What is it again? Studies suggested something like a 10% penalty for bows and 30% for crossbows or some such thing in the rain? Does anyone have a link to one of those posts that talks about it?

Is the Snow treated as Rain for effecting athletics/shooting etc, or is it just a "fluff" effect like darkness/shadows? EDIT: Snow is not the same, thank you Fasader!

body

Headshot??? are we playing the same game??  pretty sure no1 can survive that..

I have seen it. Masterwork Warbow and Strongbows using regular arrows as well as bodkins, shot Tydeus in the head several matches and me/rest of the death squad were astounded to see him still ticking. One of the matches we even shot him twice in the head, or saw him take bolts to the head as well. I think he is a 24/12 or 27/12 build or something like that...

Of course, this was at long range with damage drop-off, as well as him being a STR build with that fantastic lordly top-tier helm of his.

[Bulzur]

Situational. Crossbows rock in sieges and some urban maps, while the higher rate of fire and maneuverability of the bowmen kicks arse in other types of maps (open fields, some urban etc.)

Also, bolts speed seems to drop a lot from medium range, making it deal quite a bit less damage. Nekkid people surviving shots from fully loomed Arbalest & Steel Bolts and such. Crossbows are awful in rain as well.

It's not situational since i'm talking about the heirloom bonus.

I won't compare the "base" bow vs "base" xbow, since i know they have different uses, different strengths and weakness. But the heirloom stats of the xbow are, imo, overpowered. Especially the accuracy and speed rating.
A slight -1 speed rating of the current masterwork xbows would already be better, even if it doesn't change that much.