Crossbow heirlooming.

[Peasant_Woman]

So your argument is that if you cant 1 shot people with the heirloomed awp sniper xbow they wont use it anymore?? 

And thus it shouldnt get a heirloom nerf like every other item in the game??

Sound alot like the throwing lance whine crowd.. 

Anyways like i said yesterday im not gonna borther fighten with people who´s sense of balance is utter fuckin trash....

lmao....

Buckle your seatbelts;

(click to show/hide)

Throwing lances are 56pierce and take 6 PT to use. Extra damage from PT pushes it up by 26.88 damage if each piont gives 8% damage. 82 pierce when PT is taken into account, 1 more than the basic arbalest with normal bolts, with steel bolts arbalest can swing 87 pierce, 5 more than lances. But! PT can also make it scale to 100.8 pierce on the basic item at PT 10 before we even start on heirlooms. At masterwork Lances are 60 pierce, with PT 9 they deal 103.2 pierce, PT 10 they deal 108 pierce. While crossbows damage does not scale with anything.

Masterwork arbalest with masterwork steel bolts is 100 pierce damage total. Still less than masterwork lances with PT 9 or 10 and it takes 6 heirlooms to get there instead of 3 like lances.

But Peasant_Woman! Lances are horribly inaccurate even at close ranges!

But I estimate that you could throw 4 lances (probably more) in the time it takes to shoot and reload an arbalest. Throwing lances can also be used in melee whereas an arbalest + steel bolts is 3 slots gone already. Arbalest + 2x steel bolts is 4 slots, leaving you with a 0slot hammer for melee protection . Sadly due to recent nerfs all throwing items suffer from a serious lack of ammo/slot issues which is wrong and should be adressed, however the rest of the argument is solid and boils down to;

Arbalest has damage and accuracy with awful speed + serious lack of melee capability.
Throwing Lances have damage and speed with awful accuracy + ability to switch to melee if needed. (and awful ammo/slot problems, this should be fixed)

[Radix]

Buckle your seatbelts;

(click to show/hide)

Throwing lances are 56pierce and take 6 PT to use. Extra damage from PT pushes it up by 26.88 damage if each piont gives 8% damage. 82 pierce when PT is taken into account, 1 more than the basic arbalest with normal bolts, with steel bolts arbalest can swing 87 pierce, 5 more than lances. But! PT can also make it scale to 100.8 pierce on the basic item at PT 10 before we even start on heirlooms. At masterwork Lances are 60 pierce, with PT 9 they deal 103.2 pierce, PT 10 they deal 108 pierce. While crossbows damage does not scale with anything.

Masterwork arbalest with masterwork steel bolts is 100 pierce damage total. Still less than masterwork lances with PT 9 or 10 and it takes 6 heirlooms to get there instead of 3 like lances.

But Peasant_Woman! Lances are horribly inaccurate even at close ranges!

But I estimate that you could throw 4 lances (probably more) in the time it takes to shoot and reload an arbalest. Throwing lances can also be used in melee whereas an arbalest + steel bolts is 3 slots gone already. Arbalest + 2x steel bolts is 4 slots, leaving you with a 0slot hammer for melee protection . Sadly due to recent nerfs all throwing items suffer from a serious lack of ammo/slot issues which is wrong and should be adressed, however the rest of the argument is solid and boils down to;

Arbalest has damage and accuracy with awful speed + serious lack of melee capability.
Throwing Lances have damage and speed with awful accuracy + ability to switch to melee if needed. (and awful ammo/slot problems, this should be fixed)

For tzar ur arguments are still fail cose they are not his arguments

[Darkkarma]

Buckle your seatbelts;

(click to show/hide)

Throwing lances are 56pierce and take 6 PT to use. Extra damage from PT pushes it up by 26.88 damage if each piont gives 8% damage. 82 pierce when PT is taken into account, 1 more than the basic arbalest with normal bolts, with steel bolts arbalest can swing 87 pierce, 5 more than lances. But! PT can also make it scale to 100.8 pierce on the basic item at PT 10 before we even start on heirlooms. At masterwork Lances are 60 pierce, with PT 9 they deal 103.2 pierce, PT 10 they deal 108 pierce. While crossbows damage does not scale with anything.

Masterwork arbalest with masterwork steel bolts is 100 pierce damage total. Still less than masterwork lances with PT 9 or 10 and it takes 6 heirlooms to get there instead of 3 like lances.

But Peasant_Woman! Lances are horribly inaccurate even at close ranges!

But I estimate that you could throw 4 lances (probably more) in the time it takes to shoot and reload an arbalest. Throwing lances can also be used in melee whereas an arbalest + steel bolts is 3 slots gone already. Arbalest + 2x steel bolts is 4 slots, leaving you with a 0slot hammer for melee protection . Sadly due to recent nerfs all throwing items suffer from a serious lack of ammo/slot issues which is wrong and should be adressed, however the rest of the argument is solid and boils down to;

Arbalest has damage and accuracy with awful speed + serious lack of melee capability.
Throwing Lances have damage and speed with awful accuracy + ability to switch to melee if needed. (and awful ammo/slot problems, this should be fixed)

I think you're casting pearls before swines at this point. 

[Gurnisson]

Your arguments are total fail..

My arguments are fair. I knew that if I got an answer like this, explaining it to you would be a waste of time, because you can't look at it from other's point of view.

3rd. it requires 0 wpf to be usefull i have played with the sniper xbow for ages so dont try and say that it does we all know its just a side arm for kdr whores....

3 Fucking slots with a reloadtime of half the round with 0 wpf. Sniper Xbow was a sidearm for many before the patches, it's not that anymore! You get killed by dedicated xbowers, and shouldn't they be able to kill you like any other class? No, according to yourself the crossbow should have a lot lower damage, as well as being ridiculously slow. I don't whine when I get one-hitted by GLA or GLB in medium armor. Why? I know it's not completely easymode, and being a crossbower is definitely not easymode.

Also, you want more speed and less damage on crossbows? Try native, and don't even dare say that it's more balanced. Crossbows are op on native, they're not on crpg.

[Damug]

My arguments are fair. I knew that if I got an answer like this, explaining it to you would be a waste of time, because you can't look at it from other's point of view.

3 Fucking slots with a reloadtime of half the round with 0 wpf. Sniper Xbow was a sidearm for many before the patches, it's not that anymore! You get killed by dedicated xbowers, and shouldn't they be able to kill you like any other class? No, according to yourself the crossbow should have a lot lower damage, as well as being ridiculously slow. I don't whine when I get one-hitted by GLA or GLB in medium armor. Why? I know it's not completely easymode, and being a crossbower is definitely not easymode.

Also, you want more speed and less damage on crossbows? Try native, and don't even dare say that it's more balanced. Crossbows are op on native, they're not on crpg.

One solution to all these 'omg xbow heirlooms' complaints would be to throw love to base crossbows and nerf the hell out of the heirlooms too, right?  That way people wouldn't see such vast improvements over the triple heirloomed item and the base crossbow and thus probably won't come crying to the forums about it after their favorite weapon's heirlooms were just neutered.

[Gurnisson]

One solution to all these 'omg xbow heirlooms' complaints would be to throw love to base crossbows and nerf the hell out of the heirlooms too, right?  That way people wouldn't see such vast improvements over the triple heirloomed item and the base crossbow and thus probably won't come crying to the forums about it after their favorite weapon's heirlooms were just neutered.

And then we're back to the 'omg sidearmers, lol high damagepierce!1! NERF!1!'.

I see your point, but with all these whiners, it's just a vicious cycle you can't get out of.

[Peasant_Woman]

The dedicated crossbowman is a viable build finally which is wonderful, they are well balanced against other forms of ranged. The only real issue is players who take one as a sidearm with little or no investment and shotgun with it.

[Jacko]

The dedicated crossbowman is a viable build finally which is wonderful, they are well balanced against other forms of ranged. The only real issue is players who take one as a sidearm with little or no investment and shotgun with it.

This. Xbows are in a good place. You might tweak the looming, but lacking scaling you can hardly call em OP.

[Gnjus]

I agree everything got nerfed except crossbows its really smell like the dev use this sidearm

Yes, there is this smelly dedicated dev(iant) crossbowman, cca 170 wpf in crossbows, 3x loomed Arbalest:

http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php?action=profile;u=8, on our thread poll he got 15 votes, i could name every single one of them, starting from Ronald Meliosandro, Dave, Gurnisson, Jacko and 11 more crossbowmen who's names i won't even mention here. 

(click to show/hide)

too bad he can't hit shit but still.....

[DonNicko]

I have played on DTV with heirloomed arbalest. And in the first wave there were peasants. Some peasants I kill with one shot, but some by two. wpf is 140. And if peasant stay far from me always by two shots. and this is 100 pierce. The air reduction does its work. Really I disappointed with that. So in theory I should kill them by one shot, but in practice it takes 2 shots, and I cant 1 shot the archers as I did before this patch. Maybe something will change

[Tzar]

There something called minimum average and maximum dmg dipshits.....

So yeah sometimes you maybe wont 1hit evrything

[DonNicko]

But peasants, that wear I can say nothing, I should kill with 1 shot I think. About 80 % of shots doesnt kill. Peasants I kill about 70 % by 1 shot.

[Siiem]

But peasants, that wear I can say nothing, I should kill with 1 shot I think. About 80 % of shots doesnt kill. Peasants I kill about 70 % by 1 shot.

Actually you're better spent using your valuable steel bolt on someone armoured then trying to shoot a peasent... bring a cheaper crossbow to DTV, then you can have a better melee weapon aswell.

[Cepeshi]

how come Tzar is complaining about xbows when mostly i see him running around with the CT hammer cmon, man up, dodge the xbowers and ur fine...

to speak more about the issue, my friend rolled dedicated xbowman, loomed the arbalest three times, bolts unloomed, and it rarely happens he oneshot kills someone, unless he is like 10metres away (or headshot), for spending huge amount of time (3gens) in order to get weapon, which is slow as hell, to comparable lvl with bows (which, as mentioned before, get bonuses from stats) i would say its fine how it is now

PS: one of the bows is pierce aswell, so ur argument OMG XBOW PIERCE NURF is obsolete

[Tzar]

have about 85 hp and 78 body armor 1 loomed xbow took me down to 10 hp with 1 bolt... balanced my ass