why do native players hate crpg?

[Varadin]

How can you even compare Native to cRPG, 2 totally different mods ...

[Corsair831]

You're right, pin point accurate, speed of light arrows shooting across a whole random plains or steppe map and able to hit my horse (the fastest one in the game) a majority of the time is balanced.  Good call.

The only time you're safe on a horse is if you're behind a hill, or the archers have another target they are aiming for.

how are you not getting this, native is balanced for competitive play, as far as public play yes it's not well balanced, but hell, neither's crpg

[CrazyCracka420]

how are you not getting this, native is balanced for competitive play, as far as public play yes it's not well balanced, but hell, neither's crpg

That's not balanced for competitive play in my opinion.  Just because there are more clan matches in native than crpg, doesn't mean it's better balanced for competition.  Correlation does not equal causation. 

Also laughing at these people discussing duels like that's how you determine how skilled someone is at this game.  Warband has never been about duels.  It's a team game where you fight in battlefields and sieges. 

[Casimir]

Wait wait wait... Who gives a fuck if native players 'hate' cRPG?  Why is such a thing even worthy of discussion?

[Christo]

Because they are a bunch of elitists, who still want to fight with great swords in tournament armor only.

Even after 4 years

(click to show/hide)

(soon to be)

[Corsair831]

That's not balanced for competitive play in my opinion.  Just because there are more clan matches in native than crpg, doesn't mean it's better balanced for competition.  Correlation does not equal causation. 

Also laughing at these people discussing duels like that's how you determine how skilled someone is at this game.  Warband has never been about duels.  It's a team game where you fight in battlefields and sieges.

i give up

[CrazyCracka420]

You (and others) have said native is more balanced for competition.  Care to elaborate? Like I said in this thread already, I played Warband beta, I played multiplayer religiously until I switched over to crpg (around late winter/early spring 2011) and still played native MP Warband all the time until about the end of summer 2011.  And I disagree that native is more balanced for competition.  I think archers are the top dog in native competition. 

[Corsair831]

ok, fine, i'll explain it

'skill' in crpg/native comes down to ability to defend, attack, movement, awareness and ability to work in a team, all to varying levels

defend - is easier in cRPG because the weapons are much much slower and you have a long time to block; as well as having a lot more HP + armour
attack - is easier in cRPG because the weapons are slower and much bigger (making it easier to hit), meaning much more of your successful attacks in cRPG are spams and not feints (spam which is heavily luck reliant)
movement - you have to worry a lot lot lot less about archers and cavalry in cRPG, because whilst cavalry are still a bit of a fighting force for different reasons than they are in native, archers in cRPG are just a joke; also, the longer weapon reach means you have to think much less about being in position in melee as you can hit someone from the other side of the melee
awareness - reduced need because you have a lot more hp / armour, as well as the important fact that the archers are very weak so you don't need to watch out for them anywhere near as much
ability to work in a team - locking down a group of archers in a clan match on native takes a lot of coordination and teamwork; by contrast people go 30-0 on cRPG using a 2h

The point is though that someone's ability to duel, or even to kill the guy in front of you, which many cRPG players consider the most important skill, is just nowhere near as important in native; awareness of what's going on and an ability to work in a team is vastly more important.

cRPG is just a lot more lax in terms of skills required to play the game well; the game is easier at a high level. That does not mean it isn't fun in a public setting! Just that a competitive setting would not work

[CrazyCracka420]

I read that post, and I don't see how it explains why native is more balanced for competition.  Archers aren't a joke in crpg.  I think native's weapon speeds set to "fast, or fastest" doesn't make it more skilled, it makes it more reliant on having low ping.  Playing on fast/fastest melee speed was always dumb IMO.  I would do very well with my normal 25-40 ping, but trying to play with 75-100 ping was nearly impossible on those melee speeds.  It was easily doable on normal melee speeds. 

Your whole post is just saying "crpg is easier", I don't think that explains how native is more balanced for competition.   I don't think crpg is easier at a high level.  Even the best players (who can easily go 20-1 or 20-0) on a battle server, will still have rounds where they are going 15-5, or 12-4.  The difference between doing very well and doing mediocre in crpg is miniscule. 

I've yet to see anyone defend the position that native is more balanced, I wholeheartedly disagree.

[Fartface]

I used to quite alot of scrims and competitions in Native like 2 years ago, and I must say evrything Corsair said about Native being harder as competive is definatly true. Just to give you a small example: you always start the game with head armour uncapable of blocking a single bow or crossbow headshot and the archers and crossbowmen in Native have got pinpoint accuracy and always try to put you in a crossfire.

[Corsair831]

I read that post, and I don't see how it explains why native is more balanced for competition.  Archers aren't a joke in crpg.  I think native's weapon speeds set to "fast, or fastest" doesn't make it more skilled, it makes it more reliant on having low ping.  Playing on fast/fastest melee speed was always dumb IMO.  I would do very well with my normal 25-40 ping, but trying to play with 75-100 ping was nearly impossible on those melee speeds.  It was easily doable on normal melee speeds. 

Your whole post is just saying "crpg is easier", I don't think that explains how native is more balanced for competition.   I don't think crpg is easier at a high level.  Even the best players (who can easily go 20-1 or 20-0) on a battle server, will still have rounds where they are going 15-5, or 12-4.  The difference between doing very well and doing mediocre in crpg is miniscule. 

I've yet to see anyone defend the position that native is more balanced, I wholeheartedly disagree.

have you ever even played a single native clan match? do you notice how all of the guys saying native is more competitive are guys who play both native AND cRPG?

[CrazyCracka420]

Yes I played native competitive matches in the NA community up until spring of 2012.  This is like the 4th of 5th time I've said the same thing (which disagrees with your opinion), in my experience, native is not "better balanced" for competitive play.  It seems very unbalanced in my opinion.  Where as I see crpg has tried to tweak and balanced this game from the beginning, and have a much better balance between classes.  That's talking skills/stats of the classes and equipment.  But also the game mechanics of crpg that have been implemented have generally all been improvements on the game, and added to the balance between classes.

You or anyone else saying native is more balanced for competition have yet to explain your reasoning. 

[Shemaforash]

Hihi, NA still plays random plains, what a joke 

[Razzer]

Yes I played native competitive matches in the NA community up until spring of 2012.  This is like the 4th of 5th time I've said the same thing (which disagrees with your opinion), in my experience, native is not "better balanced" for competitive play.  It seems very unbalanced in my opinion.  Where as I see crpg has tried to tweak and balanced this game from the beginning, and have a much better balance between classes.  That's talking skills/stats of the classes and equipment.  But also the game mechanics of crpg that have been implemented have generally all been improvements on the game, and added to the balance between classes.

You or anyone else saying native is more balanced for competition have yet to explain your reasoning.

You should try to get in touch with this dude:
http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?action=profile;u=75004

He's as mad as you, lel

[CrazyCracka420]

I'm not mad, but that's quite the argument you have there, I'm convinced.