[NEW] Commander Mode

[okiN]

Looking through the thread there are plenty of people who agree with me 

Same applies to them. "You" is also plural. It's pointless to argue, this is a fundamental difference in opinion.

[Thomek]

I actually believe commanders could and should fight.. But only with GREAT risk.

If you die, your troops flee. Also, there should not be possible to be a lancer or even sword and board cav.

Perhaps the armor should be some kind of rich mans outfit? It's just a question of getting the risk of combat high enough. Heck even bumping enemy bots have some power already..

[Butan]

Why not mimic whats in NW (again) ?


In NW, everyone wears tissue armor (no armor, bullets and swords mostly one shot).

Give the commander a very light (but cool looking) armor, and he will stay away from the fight due to being ridiculously easy to kill (also will lower repair cost which is astounding in Commander Mode).
Give him a simple one-handed sword so he can defend himself and kill a few bots but very light armor + average short 1H = you're no hero.

This + the Backspace Order Panel and you get a mode where you can :

- position your troops accurately
- give multiple orders at a glance
- have some personal action
- fear death


Since other commanders would have weapons, you have to protect yourself from them by staying around friendly bots.
Atm you can ride around the map freely, you can only fear a stray shot to the head.

You often encounter enemy commanders and you can only fist pump them, there is no fear in "meeting the enemy". If everyone has a sharp tool at their disposal you could see some Epic Duel that would have a big impact on the battlefield (forcing the enemy bots into fewer and fewer alive commanders's hands to minimize their capacity to do tactics, or find some other penalty when the commander dies).



Then, like chadz, I agree that its a big risk to add weapons due to humans knowing their way around the AI capacity to defend himself...

But I'm sure that we can find a counter-weight to that, or just learn to use the AI to counter such an offensive capacity (I love focusing archer fire on unwary commanders...).

[chadz]

No weapons.
I understand why some of you like it, but maybe this is just not the gamemode for it.
What the game turns into when people have weapons:

People rush, try to kill a few bots right at spawn. Other commanders now have to try to kill other players to defend their bots. The whole focus moves away from the commanding, and instead on "who can use his own skills to shift the favor in his side". It would be battle with a few players and 300 bots. That's not the point of it. I'm not saying it's a bad suggestion, or that it would be a bad gamemode. Just not what this gamemode is about.

So no, weapons will never be part of it. It's simply not your gamemode then. Try DTV.

[Overdriven]

I actually believe commanders could and should fight.. But only with GREAT risk.

If you die, your troops flee. Also, there should not be possible to be a lancer or even sword and board cav.

Perhaps the armor should be some kind of rich mans outfit? It's just a question of getting the risk of combat high enough. Heck even bumping enemy bots have some power already..

Either that or native campaign where dying makes them all auto charge pretty much screwing up any tactical play.

No weapons.
I understand why some of you like it, but maybe this is just not the gamemode for it.
What the game turns into when people have weapons:

People rush, try to kill a few bots right at spawn. Other commanders now have to try to kill other players to defend their bots. The whole focus moves away from the commanding, and instead on "who can use his own skills to shift the favor in his side". It would be battle with a few players and 300 bots. That's not the point of it. I'm not saying it's a bad suggestion, or that it would be a bad gamemode. Just not what this gamemode is about.

So no, weapons will never be part of it. It's simply not your gamemode then. Try DTV.

Out of curiosity where have you seen this happen? Because I've rarely seen that the case. I certainly understand the theory but my experience of other commander modes has never been anything remotely like that.

[okiN]

Heck even bumping enemy bots have some power already..

I actually think that if possible the bots should be set to be immune to bumps by players, and maybe even to completely ignore players unless they're in the flag zone. It's indeed quite easy to influence the battle by distracting them.

[Butan]

Then I suggest a special commander horse that does 0 bump damage and/or rears each time he encounters an obstacle.
Since you can also use bots's horses, would be cool if it was possible that whatever horse you pick, you still got these horses "nerf" on your player; so you have really 0 tool to influence the outcome of the battle.

(click to show/hide)

Okin's idea is actually even more straightforward than mine

Also the repair bill is a bit high, I dont know for others but I would gladly exchange the gothic plate and 2K5 bill; for a light armor and the probable chance to get one shot (this would remove most of the drawing fire/charge to your commander by moving around enemies bots).

[Overdriven]

I actually think that if possible the bots should be set to be immune to bumps by players, and maybe even to completely ignore players unless they're in the flag zone. It's indeed quite easy to influence the battle by distracting them.

Very easy. You can lead almost an entire unit away by making them follow you.

[Chris_the_Animal]

I like the suggestion of 1 minute of scouting the map and figuring out a tactic with the other commanders.

So your bots spawn after 1 minute and then the battle starts, but before that you can run around with your horse and scout the map and talk to your commander mates.

[Butan]

Spam mode activated :

Backspace Order Panel is copyrighted or can we hope to see it soon ? 
Without the radar if possible, that ruins the surprise element of most battle...

But having a map where you can click "hold position there" is a definite win.
Sometimes you cant be with your commander where you want your troops to hold.
Then I can understand that having to move your commander accordingly to where you want to lead your troops is one of the biggest skill that this commander mode requires.

Only problem is, when you lead multiple troops type, you cant do it efficiently if you need to move them all at once, limiting the "arc" of strategies a bit.
With the current orders possibilities, it is BEST to focus one troop type and to play it very well with other players.
Question would be then : do we want to buff one-troop type commander or allow multiple troops type commander fights to defend themselves as well as the rest ?

[Ronin]

Why do you want backspace to get implemented, I personally find it game breaking and never use it in singleplayer. Of course I do not hold any grudge against it in singleplayer, since it is a sandbox gamemode there. In multiplayer however, if you implement a perfect radar; it would be unwise to not use it.

I believe it is more challenging to depend on your own eyes and observations during the battlefield. You are the commander after all, not a superhuman who can have the full picture of the battlefield. It makes it both more realistic and challenging (in a very good way).

[Overdriven]

Why do you want backspace to get implemented, I personally find it game breaking and never use it in singleplayer. Of course I do not hold any grudge against it in singleplayer, since it is a sandbox gamemode there. In multiplayer however, if you implement a perfect radar; it would be unwise to not use it.

I believe it is more challenging to depend on your own eyes and observations during the battlefield. You are the commander after all, not a superhuman who can have the full picture of the battlefield. It makes it both more realistic and challenging (in a very good way).

Well he did say without the radar. I could agree with that because hiding cavalry and stuff is a great tactic for this mode.

[Butan]

I believe it is more challenging to depend on your own eyes and observations during the battlefield.

I agree, but there is room for improvement on this matter.

Also a "blank map" (without allies or enemies position or topography) would give only the "hold position there" possibility without giving any insight of whats happening on the battlefield at all; you will still have to rely on what you see yourself ! 

[tkn123]

I think an important issue is the combat effectiveness of the Nord scouts. They basically lose against everyone.
There only use would be to run down fleeing soldiers like in total war as there useless at everything else.
Could you implement 'flee the battlefield' like what happens on native?

[Falka]

Give commanders champion courser, plain soldiers have spirited destriers and I have plain courser? Outrage!