archery..

[MrShine]

My last comment about exaggerated/absurd posts was directed at Zagibu, not you.

There already is diminishing returns for archery wpf, just like melee.  It's just that wpf does so much more for ranged than it does melee (increases draw speed accuracy & damage, as well as a requirement per power draw) that it is important to get as much of it as you can.  100 wpf archers are marginally less accurate and fast compared to 160 wpf archers, it's just that every little bit helps so archers try to min/max.

If what I wanted was implemented, full archers would be weaker than now and hybrid archers would be a lot stronger than now.

Exactly, you don't want archers to be strong as archers, you want them to be a melee oriented class that can shoot (we already have that -> crossbowmen & thrower hybrids).  As was mentioned before in this abortion of a thread the slot system was implemented so archers couldn't be as good in melee.  Go figure, people were butthurt about archers who could perform in melee.

In pretty much any multiplayer game ever that I can recall of the top of my head ranged class types tend to try to stay at range.. kiting isn't new and certainly isn't unique to cRPG.

 

[Leshma]

In pretty much any multiplayer game ever that I can recall of the top of my head ranged class types tend to try to stay at range.. kiting isn't new and certainly isn't unique to cRPG.

This game has nothing to do with those games you've played. It's unique.

[MrShine]

I'm not quite sure how to respond to that.

[Tzar]

I'm not quite sure how to respond to that.

Let me translate...

This aint fuckin battlefield 3 or Counter strike

[Leshma]

No GIF this time

[MrShine]

Let me translate...

This aint fuckin battlefield 3 or Counter strike

You don't kite in battlefield 3 or counterstrike... I'm saying in games where there are melee classes and ranged classes the ranged classes tend to -you know- avoid getting in melee and kiting is common.  That applies everywhere, crpg is certainly not unique to that.

[Leshma]

You mean MMORPGs like WoW. Yeah we have something in common with those, unfortunately. But what I'm trying to say is that we shouldn't have anything in common with MMORPGs because those games suxxx.

[MrShine]

I'm saying pretty much every multiplayer game where there are different ranged classes and melee classes fighting each other. 

[Dezilagel]

Yep, there are always those who like to stay out of the actual fight and just be huge annoyance while promoting camping and defensive boring gameplay (snipers i.e archers in M@B) and those lamers who like stealth mechanics and backstabbing (Theif/Rouge styles, cav in M@B).

I will never understand some people.

[Moncho]

Classes which of course are not the holy knight in shiny armour, but which can be more effective, and useful to the team than those.
It is so much easier to conquer something by stealth (a tunnel and collapse the walls, poison the king, get a guy to open the gates, etc) than it is to charge the walls with plated guys that will get tossed down as soon as they get to the top.
So yeah, a lesson in life: life is not fair, its not the honourable (altough in this case the one who pretends to be has no problems with lolstabs, hitslashing, etc, how ironical) that wins, but the smart one, the one who adapts and outsmarts the enemy. Thats why humans got over the rest of species, we arent stronger, or faster, but we developed tools, we used their speed against them, we hid and got them from afar, we thought.

[Dezilagel]

Yep, but this isn't life; this is a game and games are just meant to be fun right?

[MrShine]

Yep, but this isn't life; this is a game and games are just meant to be fun right?

Well, to state the obvious, what is fun to you might not be fun to someone else.

[Dezilagel]

Well, duh. Read my first post in this little "argument".

They may sure have fun, I just don't understand how.

[Moncho]

They may sure have fun, I just don't understand how.

Ill try to explain:
In native, point and shoot takes most of the fun away.
In cRPG, you dont have perfect accuracy, you have a big arrow drop, there is a guy there who may or may not know youre shooting at him:
If he doesnt know, and goes in a straight line, calculating the trajectory and the "chof" when you hear the arrow impact, thats, what gives you a bit of fun.
However, if he knows youre aiming and shooting at him, he will dodge, or he will be behind a shield. If he dodges, being able to calculate the trajectory so that they intersect at a point in space, and hearing that "chof", knowing you got him, thats the fun. If, in addition, its a headshot, and you see him die, thats the big fun.

If you play melee, when you miss a block, get spammed, or just get hit, you get frustrated, if you miss a clear arrow, the same.
If you hit the enemy by spamming: first situation
If you hit the enemy in an intense fight with blocks, holds, feints, etc, then its like the second one.

If you are cav, backstabbing is the first one, getting someone aware is the  second one, and if you get outreached, its the frustration.

In all cases, getting shot while attempting anything else, is frustrating, but so is facing someone and getting backstabbed... So everything has a counterpart in their other parts, and thats why people have fun playing archer (same as with any other class)
again, not everything in the game are the holy shiny armored big sword/pole wielders, there is also a lot of room for other things

[Bobthehero]

Buff swashbuckler !

Aaaah now someone gets it.