archery..

[[ptx]]

You can't really assume he has good accuracy, just because he hit you. He probably just got lucky.
Hitting above shield with a longbow (longbow, right?) = pure luck, unless it was at point-blank.

[Leshma]

He raped everyone with his arrows, not just me. And then came that particular map and archers grew gills...

Off-topic:
Free wpf simply has to go. I'm sick of being a fool with 8 points in WM and having just 40-50 more wpf than someone who didn't put anything in WM. That's bullshit.

[BlackMilk]

He raped everyone with his arrows, not just me. And then came that particular map and archers grew gills...

Off-topic:
Free wpf simply has to go. I'm sick of being a fool with 8 points in WM and having just 40-50 more wpf than someone who didn't put anything in WM. That's bullshit.

a-ha. Your fault that you didn't put 100 wpf into Polearm.

[XyNox]

Dunno about Bagge's damage, seems regular to me. However, yesterday I was playing on one of the smaller servers and there was one archer, Coldblooded_Revenant or something like that. 1. ( Dunno what's his PD but he hits like a truck and is very precise as well. ) Although I have just one shield skill and use Old Heater shield I'm able to block plenty of arrows with it 2. ((even the best archers have problems hitting me when my shield is up)). 3. ( This guy first hit me in the face while I was holding my shield as high as possible ), next thing he ruined my shield in just two shots (can usually take 10 or more, he must have 10 PD) 4. ( and 2 hit raped me most of the time ) (69 body armor). 5. ( He should either deal damage or be precise. ) Having both at the same time is silly.

This isn't just regular archery whine, this is nerf STR whine. It seems that STR builds work very well with archery, again...

1. I know he has +3 longbow and +3 bodkins, I could imagine that grants him the abillity to not skill massive powerdraw and put more points in wm for better accuracy, not sure though. But dont assume itll be sniper-like.

2. I cant tell at what shield lvl the forcefield protects the whole body but when even good archers have problems hitting you when your shield is up lvl 1 shieldskill might be enough to give the old heater arrow godmode.

3. This is a bug. Probably the same bug that causes arrows to pass through players without dealing damage. In this case it was passing through your shield without colliding i guess.

4. Now tell me the range. And dont tell me it was from miles away please.

5. This is exactly the case right now for archers who dont have loomed only stuff. You have to decide weither you want to deal damage, which means you get no melee capability, no ath, no agi, no ps, very low accuracy and very slow firing speed which is only usefull for point blank shooting. You could basicly get rid of the bow, put a few points in powerstrike and youd be more helpful for the team. Or you can go with a fast bow, high ath and mashinegun-kite melees. Same thing here: You dont get +6 loomed gear and youll probably need 10 arrows on med-heavy inf, if they wont even bounce.

Edit: Lvl 35 archers who can do all of the above simultaniously are not considered obviously.

[MrShine]

im just gonna ignore these na players for now, since they seem to be playing a dif game.

It's funny you say that because if you look through the last pages of this thread I've been one of the few people who have actually brought numbers/some actual evidence to the discussion with video testing that I took and numbers from the calculator, all you've done is complain about archery (and teamwork, which is a different issue entirely).

Anyways I encourage you to post video about archery, it's always useful to see evidence to progress discussion.

To try to discredit me because I'm NA is insulting and stupid though.  I'm looking at the same cRPG version you are, the calculator gives me the same numbers that it does you.  The only difference is the meta game and preferred player builds.   I've been to the EU rageball server a few times, and while rageball is probably a terrible example I have noticed lighter armor and probably higher agi builds than a typical NA server. 

...but just because the meta game might favor one thing over another doesn't mean there is an inherent balance problem.  Meta games shift all the time and before long a unit that was once considered 'OP' suddenly becomes much less relevant.

[rufio]

im not sure but i think remembering hearing coldblood reveneant is 10 pd , and also a high lvl like blackbow and hetman.

and shine, ive indeed complained about archery in teamwork yes you are right for if i didnt take teamwork into consideration that would mean i wasnt seeing the big picture.
i will infact take time to make a video when i get back to holland on wednesday, im in england atm. it wont be a vid about showing archery being op, but it will be a teamplay vid with tactics and such ( if i would make it to show archery is op i think my archer buddys wouldnt want to collaborate in the movie ) but i think il be able to show in it the effectivness of sertain tactics, and how to make archers near untouchable. it will be a vid with experienced players thow :3 il keep you updated in this thread i guess.

*edit btw rageball isnt really a good place to look , since people make builds to play rageball as its supposed to be played >> minimal killing , light gear>> maximal passing scoring.
and you shouldnt take internet insults to serieusly:) specially not eu vs na :3

[Bonze]

Archer patch history since 2010 ..
nerf
buff
nerf
buff
nerf
buff
nerf
buff
nerf
buff
nerf
buff
nerf
buff
.....


And this is the 1.000.000 topic about  ranged (machinegun) gayness 

Fail devs fail ...

[Arrowblood]

Leshma: Coldblood is the only archer who is getting  alot of kills with high pd. hes lvl 33 i think ,full mw. He deserves it to kill heavy my old friends cos hes inaccurate like hell. Hes just überskilled.

[rufio]

the question is is accuracy really random or can it be timed..

[Arrowblood]

it is definatly random.

[XyNox]

the question is is accuracy really random or can it be timed..

When using a bow you can either hold your mousebutton or click it. When clicked it will release the arrows as soon as possible = max accuracy. While clickshooting with a longbow, missing stationary targets at mid range is something you cant prevent, no matter how much wpf you have. Its just some sort of gamble sometimes. This also applies to other bows of course, but the longbow is the one most affected by this randomness because of the additional animation-bug-debuff.

[BlindGuy]

When using a bow you can either hold your mousebutton or click it. When clicked it will release the arrows as soon as possible = max accuracy. While clickshooting with a longbow, missing stationary targets at mid range is something you cant prevent, no matter how much wpf you have. Its just some sort of gamble sometimes. This also applies to other bows of course, but the longbow is the one most affected by this randomness because of the additional animation-bug-debuff.

Clickshooting isnt the most accurate, its about half a second after that. But still, I can tell you: With over 160 wpf on a +3 longbow, even point blank shots miss sometimes, similar but not so bad with warbow. You can be stood still, not having fired recently so your Xhair is small, and pull back and release an arrow at an enemy so close they COMPLETELY fill your reticule several times over, and it is STILL not guaranteed hit.

Combine that with: mid-animation hitboxes not being anywhere near the model, arrows sometimes passing completely through players, bucklers and shields that intercept arrows in the air, the odd random arrow that goes into warp drive and vanishes: Melee have it MUCH easier than it should be; archers sometimes get lucky, but always get whined at by players who think because they can block and attack they know how to play the game.

EDIT: I remember a time, after the wpf - weight reductions and the slot system, I could play as attacker on siege without even using a melee weapon, shooting everything that came at me as I walked to flag, and there was STILL only half as much WHINE about it. Then all the crying got worse so I traded for melee weapons: The only ranged that is bothersome is throwing, because nowadays the accuracy on pure thrower isnt that much worse than archers, and their DPS is ridiculously higher. And crossbows ingame are the same as real life: So bundle of sticksy that the Pope banned them from being used to shoot Christians, they are just SO gay, why would u spend half your time in a fluid combat sim, standing still, bent over? makes no sense.

[Gravoth_iii]

Clickshooting isnt the most accurate, its about half a second after that. But still, I can tell you: With over 160 wpf on a +3 longbow, even point blank shots miss sometimes, similar but not so bad with warbow. You can be stood still, not having fired recently so your Xhair is small, and pull back and release an arrow at an enemy so close they COMPLETELY fill your reticule several times over, and it is STILL not guaranteed hit.

Combine that with: mid-animation hitboxes not being anywhere near the model, arrows sometimes passing completely through players, bucklers and shields that intercept arrows in the air, the odd random arrow that goes into warp drive and vanishes: Melee have it MUCH easier than it should be; archers sometimes get lucky, but always get whined at by players who think because they can block and attack they know how to play the game.

EDIT: I remember a time, after the wpf - weight reductions and the slot system, I could play as attacker on siege without even using a melee weapon, shooting everything that came at me as I walked to flag, and there was STILL only half as much WHINE about it. Then all the crying got worse so I traded for melee weapons: The only ranged that is bothersome is throwing, because nowadays the accuracy on pure thrower isnt that much worse than archers, and their DPS is ridiculously higher. And crossbows ingame are the same as real life: So bundle of sticksy that the Pope banned them from being used to shoot Christians, they are just SO gay, why would u spend half your time in a fluid combat sim, standing still, bent over? makes no sense.

You think throwing does more damage than archers? id say they do less most of the time, and archers dont do much damage at all. Imo throwing should get a small buff but that is just what i think, and i'd expect a shitload of whine if that happened x) Throwing may be pretty accurate but they are also pretty damn weak, atleast that is what i have noticed...

[rufio]

seems that alot of archers use ''longbow'' specificaly to say archers are ballanced... but most archers use horn or rusbow... making argument pretty much irrelivant imo, but ye cant wait to start shooting movie and have evidence to wave in yo smug faces :3

[XyNox]

Clickshooting isnt the most accurate, its about half a second after that.

Well that is interesting. When I hold my longbow drawn for half a second my reticule has already opened up significantly. I dont have any official data to back up my claims, but as it has been said sometimes, the reticule, especially for the longbow starts openeing before you are even able to release an arrow, what might explain that even on clickshooting some arrows are dead accurate and some miss stationary midrange targets by 2 feet. I could imagine that holding your bow drawn gives you better accuracy on very fast bows and builds, where you are able to release arrows before the reticule is fully closed. But with the low firing speed compared to native I doupt this will be possible with an ordinary build. And I didnt notice anything controvercial in 5 archer gens. So is there any confirmed data that clickshooting is not the most accurate way to shoot, especially for slow bows ?

seems that alot of archers use ''longbow'' specificaly to say archers are ballanced... but most archers use horn or rusbow... making argument pretty much irrelivant imo, but ye cant wait to start shooting movie and have evidence to wave in yo smug faces :3

I for my part dont think the longbow is the best bow overall, I just use it for the looks and for maximum damage. In terms of efficiancy I still think the hornbow is the king. You might get a bit less damage but it just feels way faster, you can run a little faster and you can carry a 1 slot melee weapon. In some situations the additional draw speed is extraordinarily vital. When cav is close for example, a fast horse can bump you on the run, stop, turn around and bumb you again before you are able to get out one shot. With the hornbow whatsoever you get the chance to shoot one time, which is basicly the difference between life and death. Also in archer duels the winner usually seems to be the one with the faster bow, if there are no massive unequalities in skill of course. And the hornbow is more accurate of course although the numbers in the item description state otherwise.