Vote No on Crushthrough (petition to remove crushthrough

[Scrambles720]

Chambering.

I thought you couldnt chamber a CT weapon? Or am I wrong?

[Memento_Mori]

I thought you couldnt chamber a CT weapon? Or am I wrong?

afaik
Yes you can chamber it.
But still has the same chance to get crushed through as a block.

[Teeth]

In a game where skill is king, there remains one bane to it all: crushthrough. Why?

1.) it crushes through blocks. unless you have a +3 steel shield and 10 shield, you're gonna get crushthrough spammed.

2.) if it crushes through, it knocks down too. combined, this equates to balls.

3.) its almost an insta kill most of the time. this is abused constantly on siege.

4.) its almost always used by trolls. and trolls are gay.

I'm sure you can think of more good reasons, but these are reasons immediately known to me, so...

VOTE DOWN CRUSHTROUGH!

-Invicti_Crudux_Cruo

P.S

Are you a crushthrough sympathiser? read below

(click to show/hide)

Go somewhere else. your kind ruin this game. thanks.

In a game where skill is king, there remains one bane to it all: shielders. Why?

Shielders can always block, mauls can always attack. Seems perfectly fine to me. It's kinda the same thing.

I thought you couldnt chamber a CT weapon? Or am I wrong?

You can, doesn't mean it doesn't crushthrough. If you chamber and it gets crushed through you don't get the chamber swing and just get hit.

[Dezilagel]

I can't say I like the current state of CT (WAY too effective in the hands of a decent player), but I do agree that it must stay.

[Tibe]

This is.. all pretty much wrong. Shielders don't really kill archers, they can defend against them. Cavalry is the true counter, along with other ranged. Shielders don't have an advantage over 2h, definitely not in cRPG. Spear kills cavalry... but what's the counter to spear, then? Polearm has longer reach than what, shielders? So does 2h. Lots of polearms also have bonus vs shield, which is the real thing here. 2h is faster than what? 1h? No. Polearms? Nope.

Nope, this is pretty much all about who you ask really. As far as I am concerned than you are damn wrong. Shielders yes defend, but they also attack archers. In the real world 1 vs 1 yes, cavalry is the true counter of a archer. But most archers are camping on the roof tops or are guarded by shielders or polearmers. So in C-rpg, it should be cavalry, but its really not. Shielders do have an advantage over 2h, again, they shouldnt, but they do. Very constantly in spectate I see, how a noob shielder who presses RMB to block and only comes out from the turtle stance when he hears a bump overwhelms  quite decent 2h player, who just eventually cant keep directionalblocking correctly forever. ....And do i really have to explain to you what counters a spear, use your brain man, its not so hard to figure out you know, I dont have to spell out everything so oblivious -.-. 2h is faster than polearms, yes, totally true, again seen it, can clearly say it. And the bonus against shield for polearms, is still spamming a shielder to death, only shield breaks faster.

Not complaining, mind. Rock-paper-scissor is a retarded way of balancing.

I dunno man, again, depends uppon who you ask. In my oppinion atleast, it keeps a game nicely balanced and removes the option of everybody just spamming 1 class and this way every1 can be of use. Again, its really the matter of oppinion, but ive played Warband evesince it came out and ive really examined......true, it doesnt show from my skill of combat which is just moderate(mybe even below ).

[Xant]

Shielders do have an advantage over 2h, again, they shouldnt, but they do

No, they really don't. It's easier to fight a decent 2hander/polearm user without a shield than with a shield. 2h/polearms have damage, reach and better animations (because a decent 2her/polearmer won't let a 1hander close enough to really abuse the fast left slash/overheads) for the medium-to-long distance range.

And do i really have to explain to you what counters a spear, use your brain man, its not so hard to figure out you know, I dont have to spell out everything so oblivious -.-

Yes. What counters war spear?

2h is faster than polearms, yes, totally true, again seen it, can clearly say it.

It's true because you "seen it"? Err, right. Well, I seen otherwise. Both are as fast, depending on the individual speed stat of the weapon.

And the bonus against shield for polearms, is still spamming a shielder to death, only shield breaks faster.

Que?

[San]

They are stupid weapons but keep them in. I just think they should be dedicated support weapons so their flaws actually show.

[Tibe]

No, they really don't. It's easier to fight a decent 2hander/polearm user without a shield than with a shield. 2h/polearms have damage, reach and better animations (because a decent 2her/polearmer won't let a 1hander close enough to really abuse the fast left slash/overheads) for the medium-to-long distance range.

Odd if its so much easier to fight without a shield, than why wont almost anybody do it, even when they have a chance for 1 vs 1. No archers or anything. The wont let a 1handler close thing depends on the athletics skill of the fighter and mostly 90% of fights ive seen, the shielder will get close and if he doesnt suck completely or isnt surrounded by swarms of enemies, takes a 2h out, with his shield strong enough for 3 more fights. Crushtrough is needed imo.

Yes. What counters war spear?

shielders, but also a  2h/polearm will do the job.

It's true because you "seen it"? Err, right. Well, I seen otherwise. Both are as fast, depending on the individual speed stat of the weapon.

Everybody sees differently. Its kinda natural human behavior

How about we just agree to disagree. You will never convince me you know, nor I doubt will I manage to convince you.

[Xant]

Odd if its so much easier to fight without a shield, than why wont almost anybody do it, even when they have a chance for 1 vs 1. No archers or anything. The wont let a 1handler close thing depends on the athletics skill of the fighter and mostly 90% of fights ive seen, the shielder will get close and if he doesnt suck completely or isnt surrounded by swarms of enemies, takes a 2h out, with his shield strong enough for 3 more fights. Crushtrough is needed imo.

Because pretty much everyone is bad? You can't judge what's good and what's not by what most people do. It doesn't depend on athletics, it depends on the other guy knowing the basics of kicking.

shielders, but also a  2h/polearm will do the job.

Anything can kill a warspear user, obviously, it doesn't grant immortality, but how do shielders or 2h/polearms counter the weapon?

[Tibe]

it depends on the other guy knowing the basics of kicking.

Honestly man, how many people have you seen pulling off a nice kick, constantly? Kicking is completely different story. When you speak of weapon countering than kicking and chambering are completely different story. The basics of kicking and chambering depends on every classes performance, they have no place in the current discussion.......

You can't judge what's good and what's not by what most people do.

Ahh, but thats where you are wrong my friend, that is the only way to judge what is good and what is not. Man I can see that myself that the sword swings way better without the shield, but apparently nobody does it. Every1 will rather use a shield, than take a shot at the directional blocking. Point proven, it is easier to fight with a shield, than without 1, cause if it was the other way around, every1 would stick their shields on their backs and 1h without it in a chance of a fair fight, but that happens very rarely. So I can judge what is good and what is not by what the majority does.

There really isnt much to talk about the spear......

[Casimir]

learn to play.

[[ptx]]

Ahh, but thats where you are wrong my friend, that is the only way to judge what is good and what is not. Man I can see that myself that the sword swings way better without the shield, but apparently nobody does it. Every1 will rather use a shield, than take a shot at the directional blocking. Point proven, it is easier to fight with a shield, than without 1, cause if it was the other way around, every1 would stick their shields on their backs and 1h without it in a chance of a fair fight, but that happens very rarely. So I can judge what is good and what is not by what the majority does.

It is easier to fight without a shield, unless you are facing multiple enemies - you can return attacks faster most of the time and it is easier to defend against some feints. When facing one enemy, you usually don't put it on your back for a number of reasons:
A) Some shields obstruct your view that way, making it harder to see what is happening
B) There might be some ranged around
C) Putting shield on back takes a little bit of time, just like switching a weapon and the other guy usually doesn't give you that time
D) Forgetting about it/out of habit (you have spent the entire round with it up, defending against ranged and whatnot, afterall)

If you had played shielder for a decent amount of time against difficult enemies, then you'd know this

[Vodner]

shielders, but also a  2h/polearm will do the job.

With decent PS, the warspear is one of the best dueling polearms out there. It certainly isn't hard-countered by shielders, two-handers, or other polearms (nor should it be). A better player of any of those classes can kill a warspear user, but that's a player countering another player - not a weapon countering another weapon.

Not complaining - that's exactly how things should be.

[Kafein]

If anything, crushtrough is a little underplayed. Knockdown however, is a retarded feature atm.

[Phew]

I'm playing shielder for this and future generations, and I think the crushthrough mechanic is OK. It makes me adjust my tactics on the fly and is somewhat easily countered.

What is NOT cool is that currently a guy can carry both a Great Maul and 2H Sword, and have the best weapon for every situation.

Long Maul is perfectly balanced right now. The other crushthrough weapons need to also be 3 slot and/or unsheathable. Make mauler a dedicated support role, and it would still be very powerful in that capacity (just like Pikers are still very powerful, they just can't pull out a Bec for 1v1).