Author Topic: 24/18 vs 21/21  (Read 10647 times)

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Offline Vibe

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #60 on: October 13, 2011, 11:07:48 pm »
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You wont top the scoreboards with either one of them

Just did it, 36/6 build, 12 PS, 10 IF (fucking 91 total HP), scythe spam. Twas lol

Offline Corrado_Decimo

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #61 on: October 14, 2011, 01:40:56 am »
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Just did it, 36/6 build, 12 PS, 10 IF (fucking 91 total HP), scythe spam. Twas lol

hero!













 :rolleyes:

Offline Banok

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #62 on: October 14, 2011, 03:55:37 am »
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well.. i saw WaltF4 tests stating that athletics give nearly a 5% moving speed bonus per point while agility gives around 1.5% per point.

thats interesting will have to go read that post, but 5% isn't as much as 8% more damage of ps. and str gives hp and damage, while agility effect on weapon speed acording to WaltF4 is negligable.

Offline Vibe

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #63 on: October 14, 2011, 07:34:14 am »
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hero!

Was not about being a hero or flexing epeen. I'm just trying to show that extreme STR builds are far more useful than extreme AGI builds. Why? Because extreme STR builds can still use 0 WM and still get 111 wpf at lvl 30. Not to mention you get crapload of hp and will 1-2 shot everyone with a bec (tested later today).

And what can a 3/36 build do? It can die running.

Offline Corwin

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #64 on: October 14, 2011, 09:03:33 am »
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Just did it, 36/6 build, 12 PS, 10 IF (fucking 91 total HP), scythe spam. Twas lol
that build is impossible for lvl 30.
I mean, what have you got to lose? You know, you come from nothing, you're going back to nothing, what have you lost? Nothing!

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Offline Vibe

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #65 on: October 14, 2011, 09:13:24 am »
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that build is impossible for lvl 30.

Sorry my mistake, 36/3, 12 PS, 10 IF (91 total HP), 1 ATH. Not that those 3 agi matter anyway lol.

Offline Torben

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #66 on: October 14, 2011, 09:28:02 am »
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I'll go with 18/24, trust me, it's a killer build.

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Offline IR_Kuoin

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #67 on: October 14, 2011, 10:50:20 am »
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ATM I got 18/15 as a hybrid thrower and poler. My gear: War darts 100 wpf in thorwing, Red Tassel Spear 115 wpf, 6 PS 5 PT 5 athl, 5 WM, and it works verry well :P
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Offline Corrado_Decimo

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #68 on: October 14, 2011, 12:44:13 pm »
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thats interesting will have to go read that post, but 5% isn't as much as 8% more damage of ps. and str gives hp and damage, while agility effect on weapon speed acording to WaltF4 is negligable.

agility DOESN'T affect weapon speed since january patch... the only variable affecting weapon speed is WEAPON PROFIENCY giving roughly a 10% swing speed boost from 0 to 140 effective WPF.

Was not about being a hero or flexing epeen. I'm just trying to show that extreme STR builds are far more useful than extreme AGI builds. Why? Because extreme STR builds can still use 0 WM and still get 111 wpf at lvl 30. Not to mention you get crapload of hp and will 1-2 shot everyone with a bec (tested later today).

And what can a 3/36 build do? It can die running.

so now you switched your thoughts from "EASYMODE BUILD" to "FAR MORE USEFUL".

that's an improvement.

Offline Vibe

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #69 on: October 14, 2011, 01:04:25 pm »
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agility DOESN'T affect weapon speed since january patch... the only variable affecting weapon speed is WEAPON PROFIENCY giving roughly a 10% swing speed boost from 0 to 140 effective WPF.

so now you switched your thoughts from "EASYMODE BUILD" to "FAR MORE USEFUL".

that's an improvement.

Lol I don't know whether you are dense or just pretending. STR oriented builds are still easymode compared to AGI. Give a new player STR build and he can/will kick ass. Give a new player AGI build and he will keep dying.

Offline IR_Kuoin

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #70 on: October 14, 2011, 01:13:58 pm »
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Lol I don't know whether you are dense or just pretending. STR oriented builds are still easymode compared to AGI. Give a new player STR build and he can/will kick ass. Give a new player AGI build and he will keep dying.

I agree with Vibe, I've never had as bad K/D as when I went 9/30 for a whole gen, only had 2PS since i messed up, and even most peasant lvl 15 could 1 hit me, and 1 fist punch dmg my health nomatter who was punching me
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Offline Corrado_Decimo

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #71 on: October 14, 2011, 03:50:13 pm »
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Lol I don't know whether you are dense or just pretending. STR oriented builds are still easymode compared to AGI. Give a new player STR build and he can/will kick ass. Give a new player AGI build and he will keep dying.

oh are we talking about new players? give a new player any 2handed/polearms build and will keep dying. give a new player a 1h/shield or a ranged build and he can/will kick ass. pity we talking about average players not new ones...

Offline Vibe

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #72 on: October 14, 2011, 11:16:19 pm »
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oh are we talking about new players? give a new player any 2handed/polearms build and will keep dying.

See, this is where you are wrong. He will keep dying, yeah maybe with an agi build. But not necessarily with a STR build, considering he has much more room for mistakes and it takes him a lot less of his lucked swings to kill people. Slap some good armor on top of that and you can actually get a good kd.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2011, 11:20:34 pm by Vibe »

Offline Kafein

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #73 on: October 15, 2011, 12:24:08 am »
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The more noobish people are in melee, the more strenght they need. The more people are good at fighting, being creative and concentrated, the more agi pays.

oh are we talking about new players? give a new player any 2handed/polearms build and will keep dying. give a new player a 1h/shield or a ranged build and he can/will kick ass. pity we talking about average players not new ones...

I think you are right, but in the first case they will actually manage to kill people, with the two other builds it's way more difficult when you lack experience (the wall of weapon reach/movement speed for shielders. Timing, awareness , drop and movement correction for ranged). Both are safer against ranged and inf though.

Offline Corrado_Decimo

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Re: 24/18 vs 21/21
« Reply #74 on: October 15, 2011, 02:06:57 am »
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See, this is where you are wrong. He will keep dying, yeah maybe with an agi build. But not necessarily with a STR build, considering he has much more room for mistakes and it takes him a lot less of his lucked swings to kill people. Slap some good armor on top of that and you can actually get a good kd.

well without armor you will die in 3 hits instead 2. with 70+ armor and 80+ hp yes, you can sustain 4-5 good blows and at least 8 weak ones. with an agi build (we can limit AGI BUILDS to the lowest strength cap to 12 please? as going under 12STR is not even a build...) 12/27 with 4IF for a total of 55hp, wearing the highest gear you can with 12 STR, (72 body armor with a +3 lamellar armor and +3 plate mittens) you can take 2-3 good blows and at least 5 weak ones. BUT your 9 athletics packed with 27 agi (+ 64% higher speed than a 3agi 1ath build) will give you the ability to be gank-immune (until you're the last player alive ofc).

also as i said, any 4+ ath maulers eat STR builds for breakfast. they can't dodge/backpedal/run away and often neither counter by spam (wfp can still give you a net +5% weapon speed versus a heavy STR build).

anyway i lost the screenshots about a siege day with my 12/27 awlpike spammer... wasn't that hard to top the score with a 24/7 backstabber build... until ariec showed up  :P

The more noobish people are in melee, the more strenght they need. The more people are good at fighting, being creative and concentrated, the more agi pays.

I think you are right, but in the first case they will actually manage to kill people, with the two other builds it's way more difficult when you lack experience (the wall of weapon reach/movement speed for shielders. Timing, awareness , drop and movement correction for ranged). Both are safer against ranged and inf though.

yeah i just wrote incorrectly. i would say the 2h/polearm newbs will die over and over, the shielder newbs will not probably kick asses but at least will survive long enough to keep busy some opponents. while ranged, well.. getting used to fire with a given bow, require less than a week (to get a good accuracy).

while getting used to manual block before, ootwork after and advanced offensive/defensive techniques in the end, will probably take months of playing (feints, timed delayed attacks, hiltslash, chamberblock).

to sum up, with STR you can cut thru the mass in a siege but you'll have harder times against any decent infantry (lacking footwork, hiltslashing is hard.) so the only aggressive stance, will be focusing on chambers (then ezmode not anymore).

STR build is the easiest build to play badly, AGI is the hardest build to play it correctly. but still khorin/tempest and other agi oriented builds will smack down any STR build they face so...

« Last Edit: October 15, 2011, 02:17:04 am by Corrado_Decimo »