fyi ; in this election HDP got into the parliament so AKP lost the massive majority and might lose the power in the following days
fyi ; in this election HDP got into the parliament so AKP lost the massive majority and might lose the power in the following days
Still looks like Turkey is past being fucked from my far away perspective.
Yeah coalition is a MUST be now , cus AKP doesn't have enough votes to form the government by themselves , but nobody wants to make coalition with em so the other guys have to form a coalition but/and/or MHP is being an ass , they dont want to merge with the Kurds.
tl;dr Is there a time we are not fucked?
I think it will go like this. HDP won't ally with MHP. HDP might ally with CHP but doubtful. AKP will try to ally with MHP but even though MHP don't want to they might cave in eventually to troll the kurds.
CHP probably won't ally with AKP.
GG Turkiye ur fukkd m8s.
congratulation! you got rid of Erdogan.
this guy was no good for your country.
congratulation! you got rid of Erdogan.
this guy was no good for your country.
Turkey really dodged a bullet there for now. All those years of efforts to create a democratic modern society almost got lost. However the potential risk still clearly remains. You can still end up becoming one of those fucked up Sharia law states. Would still recommend getting your educated female familymembers out of there.
I will never understand the logic behind hardcore islams take on women not being allowed to do anything. Why the fuck would anyone force half of their countries inhabitants to be basically useless?
\_( •_•)_/
We are still at a huge risk. The three opposing parties don't seem to be agreeing on a coalition. Especially the nationalist MHP is quite unwilling to ally with HDP, the Kurdish party, although the Republican CHP is down for a coalition that would bring Tardogan down. An opposition coalition requires all three to come together and that doesn't seem to be possible at the moment. If they can't sort things out in 45 days, another election will be called and god knows how much things will change in that case.Don't you think opposition parties will gain more votes, now that people see there can be a real opposition?
And how can half the population vote to reduce its own right?
\_( •_•)_/
And how can half the population vote to reduce its own right?
\_( •_•)_/
Thinking about it....They are not the only one in this world to vote for more limited rights.... :rolleyes:
Don't you think opposition parties will gain more votes, now that people see there can be a real opposition?
Don't you think opposition parties will gain more votes, now that people see there can be a real opposition?
dude im going to be rich with all these euros and dollars i own ggwp electionsU can pay Greece debts then
U can pay Greece debts then
I think it will go like this. HDP won't ally with MHP. HDP might ally with CHP but doubtful.
Wat about CHP/AKP? AKP tries to tell CHP they will accept some of their conditions to join.
Turkey is fucked, Erdogan purged the military of the only people who would have stopped him. In fact go back to before the purge and there is no way in fucking hell Erdogan would ever get away with half the shit he does today, but of course at the time all the dumb stupid fucking anti-military bundle of stickss were masturbating about how totally cool it is that true democracy and freedom from military imposed rule was, completely ignoring it was the only reason Turkey wasn't a theocratic shithole or strongman dictatorship in the first place like most of the mid-east. Ataturk rolling in his fucking grave.
Why do you care so much about turkey lol
Why do you care so much about turkey lol
Don't forget that the area was the nucleus for one of the most powerful expansionist empires of the modern age, one that died merely a few decades before it's mostly european competitors. Even today the few modern universities worth a damn in the islamic world are largely concentrated in Turkey. Turkey is the most modernized majority islamic country, largely thanks to Ataturk's deliberate westernization. Of course this was back when the west still had something to offer. Strangely enough no one seems to be rushing to immitate modern western ideals that lead to below replacement population levels, mass immigration to make up the shortfall and the subsequent artificial attempt at forging cultural melting pots based on these new demographics. It's almost as if these things aren't incredibly desirable and awesome, but rather the death throes of dying civilizations.The low demography is not unique to Europe, it is the "drawback" of every rich and developped country. Japan is facing the same problem. So even if you don't want to reach for the low demography, if you want to reach for economic wealth, the low demography will most likely come with it. Now either you just simply collapse like japan with no immigration (and eventually replace people with robots :lol: ) or either you fullfill the gap with immigration.
Why do you care so much about turkey lolJust like China or Russia were some years ago, Turkey has not met yet it's full potential. Turkey could be a great stabilizing force in the region if it choose to be so, instead of the agitating force it is currently.
Imagine how fucked Turkey would be, rather. Turkey's military is just a step above of what Iraq had before the Americans accidentally went through it while sleepwalking.
Imagine how fucked we would be if Turkey jihads against West. :D
Really? Japan is collapsing? I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that the way things are going, Japanese culture as linked to an identifiable, unique ethnicity is going to be around after any european culture practicing mass immigration. There already is no such thing as a french ethnicity, it's been redefined to the annals of history. Apparently it was a mirage that never existed. An immigrant who doesn't give a shit about the country, does not even identify as french, has no personal, cultural or historical attachment to anything french beyond speaking the language (except for often a sense of resentment, baffingly encouraged, over the colonial exploitation of their home nations for decades/centuries, the only reason they speak the language in the first place), but is in fact incredibly patriotic and proud (just for another tribal identification) has as much right to the identity as anyone else. So yes, Japan as we understand it is going to be around long after France as we understand it.Japan's population is collapsing more than nearly any EU country, so that unique culture is going to see less and less people included in it. At least that is factual information, unlike your projections. Disappearance of national identity does not really seem that much of a problem to me. Besides, so far I have not seen significant economic growth without a reduction in fertility rates, so is it really western ideals that lead to this situation?
Really? Japan is collapsing? I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that the way things are going, Japanese culture as linked to an identifiable, unique ethnicity is going to be around after any european culture practicing mass immigration. There already is no such thing as a french ethnicity, it's been redefined to the annals of history. Apparently it was a mirage that never existed. An immigrant who doesn't give a shit about the country, does not even identify as french, has no personal, cultural or historical attachment to anything french beyond speaking the language (except for often a sense of resentment, baffingly encouraged, over the colonial exploitation of their home nations for decades/centuries, the only reason they speak the language in the first place), but is in fact incredibly patriotic and proud (just for another tribal identification) has as much right to the identity as anyone else. So yes, Japan as we understand it is going to be around long after France as we understand it.33% of the population above 60 years old, is that what you would call a dynamic population? Maybe collapsing was too strong word, but there's a decline for sure. visitors can't see pics , please register or login
33% of the population above 60 years old, is that what you would call a dynamic population? Maybe collapsing was too strong word, but there's a decline for sure. visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Ofc it's great they kept their culture, but if there's nobody to enjoy it and to make it live where's the point. A little immigration wouldn't hurt.
... Turkey has enough ethnic and cultural tension to keep all of them alive. :lol:
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Imagine how fucked Turkey would be, rather. Turkey's military is just a step above of what Iraq had before the Americans accidentally went through it while sleepwalking.
Imagine how fucked Turkey would be, rather. Turkey's military is just a step above of what Iraq had before the Americans accidentally went through it while sleepwalking.
Are they really that bad? Or is US just so stronk it can steamroll over everybody?They're not bad by ME standards, but they're not a threat to Europe.
Japan's population is collapsing more than nearly any EU country, so that unique culture is going to see less and less people included in it. At least that is factual information, unlike your projections. Disappearance of national identity does not really seem that much of a problem to me. Besides, so far I have not seen significant economic growth without a reduction in fertility rates, so is it really western ideals that lead to this situation?
Afaik with the amount of troops &weapons&vehicles compared to the world , we are quite allright. But we are lacking training and modernization.If you look at Iraq's equipment before the Gulf War and Invasion of Iraq in 2003, they had some really good stuff as well -- as good/more than Turkey in some aspects. Amount of troops means almost nothing in modern warfare, training and modern equipment do; and with the material superiority of the US they can bombard any kind of conventional army into mush and completely destroy the opposing air force in days (both with their own aircraft and their highly-trained troops specialized in taking airfields). There's just no contest, China might be a threat in a few decades, but against NATO any sort of a conventional war (or guerrilla war if the military was unleashed) would be an exercise in futility at the moment and for the foreseeable future.
You say my "projections" (which are simple and obvious observation) aren't factual, then immediately say you have no problem with what those "projections" entail.No, I say your projections aren't factual, thus I disagree with your projections. Not entirely, but partly. I see a profound lack of patriotism or nationalistic identity in my country, and it does not seem problematic. I do think there are dangers to certain kinds of immigration, but the solution does not lie in patriotism.
No, I say your projections aren't factual, thus I disagree with your projections. Not entirely, but partly. I see a profound lack of patriotism or nationalistic identity in my country, and it does not seem problematic. I do think there are dangers to certain kinds of immigration, but the solution does not lie in patriotism.
Why do you care so much about turkey lol
It's pretty good, but our calendar and celebrations and acts of remembrance/memorialisation are all steeped in it - or at the very least derive from religious practice. When I think of pure representation of a culture, elements that distinguish one from the other, I immediately think of those more notable occasions (particularly the way we memorialise the dead).
How would you define your culture? And how would you consider it to be ruined or supplanted by immigration? Eg. what's your worst case scenario 'We no longer have/do X therefore my culture is dead'?
They're not bad by ME standards, but they're not a threat to Europe.Obeyrn: -"they already are a threat to our culture!!"
If you look at Iraq's equipment before the Gulf War and Invasion of Iraq in 2003, they had some really good stuff as well -- as good/more than Turkey in some aspects. Amount of troops means almost nothing in modern warfare, training and modern equipment do; and with the material superiority of the US they can bombard any kind of conventional army into mush and completely destroy the opposing air force in days (both with their own aircraft and their highly-trained troops specialized in taking airfields). There's just no contest, China might be a threat in a few decades, but against NATO any sort of a conventional war (or guerrilla war if the military was unleashed) would be an exercise in futility at the moment and for the foreseeable future.
What do you mean by their culture changing exactly? I don't see China attempting to import millions of Indians or Pakistanis. I don't see any country in asia facing immigration to the point that their dominant culture is affected in any way, really. You mean they're addopting technological innovations that are changing their culture? That's not exactly the same thing.Religion and traditions are loosing grounds. The youth is less following the family rules. The way of life is changing, it's becoming more similar to the one of Europe.
Religion and traditions are loosing grounds. The youth is less following the family rules. The way of life is changing, it's becoming more similar to the one of Europe.
You have it wrong. Religion and traditions are losing ground in North-America and Europe among the general population. But in the majority of the people from developing countries, religion and traditions is all they got. And that's why its such a discussionpoint. People from developed countries are unable to press their culture because they dont have any themselves. So immigrants in these countries, not really feeling any pressure will hold on to their own culture and than often press it on their next of kin. Thereby no real integration happens.I was talking about Asia (the buddhist part) and there religion is losing ground. But it's true, it's only the case in the city and not in the countryside. And I totally disagree with the idea of the West having no culture, it has one in which religion is not taking a big part but it is a culture.
A really good example here is why Baltic countries cant afford having russian as a second state language, despite having massive russian minorities. These countries are so tiny. Theres no real point to study their language or culture, unless you really plan to live there. Its pointlessly hard. If you remove the need to learn it, you are basically giving your countries up to another culture and the minorities and the natives will eventually have a problem with eachother. And we all know what happens to countries that share a culture with Russia and have a mild conflict with their russian minorities, dont we Ukraine and Georgia? :D
And I don't know enough about east europe and baltic to talk about it, but aren't those russian minorities living there since centuries?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russians_in_the_Baltic_states
The day Erdogan and Putin lose their positions the world will be a better place.
That is exactly what people (idiots) said about Hussein and Assad aswell. But it turned out, they were by far the lesser evil.I don't know, pretty sure Saddam's gotten a lot more people killed than ISIS.
Oberyn, why are we even concerned about culture? I care about the huge social and liberal progress that Western countries have made compared to basically everywhere else. That's valuable, and it's largely not culture. Is immigration putting that in danger? It depends on how backwards the immigrants are, which has again little to do with their culture. Native Westerners are reproducing like pandas, but it's doubtful that restricting immigration would improve the situation, apart from a reduction in demographic pressure. If immigrants learn the value of modern democracy and individual freedoms then there's really no problem. Do they? No, not quite as much as they should. The fact that not everybody has the same education on that is a new problem that remains mostly unanswered. Stricter immigration rules is one way to fix it. I would even add that being attached to these values is an identity in itself, a political one.The problem with immigration is that western countries are taking way too many of the ones that aren't coming over to work. If they work, they'll integrate to society and within two generations they'll be pretty much native. And because they work, they don't have to live in an immigrant-only ghetto that makes the problems ten times worse and creates vacuums of Middle East cultures for generations to come.
I don't know, pretty sure Saddam's gotten a lot more people killed than ISIS.
Atleast Hussein left museums alone.At least*
At least*
Wonder what would happen if Erdogan would legit go crazy and turn Turkey into a dictatorship run country with Erdogan as eternal leader/sultan/caliph
That is exactly what people (idiots) said about Hussein and Assad aswell. But it turned out, they were by far the lesser evil.
There is some truth in that statement, but you apparently don't have a sound opinion as to how toxic a piece of trash Erdogan is for the entire mankind, not just for his own geographical region.
Hundreds of riotings and protests which would be followed by innocents dying on streets and army stepping up which will cause the death of him?
Didn't generals get raped in the ass last time they tried to conspire against Derpogan?
Didn't generals get raped in the ass last time they tried to conspire against Derpogan?
What, like... literally?
What, like... literally?No that was Muammar al-Gaddafi who did that.....literally!!
No that was Muammar al-Gaddafi who did that.....literally!!
We are erdoğan's ass hair hüloğğğ
Erdogan will block CRPG forums and Youtube
idgaf about youtube but if he blocks crpg we riot
Throw köfte at him
Maybe now that Erdogan lost, the Turks will stop aiding a terrorist group
http://www.todayszaman.com/diplomacy_report-turkish-authorities-providing-electricity-to-isil-in-tel-abyad_385744.html
http://www.presstv.com/Detail/2015/06/12/415486/Turkey-Syria-ISIL-National-Intelligence-Organization-MT-Cumhuriyet-Selahattin
http://www.thetower.org/1493-erdogan-trying-to-hide-evidence-of-involvement-in-supporting-terrorism/
I was wondering why didn't anyone came up with that.
Few months ago some MIT ( National Intelligence Agency) owned trucks got halted by gendermarie forces near Adana , while they were on the way to Syria. They were rumoured to carry heavy weapons to reinforce ISIS, but Erdogan and Davutoglu kept denying it and told that they were carrying health care goods , but recently in Cumhuriyet newspaper the photos of weapons in the trucks got published, Erdogan immediately accused the coordinator of the paper with treason.And spoke of this for at least a week.
Yes, it is official that TR supplied ISIS recently.
Am I a bad person if wish for Isis to attack turkeyturkey;I don't know, I doubt anyone cares if ISIS gets destroyed.
The problem with immigration is that western countries are taking way too many of the ones that aren't coming over to work. If they work, they'll integrate to society and within two generations they'll be pretty much native. And because they work, they don't have to live in an immigrant-only ghetto that makes the problems ten times worse and creates vacuums of Middle East cultures for generations to come.problems with immigrants is that eu and murica bombing their cities and forcing people to migrate.
Am I a bad person if wish for Isis to attack turkeyturkey;i wish for isis download the entire explosives (they receive from US and eu) in several Boeing and send it back home
...
Yes, it is official that TR supplied ISIS recently.
Am I a bad person if wish for Isis to attack turkeyturkey;
It does not become a fact, because some people with political agenda repeat it over and over again like a parrot.
What evidence do you have to support this statement?
The weird part i don't understand about elections is, why do you have the right to vote if you live in Europe or simply out of country. I mean you already GTX Turkey, yet you have the right to decide what kind of shithole we are going to be...... Yes most of those votes are for AKP.
Still no alliance for AKP
The weird part i don't understand about elections is, why do you have the right to vote if you live in Europe or simply out of country. I mean you already GTX Turkey, yet you have the right to decide what kind of shithole we are going to be...... Yes most of those votes are for AKP.
In other news, ever since the fall of Tell Abyad Erdogan has started making noises that a kurdish controlled area on the turkish southern border with Syria would absolutely not be tolerated. As opposed to the ISIS controlled one through which the vast majority of their recruits from Europe had been going through until now, along with other war materiel.
And of course the entire sunni world is crying crocodile tears about kurdish "ethnic cleansing" of the territories they have liberated, completely oblivious to the total fucking irony. Kurdish have a vested interest in keeping sectarian bullshit to a minimum, and it has been evident in the way they have been defending from the start turkmen and yazidis and assyrians and every other minority daesh were hellbent on genociding.
Anyways this pipeline to their allies is vital for the snackbar fuckers, and they've been making pushes to capture it back. Kurds were making ridiculous territory gains but that seems to have been checked.
It's even more hilarious when you realize how apparent it is that Kurdish command's only priority is to encircle Turkey. It's literally breaking the supply lines. I wonder why they aren't trying to sabotage the border from within as well.
Resigning even when you are a part of an interim government requires honor. And just for your information Kafein, I have lived to learn that honor is not a word found in theTurkishbook of politics.
Maybe some MHPers loved the fact that Erdogans government killed Kurds. But I doubt they'd change so many of their votes over to AKP. And I'm pretty damn sure that HDP didn't change so many voters. This just seems like a massive rigged vote. Well atleast Erdogan won't be able to change the constitution i guess.
Otherwise there would be a dictatorship run shariah country 4 sure.
So there's no democracy in Turkistan?
Turkey is placed 149th out of 180 countries when it comes to the liberty of the press. Almost as bad as Russia, which is 152nd to make a comparison.
You and Flockula should get the hell out of Turkey as fast as possible before you get arrested for being terrorists according to Erdogan's glorious sense of respect of democracy & human rights.
EU offers congratulations to the dictator. (http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/eu-says-turkish-vote-reaffirms-peoples-strong-democratic-commitment-.aspx?pageID=238&nID=90613&NewsCatID=510)
They did postpone the EU progress report to not spoil the victory in the first place. This was to be expected anyway. I guess they are just happy that Tardogan is taking refugees back. Saying "the election reaffirms strong democractic committment" can't be explained otherwise. This, by far, has been the most controversial, suspicious and blatantly undemocratic election ever in the entire Turkish history. But I guess whatever floats the international politics boat is the right thing to do.
EU offers congratulations to the dictator. (http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/eu-says-turkish-vote-reaffirms-peoples-strong-democratic-commitment-.aspx?pageID=238&nID=90613&NewsCatID=510)
They did postpone the EU progress report to not spoil the victory in the first place. This was to be expected anyway. I guess they are just happy that Tardogan is taking refugees back. Saying "the election reaffirms strong democractic committment" can't be explained otherwise. This, by far, has been the most controversial, suspicious and blatantly undemocratic election ever in the entire Turkish history. But I guess whatever floats the international politics boat is the right thing to do.
Well, seeing that Erdogan has been trying to get dictator level powers for who knows how many elections now, congratulating him with that wording is a chocolate encrusted "fuck you and fuck everything you stand for" in diplomatic speech.
If only I could believe just that. It would make things probably just a tiny bit easier. Still, all I see is that Europe won't ever give a damn about what happens to Turkey as long as its government serves as a feasible tool. That is the only interpretation I can infer from the whole thing.
I'm sure they would prefer to deal with someone else as well, but since the people according to appearances and despite the myriad uncomfortable rumors and facts around him still actually chose Erdogan, they will have to deal with him.
Tons of vote rigging attempts have been uncovered and yet remain unpunished. Tons more than possibly weren't even spotted. If I had the energy, I would create an entire new thread and write it all for those who may wonder. Also, the counting process, which has always gone on way past midnight, was finished in just 2 hours this time.
Believe me, I could just give you a whole page of reported incidents. Enough to cancel 10 elections altogether. Just as I noted above, I simply don't have the energy to go translating it. The separation of powers, however, has long been non-existent in Turkey. This is to say, it has all been reported in vain, because we are all powerless. Can't do anything at all against the face of this madness. All this shit was was witnessed by designated European observers too. Hell, they even forcibly drove away some of them out of the election grounds so that they could do their rigging merrily and away from watchful eyes.
What do I mean? I mean no, he hasn't been chosen. Believe me he never has been chosen democratically. Is there some 15 million autists who do always and always vote for him? Yes, there is. That can't have taken him anywhere near where he is right now though. It is known very well by the EU. Briefly said, legitimacy is not what is holding them back.
We have been literally trying to defend the ballot box from the government, pawns of the national intelligence agency, their huge network of volunteering scrubs and the police for at least the last 3 elections. Needless to say, we have always lost this fight as simple citizens. The whole world knows it and all that is done is publish headlines "celebrating reestablished Turkish democracy". We are being ruled by a tool. And that tool still seems to be useful for execution of the global Middle East agenda. That is all about it.
No worries. I am not planning to leave. You can devour them burritos for me Heskey. I will be here eating kebab and drinking my own tears.
Don't feel bad for the idiots you'd leave behind, you will find many more idiots wherever you go.
U can mix ur tears with some Raki
[...] I can use vodka instead though. That one I like better.Secret Putin lover or 2nd Vovka account confirmed.
Secret Putin lover or 2nd Vovka account confirmed.
haha funny because he drink wodka ))visitors can't see pics , please register or login(click to show/hide)
Ideally I would love for Istanbul and the rest of Thrace to break away from the Sultanate of Turkey. Really the only place in Turkey that belongs in the EU, barring some of the other coastal areas. They can keep the rest of Anatolia, filled with backwards fucking rednecks.
That's what i'm trying to explain to my friends. [...] The respond i get ''you terrorist'' ''fuck you'' ''you traitor'' ''you son of a bitch'' ''you bastard'' ''fuck off''. :lol:
I've been saying for years now that Turkey is no part of the EU.
But come to think of it, so aren't a bunch of the Eastern additions tbh.
Boils down to the ultimate truth, I guess:
There are assholes everywhere.
I just quoted one of the biggest ones around.Stop stalking me please. Makes you look weird... well, even weirder...
Are these even "friends" ? A real friend doesn't insult you if you have different ideas.I beg to differ. I call my friends retards all the time if they disagree (i.e., they're wrong) with me.
I beg to differ. I call my friends retards all the time if they disagree (i.e., they're wrong) with me.
Are they also calling you "traitor" or "terrorist" ?Obviously?
Obviously?
I don't even know anymore if you're serious or not when you say something. I never knew anyway.
It's possible to disagree on even the most important fundamental big questions and still be friends with someone. Just because someone is a massive retard on one (or even more) specific issue doesn't mean I wouldn't enjoy having a beer and/or otherwise socializing with them. Really depends.
Are these even "friends" ? A real friend doesn't insult you if you have different ideas.
I beg to differ. I call my friends retards all the time if they disagree (i.e., they're wrong) with me.
It's possible to disagree on even the most important fundamental big questions and still be friends with someone. Just because someone is a massive retard on one (or even more) specific issue doesn't mean I wouldn't enjoy having a beer and/or otherwise socializing with them. Really depends.
You have friends IRL?Imaginary ones.
Imaginary ones.
Oh, I thought you really did. Shame, I need some advice on how to make friends.
And find people just like u and ask them if u wanna hang out.
I think it will go like this. HDP won't ally with MHP. HDP might ally with CHP but doubtful. AKP will try to ally with MHP but even though MHP don't want to they might cave in eventually to troll the kurds.
CHP probably won't ally with AKP.
GG Turkiye ur fukkd m8s.
i am seriously searching for scandinavian citizenship....When the ship starts sinking, rats abandon it first.
i am seriously searching for scandinavian citizenship....