I am defending the [L]adders!
Whoever upvoted this either forgot what was it really like either is ranged.
Whoever upvoted this either forgot what was it really like either is ranged.
you see...
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I also think the team destroying their own ladders should be addressed. Perhaps make ladders unable to be destroyed by the team that threw it. Makes breaking ladders to otherwise inaccessible areas the folly of the other team (and hilarious if it happens).
I would really like to see ladders back but at the same time I cant forget what they did to siege. Even if there were just 4 attackers working together and ninja cap the flag 4 times in a row with ladders, defenders would still not adapt and will continue to fight at the front walls. It made maplayouts pointless in some cases.
Sadly people would abuse this to troll their team as in blocking passages, trapping teammates etc.
Refer to my original post, I said they would not work for Siege at this given time due to lower population in Siege and the current layout of most maps.actually, its just NA siege thats dead. EU siege is well alive. Lucky EU's.
Whoever upvoted this either forgot what was it really like either is ranged.
I didn't forget what it was like, and I am not/was not ranged. MOTF negates archers camping rooftops.
You are saying ladders will not hurt. That's not true. They will hurt regardless, making some classes invulnerable to others and able to attack almost anywhere on the map at the same time. Said classes don't need any help getting to vantage points anyway at the moment. Which brings me to my second point: what is the positive impact of ladders? Would I use ladders? No I wouldn't, what is the use of a ladder to me, or any melee or cav player for that matter? Bringing back ladders would be a purely negative change.Well, archers can't use ladders, most already have full slots.
But hey whatever, add ladders to battle mode, I don't really care. Maybe that will actually bring more melee and less ranged to siege.
Well, archers can't use ladders, most already have full slots.
So, if you wanted to help out your team, you could bring a ladder (since you are a melee player you most likely have a spare slot or 2), place it on a nice roof to get some cover fire.
What would YOU get outta that? Maybe because of that well strategically placed ladder of yours, you could win the round and you gain a multi.
For those who still haven't realized it, on the subject of ladders there is a strong correlation between having a positive opinion of ladders and being NA, similarly there is a strong correlation between having a negative opinion of ladders and being EU.This. Stay the fuck out of EU, but you are welcome to do it in NA. You clearly dont have the same experience with ranged, as we have. I am already being a little bitch trying to hide from ranged, whenever i play on EU 1, because i can not get to them without being killed.
The removal of deployable ladders is literally my most celebrated change in the history of this mod and there are many people who agree with me. As far as I know we have more archers and crossbowmen on this side of the pond and I have heard many an NA say our archers are better. I think our ranged are also bigger my old friends on average. Ladders on EU were unbearable. I don't see how giving ranged relative immunity from infantry and complete immunity from cav is in any way a justifiable piece of game design, reducing any round to capture the flag is not a solution whatsoever for my experience with ladders. Seeing as you all believe it is confirms my believe that NA's experience with ladders is something quite different from the turd we have had here.
In short, you won't understand our opinion, we won't understand your opinion. Don't bother arguing about it please. Give NA ladders for all I care, but keep them the fuck out of EU.
This. Stay the fuck out of EU, but you are welcome to do it in NA. You clearly dont have the same experience with ranged, as we have. I am already being a little bitch trying to hide from ranged, whenever i play on EU 1, because i can not get to them without being killed.Shut up GTX and bring back ladders! Bring back some fun!
PS: Since EU and NA have conflicting opinions on this subject, you should probably make a poll for only one of the two.
WHAT THE FUCK..is THAT!?(click to show/hide)
WHAT THE FUCK..is THAT!?That's a cat.
Sadly people would abuse this to troll their team as in blocking passages, trapping teammates etc.
Maybe after we manage to fix MotF not ending rounds 1/3 of the time. Until then, it can't really be considered. Although archers have been nerfed in a few ways since the last time we had ladders in battle, they're currently much more accurate and also dealing slightly more damage than they were back then. Weight isn't much of nerf when you're on top of a house camping, you're essentially just a turret at that point.
Only fun thing about battles anymore would be ladders - otherwise boring and repetitive. We desperately need ladders.And which class do you mostly play again?
Let me look at this from a map maker's perspective.(click to show/hide)
Maybe after we manage to fix MotF not ending rounds 1/3 of the time. Until then, it can't really be considered. Although archers have been nerfed in a few ways since the last time we had ladders in battle, they're currently much more accurate and also dealing slightly more damage than they were back then. Weight isn't much of nerf when you're on top of a house camping, you're essentially just a turret at that point.
Just don't put any building or tree on battle maps, as any map maker worth his salt would do.
Battle maps have been made and edited without having to worry about the ladders for like 2 years now. This is far beyond the simple motf change i had to do one or two patches ago. If there is anyone out there who would want to edit like 80 maps just to bring those goddamn ladders back, sure. I know i won't.Come on Head Scene Editor/Bad map selector Fips!
Come on Head Scene Editor/Bad map selector Fips!
Might want to get a head start Fips, the polls seem to indicate a want for them ;)
Yeah the MOTF bug is annoying as hell with it getting stuck. I still think that Ladders (at this point I'd separate it to EU and NA if they want it or not) should strongly be considered being brought back by the Dev team. Ladders may be nostalgic, but they're also becoming dust-collectors on our c-rpg page. Many new players see Ladders and other Siege Equipment items and buy them--only to find out they can only use them in Duel of all places :/We talked about it for a bit like two or three weeks ago, talked about it again, briefly, thanks to this thread. It's being considered, but if I'm being honest and open here, I don't think it's likely to happen. If we decide to reintroduce ladders, it will be because we're sure it won't cause issues and will therefore plan on it never needing to be removed again. With steep requirements like these, it's hard for me to imagine cRPG with ladders on battle once again.
If balanced correctly with the current MOTF setup and class balances, and with potential changes to the ladder slot system as Zagibu mentioned briefly and a limit on them per-side--they could be done. I would not consider it a moot point or dead cause at this point--if anything it should be something for the Dev Team to discuss and see if there is a good, solid way to re-implement them and make it optional for the separate servers.
One can dream, and it's obvious a large chunk of the community wants Ladders back. As has been discussed--the opinion of them between EU and NA are vastly different in a lot of areas. But since most of the Devs are EU, the decision to ever do anything about bringing them back will likely remain there with that opinion siding with EU.
Simply a discussion though, but I think it largely shows how many people want them back via the poll and it is something that Devs should strongly consider for NA (at the very least). Give us back Fun. Right now the Maps feel too monotonous and grind-like. The combat happens in the same place almost every time due to how the maps are designed and played, ladders throw a kink in that and re-introduce an element that stirs the pot.
Food for thought.
Might want to get a head start Fips, the polls seem to indicate a want for them ;)Classic, this is like the third time some NA goes 'if we get a majority on a poll it shall be done' and gets all smug about it. If you haven't figured it out yet, the dev team does not work that way. If you ever want to get anything done in this game you should probably quit feeling so arrogantly entitled to tell the devs what to do.
Classic, this is like the third time some NA goes 'if we get a majority on a poll it shall be done' and gets all smug about it. If you haven't figured it out yet, the dev team does not work that way. If you ever want to get anything done in this game you should probably quit feeling so arrogantly entitled to tell the devs what to do.
i vote yes because it would greatly help NA siege which right now is shite
not on NA only EU! siege would make for lulz
As famous Creedence clearwater said
Some folks are born to wave the flag,
Ooh, they're red, white and blue.
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Maybe after we manage to fix MotF not ending rounds 1/3 of the time. Until then, it can't really be considered. Although archers have been nerfed in a few ways since the last time we had ladders in battle, they're currently much more accurate and also dealing slightly more damage than they were back then. Weight isn't much of nerf when you're on top of a house camping, you're essentially just a turret at that point.
fantasy.
I don't see how giving ranged relative immunity from infantry and complete immunity from cav is in any way a justifiable piece of game design
I only remember that everyone abusing ladders.
Ladder spam siege madness (October, 2011)(click to show/hide)
I could go one an one n one... more screen shots of ranged players farming kills, an half the server cant touch em.... this have been discussed to death...
But if you really wanna add ladders back in, an make the final death blow to EU1 go ahead...
Is that not the greys right beside it? If it is, then i am not surprised.
Abuse the shit out of everything, because eastern bloc mentality