cRPG

cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 04:13:47 pm

Title: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 04:13:47 pm
[H]ello!

So I was wondering what our beloved cRPG community may consider outdated in cRPG. Please type what YOU think is out of place now and how you think it could be changed.

From my point of view, cRPG's most outdated feature is it's grinding. As the whole set of MWs and high level characters (at least EU) are bocimng new standards, there is nothing amazing about being high level born in strat or about having MWs. Why should we keep this rate of gaining shit so low. It only discourages some people from trying out new things on new characters or playing other classes that you'd need different MWs for. For example for playing cav in EU a +3horse is an compulsory item, same goes for playing 1hander because 1h swords gain significant amount of cut damage that is necessary to deal with high armour values nicely. Polearmers and 2hs have high base damage so unloomed weapons in those categories are ok.

We can talk about how much high level gives you and all in all, it usually depends on the build itself, not only on the char's lvl. You can have some hybrids that at high level feel like ~30 lvl in 2 categoies or sth like that despite being lvl 34. The thing is that at higher lvl values, builds go way more interesting and you can creatively build your own character the way you want it.

I know that no-exp-punishment auctions are a good source of gold sink, but what if you could respec your character without losing exp and then you'd get 1week cooldown on another respec? Respecing your hero would be like respecing your STF but with those differences that character keeps his level and gains 1 week cooldown to another respec.

1. It would increase variety and give player more freedom,
2. You have to wait a week to change your strat-char anyway so it would be quite similar and shouldn't be abusable,
3. Devs/overlords could make gamechanging-decisions and could not give a fuck about community because people would have an access to respecs (would take them some time but it'd be doable to respec few chars with hero-changing)
4. It would refresh the game imho, more people would play with some role-play builds or with builds that they always wanted to try out, - summing up, people would play for fun more.

Or if you don't like this idea, then at least make STFs lvl 32.

Seriously I remember having to sacrifice my alt few years ago to transfer my MW item to my main. I remember STF being respecable but with 7 days cooldown. Remember loads of things that got changed over time to the state that we have now and I guess, we can all agree that those changes only did good to cRPG.

Players & wealth & attitude & levels & items have changed and those changes have to be followed by proper cRPG changes.

(click to show/hide)


tl;dr bla bla bla


Now tell me what you think should get updated to follow new cRPG's spirit and help it progress!
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Osiris on January 23, 2014, 04:18:47 pm
Remove looms :D
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Apsod on January 23, 2014, 04:19:18 pm
x10 EXP Should totally be a thing.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 04:19:31 pm
Remove looms :D
Teeth suggested it as far as I remember. I'd rather make everyone have looms instead of removing them all.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Leshma on January 23, 2014, 04:21:49 pm
Apart from grind, outdated feature is shield forcefield while mounted, outdated feature is realistic fall damage, outdated feature is sheatable/non-sheatable mechanics, outdated feature is turn rate nerf, outdated feature is lance angle nerf. Mainly combination of realistic and non-realistic features that are annoying and bring less fun to playing this mod.

Also, any type of stun (ranged, pole, heavy weapon stun) is annoying if you ask me.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: LordBerenger on January 23, 2014, 04:23:15 pm
Upkeep
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Osiris on January 23, 2014, 04:24:09 pm
Teeth suggested it as far as I remember. I'd rather make everyone have looms instead of removing them all.


how would that be any different? If everyone has looms then its the same as no one having looms. Currently people sell LP to pay for upkeep or market traders jew people out of gold.

You are left with some people complaining about the armoury limit because they have over 25 masterwork items. Then you have people who are stuck wearing armour they don't like or using weapons they don't like because they don't have the looms they want :P

Also no looms means more melee damage :D Or at least reset them so Looms become something special like they were supposed to be, not the norm <-- as chadz said he intended


remove looms buff freedom!  Personally im not too bothered if everyone has all their gear loomed. My alts will still run around in gear that is unloomed and different to my main because all looking the same sucks :D
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Leshma on January 23, 2014, 04:27:55 pm
Without looms, this mod will be more like native. I don't play native because there's that feeling like I'm wasting time. These flashy items make that feeling go away and give a bit of purpose to playing (having fun).
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 04:30:08 pm
Apart from grind, outdated feature is shield forcefield while mounted, outdated feature is realistic fall damage, outdated feature is sheatable/non-sheatable mechanics, outdated feature is turn rate nerf, outdated feature is lance angle nerf. Mainly combination of realistic and non-realistic features that are annoying and bring less fun to playing this mod.
Could you develop this thought? I think it's just blocking on horseback that works weird, not only shield on hback.

I like turn rate nerf. You actually have to aim your stab now to hit a sidestepping enemy. The problem of turn rate nerf was that hit-detection that got really weird.

Lance angle, I agree, but I don't think it should be like in native. Lance angle should depend on your actual speed. Would make more sense then oh-I-stab-forward-forward-forward-lewk!-I-haz-no-muzls-and-cunt-turn.

Sheathable mechanics are weird because I don't know how you can just stick an awlpike or fauchard to your back like it's nothing.

Also rearing horses with a touch of mentioned fauchard or glance of long polearms..

Without looms, this mod will be more like native. I don't play native because there's that feeling like I'm wasting time. These flashy items make that feeling go away and give a bit of purpose to playing (having fun).

Yet cRPG has it's leveling system which would still make your build unique if only cRPG put more accent on the build, not eq.

(click to show/hide)

I was just afraid that with loom removal all the items would stay with 'nerfed' stats. Easy access to looms would be good enough to get yourself wanted item imho and would keep 'the goal'-factor in game.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Joker86 on January 23, 2014, 04:33:31 pm
- Battle game mode requiring infantry which is on foot with heavy armour and weapons with reach of 60-200 on average to hunt down archers and cavalry in order to kill them

- Upkeep system being complete and utter bullshit

- Character skill system being too plain, linear and unlfexible

- Reward system with multipliers being the absolute top candidate for the Darwin award as soon as someone dies of it

- Heirlooms which actually improve your power instead of giving only secondary or visual advantages
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 04:35:26 pm
- Reward system with multipliers being the absolute top candidate for the Darwin award as soon as someone dies of it
I heard they are working on new exp system.  :wink:  :lol:
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Leshma on January 23, 2014, 04:37:01 pm
Yes, blocking on horseback is broken in general. But at least there are ways how to hit a player who uses no shield. With a shield that's very hard thing to pull off.

Turnrate nerf makes me hate my awlpike, not because it's not effective in combat but because I teamhit a lot while using it. I cannot force my mind to imagine things it can't see. Instead of hitting where it should, it cancels before it and hits somewhere else and here comes a teamkill...

Lance angle is awful from the day one and reason why I never touched lancer cav again. And I enjoyed it, especially with shorter lances.

Sheathable mechanics are realistic, make sense but... this game engine have abysmal collision detection which makes picking up items from the ground a very, very painful experience. That is why players rarely play with one sheathable and one non-sheathable item at the same time.

cRPG leveling is over for most players, I'm afraid. There's a ton of people sitting on their level 35 builds. If you remove looms, playing cRPG for them will be the same as playing native (with quite a few fixes).
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Patoson on January 23, 2014, 04:37:53 pm
Knockdown, or at least its frequency.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Leshma on January 23, 2014, 04:39:48 pm
Upkeep system being complete and utter bullshit

Okay, we remove it and now what? A week later every server looks the same as Druzhina XP Strat Battle... don't let them fool you, too much plate on the battlefield makes this game unfun, to the point where it's comparable with War of the Roses..

Knockdown, or at least its frequency.

Oh yes, almost forgot. Knockdown frequency is through the roof. Something is terribly wrong there.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Grumbs on January 23, 2014, 04:41:51 pm
Automatically sharing looms with clan mates would be nice without messing with the armoury. I don't care if more than one can use it at the same time, just would be a decent way to let new guys have some looms and take some power away from people with full +3's and high level

Otherwise, I'd buff +1 and +2 while nerfing +3. Or buff +0 and make +1,2,3 less of a boost

Levelling takes too long to get to a good level. Rather than getting more xp per level with each gen, how about letting you start at a higher level? So you can skip some levels with each gen until you start at like lvl 20. This would be optional so people can still play low level if they want

Ranged gameplay mechanics are ancient, like oldschool crosshair games in a melee combat sim. Thats something for another game though I think
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: dynamike on January 23, 2014, 04:45:54 pm
The community.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Joker86 on January 23, 2014, 04:49:40 pm
Okay, we remove it and now what? A week later every server looks the same as Druzhina XP Strat Battle... don't let them fool you, too much plate on the battlefield makes this game unfun, to the point where it's comparable with War of the Roses..

I didn't say to remove it without replacement. Of course you need to limit equipment some other way, which is not completely retarded.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Osiris on January 23, 2014, 04:53:33 pm
With the money people have now Wearing plate isnt a problem. I don't wear plate because its heavy and sucks :D Most people who wear light/medium armour do it because it fits their style or look not because they are too poor for plate
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 04:56:00 pm
With the money people have now Wearing plate isnt a problem. I don't wear plate because its heavy and sucks :D Most people who wear light/medium armour do it because it fits their style or look not because they are too poor for plate
That's true. Plate is good in duel with a long weapon, a game of patience. Plate is also good on horseback where it doesn't slow you down. I don't like using plate as infantry guy because I'm just way more prone to gangbangs and dodging skills go to pieces against ranged players.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: sF_Guardian on January 23, 2014, 04:56:45 pm
Banning siege equip on siege is outdated shit.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: //saxon on January 23, 2014, 04:58:46 pm
The game Engine is outdated now.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Oberyn on January 23, 2014, 05:07:33 pm
The game it's based on, yeah. +1 Saxon.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: KaMiKaZe_JoE on January 23, 2014, 05:11:01 pm
Upkeep is a little fucky.

I mean, if I remember correctly, it's primary purpose was to keep people from using plate and good gear whenever they wanted to. But that's not an issue now, for most of us. I think. I have tons of gold from all my retirements and looms and shit. It's literally a non-issue. I don't use plate because it slows me down, athletically and WPF-wise, and I get gang-banged. I suppose things might be different for strength crutchers, but I can't imagine that money alone is what keeps most of the community from using plate armor.

Plus it only really applies to Battle and Siege and who cares about that shit?

Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Grumbs on January 23, 2014, 05:11:23 pm
With the money people have now Wearing plate isnt a problem. I don't wear plate because its heavy and sucks :D Most people who wear light/medium armour do it because it fits their style or look not because they are too poor for plate

People use plate in strat because dying is less of a hindrance (just run straight back to the mob) and because ranged isn't so prevalent. You need to have decent movement speed in battle and you still die in a similar amount of hits against projectiles, its harder to dodge and getting staggered means you take longer to accelerate again than in medium armour

If you need to take a shield as well you will want light/medium armour so you don't weight yourself down so much
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Tydeus on January 23, 2014, 05:21:27 pm
I heard they are working on new exp system.  :wink: :lol:
"...working on"
Soon™
December 2010
etc...

Here's my list, but don't expect changes any time soon. Most have already been stated. Also, these features are issues only to be found in cRPG, many of the previously stated features are not cRPG features, but native Warband features.

Multiplier system, static lancing angles, 10+ shield skill, skill/attribute point conversion functionality, monetary system, marketplace tax, non-free character respecs, armor scaling(the fact that plate armor even functions as anything more than an aesthetic choice).

Or how about the fact that it's still confined to the intricacies(read: COMPLETE BULLSHIT) of the Warband Module System? I'd say that's outdated feature #1.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 05:27:46 pm
"...working on"
Soon™
December 2010
etc...

Here's my list, but don't expect changes any time soon. Most have already been stated. Also, these are features are issues only to be found in cRPG, many of the previously stated features are not cRPG features, but native Warband features.

Multiplier system, static lancing angles, 10+ shield skill, skill/attribute point conversion functionality, monetary system, marketplace tax, non-free character respecs, armor scaling(the fact that plate armor even functions as anything more than an aesthetic choice).

Or how about the fact that it's still confined to the intricacies(read: COMPLETE BULLSHIT) of the Warband Module System? I'd say that's outdated feature #1.
Could you explain your thoughts? I have explained mine in the 1st post. It became tl;dr that I guess everybody has skipped, which doesn't change the fact that I'd gladly read a well built set of sentences explaining somebody's point of view. No need to go super-detail quality just a few more sentences please :-)
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Grumbs on January 23, 2014, 05:28:11 pm
Xbows and HA?
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 05:29:05 pm
Xbows and HA?
Outdated because...? Your solution/idea is...?
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Kalp on January 23, 2014, 05:43:49 pm
Outdated because...? Your solution/idea is...?
You are Beta Tester, tell me  :D
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 05:48:16 pm
You are Beta Tester, tell me  :D
:?:
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: dynamike on January 23, 2014, 05:53:37 pm
Multiplier system, static lancing angles Elaborate please, 10+ shield skill, skill/attribute point conversion functionality Elaborate please, monetary system Elaborate please, marketplace tax, non-free character respecs, armor scaling(the fact that plate armor even functions as anything more than an aesthetic choice) Elaborate please.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Joker86 on January 23, 2014, 05:55:50 pm
Could you explain your thoughts? I have explained mine in the 1st post. It became tl;dr that I guess everybody has skipped, which doesn't change the fact that I'd gladly read a well built set of sentences explaining somebody's point of view. No need to go super-detail quality just a few more sentences please :-)

A little bit more elaborate explanation of my point of view. (http://forum.melee.org/general-discussion/number-of-players-declining/msg940136/#msg940136) Read also Grumbs' answer and my reply to it.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Tzar on January 23, 2014, 05:59:37 pm
For the people, who have a hard time remembering why they nerfed the lance angle, after watching plz shatup about wanting it back thx.

 :arrow:
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Gurnisson on January 23, 2014, 06:03:24 pm
Knockdown would happen way too regularly if it didn't have a counter in rolls. I'm literally in shock when I get hit with a blunt weapon and don't get knocked to the ground, but with the roll, at least I can dodge the retarded knockdown + kick combo from time to time.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Tydeus on January 23, 2014, 06:05:44 pm
Most of that in the video isn't even due to the lance angle, but the speed of the lance thrust. Not a good representation of why the angles were lowered.  :?
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Tzar on January 23, 2014, 06:07:21 pm
Tydeus, you havent thought this one trough, since it means the end of 1h/2h cav.

If i need to explain why, im really gonna be shocked, since your the item balancer  :wink:

PS: Im not saying the current lancing fights are really, if not EXTREME boring atm with the current angle nerf, but reverting it to its old state is insanity  :lol:

Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Tzar on January 23, 2014, 06:19:54 pm
My suggestions:

Speed up the freaking game! Atm its really boring, the combat speed is insanely sloooooooow :!: ......

We want more fast paced action  :idea:

Plus, it would bring back players who quit cause of the constant nerfs to the combat system.

All we have left are the old people, the grinders, the strat junkies :D , the stab molesters, the range horde.

I know tons of people who would start playing again if you, took an speeded up the combat system.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Dede on January 23, 2014, 07:07:49 pm
For the people, who have a hard time remembering why they nerfed the lance angle, after watching plz shatup about wanting it back thx.

 :arrow:

Well, I am not sure if its a good example to justify the "lance angle nerf" with a game-record of Tommy(one of the best Lance cavs)
Cav duels are not interesting anymore, and are more random than skillbased in my opinion. Forcing the "Lance -cav-class" to backstabbing unavare infantry is also boring - "no challenge, no fun".

It can be done much better, like nerfing/reducing the damage of the lance when its reaches certain angle. This way it would be only possible to do the full damage with straight lance attacks. Also in terms of realism that would make much more sense.


I have an old post where I posted my other suggestions with an image how it would look like:
Horses - how to improve difficulty
http://forum.melee.org/general-discussion/horses-how-to-improve-difficulty/msg534360/#msg534360
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: the real god emperor on January 23, 2014, 07:51:48 pm
-Upkeep system is really dumb
-Multi system aswell
-Sudden horse stops, and teleports.
-Archery nerfed to the ground unrealistically.
-Knockdown+kick+knockdown+kick.... combos
-Turnspeed nerfs are unrealistic and slows the game way too much.
-Agiwhores dealing more damage than Strwhores.

Also free respecs every week is a good idea imo
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Tydeus on January 23, 2014, 08:13:03 pm
Tydeus, you havent thought this one trough, since it means the end of 1h/2h cav.

If i need to explain why, im really gonna be shocked, since your the item balancer  :wink:

PS: Im not saying the current lancing fights are really, if not EXTREME boring atm with the current angle nerf, but reverting it to its old state is insanity  :lol:

ALSO: The slow ass right swings on all weapons.... this attack move is obsolete an needs a speed up  :P
Alright, first of all, we shouldn't revert to the old lancing angles. Second, I think there's room to increase the available turning angles based on weapon length, so there's more reason to take a Light Lance, or possibly even a War Spear(or any other semi-long pointed poke-stick). This would basically mean leaving the Heavy Lance exactly as it is and giving the light lance 5-15 additional degrees of freedom on either side.

For the other stuff I was asked to elaborate on:
Due to the way skill conversions work, you're almost always kicking yourself in the foot by converting more than just a couple of times. I'm not sure there's a solution to be found here, but the system itself just makes me cringe. It offers players customization at the cost of overall effectiveness.

The monetary system, the foundation all equipment is built upon. Not only is the way in which players gain gold flawed, but item costs, upkeep basically anything and everything else that is dependent upon or that uses gold, is now therefore flawed as well. There isn't one good thing I have to say about our current system other than the fact that it's currently better than having nothing. There's also no easy fix to this system because nearly everything needs reworked from the ground up. Just think of all the marketplace trades that would be so much easier to do if everything ran on currency rather than trades. The fastest way to turn one item into another of your choice, is to simply turn the item into gold, then outright buy the item you want. Unfortunately due to our gold system and taxes(which are really only necessary because our gold system is flawed), this doesn't really work too well.

Armor scaling. Without writing paragraphs elaborating on this (I could literally write a 2,000 word essay on how our armor values fuck over nearly every aspect of balance), I'll just point out a few things that should be apparent to anyone. With heirlooms you can increase your armor level by 10, which is a difference of... 50 gold and 1.3 weight that can reduce damage by about 20% reduction in damage taken for realistically about a 0 % increase in effectiveness or it could mean... a difference of 16,000 gold (gold system flawed much?) and 7.9 weight that can reduce damage by 20-100%(because you can turn 5-10 damage into 0-2 damage due to cut retardation) and provides a massive increase to actual effectiveness.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Tagora on January 23, 2014, 08:14:13 pm
Improve the armor system.
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: sF_Guardian on January 23, 2014, 11:21:08 pm
My suggestions:

Speed up the freaking game! Atm its really boring, the combat speed is insanely sloooooooow :!: ......

We want more fast paced action  :idea:

Plus, it would bring back players who quit cause of the constant nerfs to the combat system.

All we have left are the old people, the grinders, the strat junkies :D , the stab molesters, the range horde.

I know tons of people who would start playing again if you, took an speeded up the combat system.

bbuuut Qoray would have to rework his macros to be faster... :(
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Osiris on January 23, 2014, 11:24:39 pm
They would be the same macros used in native so doubt it :D

But game just doesn't have the same feel of excitement, Eu1 makes me rage and eu2 gets boring :D I have more fun/excitement when playing native matches. maybe its because i haven't done many or maybe because strat/clan battles here are the only real thing that means much :D
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Smithy on January 23, 2014, 11:35:41 pm
I like the grind.  Guess I'm weird.   :rolleyes:
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 11:38:30 pm
bbuuut Qoray would have to rework his macros to be faster... :(
Call me naive but I actually trust him that those aren't macros, or at least most of them aren't.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: sF_Guardian on January 23, 2014, 11:40:59 pm
Call me naive but I actually trust him that those aren't macros, or at least most of them aren't.

But I don't want to call you naive :(

It's always the same move with any weapons I saw him using and it's way too fast IMO.
I don't want to claim the truth here, especially since my assumptions and what I've heard does harm a player but I'm dammn sucpicious about him.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Grumbs on January 23, 2014, 11:41:49 pm
What does the supposed macro do exactly?
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Kastu on January 23, 2014, 11:52:05 pm
Rain slowing everything down. I don't mind it being a visual effect but otherwise I see nothing positive in it, no matter what class I play.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Grumbs on January 23, 2014, 11:56:25 pm
Rain slowing everything down. I don't mind it being a visual effect but otherwise I see nothing positive in it, no matter what class I play.

Yep, an example of realism that doesn't add much in the terms of fun gameplay

I do like a bit of dynamic gameplay based on realistic stuff like weather effects, just don't think it really adds much in cRPG. Maybe it can be reworked in a way that adds something fun or tactical to the gameplay. Darkness is similar but not quite so bad.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: BlueKnight on January 23, 2014, 11:58:55 pm
When we're talking about weather, I'd like to mention fucking fog...

here are Atze and Qoray duels, with bonus slow motion footage just for kafein


Terrible weather again, makes the quality look even worse

Example of how everything is grey in a fog. So grey that you can get depressed just by playing this game. Everything becomes invisible in fog.

I know that some people enjoy fog but I just can't...

(click to show/hide)
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Templar_Steevee on January 24, 2014, 12:14:50 am

-Archery nerfed to the ground unrealistically.


I can't agree with that. Good players can easilly be in top of scoreboard still, no matter they are x-bows, foot archers or mounted ranged.
And it looks like you forget that this game's name is Mount&Blade, not arrow&x-bow.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Christo on January 24, 2014, 03:35:07 am
multiplier system, it's horrible

was bad when it got introduced, wasn't changed ever since.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: the real god emperor on January 24, 2014, 07:14:00 am
Call me naive but I actually trust him that those aren't macros, or at least most of them aren't.

Those aren't macros, everyone experienced in native two handed can perform the same lolfeint (including me), the reason people don't do it, it gives you a big advantage and it ruins all the fun of your opponent, lolfeinting is the second most gay thing in this game imo (first is fake peasants).However, countering lolfeint is much easier than you think, all lolfeinters are known players like Atze,Qoray etc..., when you come across them you will know when they will do that gay thing, and you can just spam them to death.

Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Dionysus on January 24, 2014, 07:22:07 am
The repair system and the distribution of experience and wealth are pretty deplorable, really.

Current state of cRPG for new players:

Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: korppis on January 24, 2014, 07:29:16 am
Knockdown would happen way too regularly if it didn't have a counter in rolls. I'm literally in shock when I get hit with a blunt weapon and don't get knocked to the ground, but with the roll, at least I can dodge the retarded knockdown + kick combo from time to time.

Sadly rolling still doesn't seem to work on EU2.  :(
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: FleetFox on January 24, 2014, 10:32:24 am
[H]ello!

So I was wondering what our beloved cRPG community may consider outdated in cRPG. Please type what YOU think is out of place now and how you think it could be changed.

From my point of view, cRPG's most outdated feature is it's grinding. As the whole set of MWs and high level characters (at least EU) are bocimng new standards, there is nothing amazing about being high level born in strat or about having MWs. Why should we keep this rate of gaining shit so low. It only discourages some people from trying out new things on new characters or playing other classes that you'd need different MWs for. For example for playing cav in EU a +3horse is an compulsory item, same goes for playing 1hander because 1h swords gain significant amount of cut damage that is necessary to deal with high armour values nicely. Polearmers and 2hs have high base damage so unloomed weapons in those categories are ok.

We can talk about how much high level gives you and all in all, it usually depends on the build itself, not only on the char's lvl. You can have some hybrids that at high level feel like ~30 lvl in 2 categoies or sth like that despite being lvl 34. The thing is that at higher lvl values, builds go way more interesting and you can creatively build your own character the way you want it.

I know that no-exp-punishment auctions are a good source of gold sink, but what if you could respec your character without losing exp and then you'd get 1week cooldown on another respec? Respecing your hero would be like respecing your STF but with those differences that character keeps his level and gains 1 week cooldown to another respec.

1. It would increase variety and give player more freedom,
2. You have to wait a week to change your strat-char anyway so it would be quite similar and shouldn't be abusable,
3. Devs/overlords could make gamechanging-decisions and could not give a fuck about community because people would have an access to respecs (would take them some time but it'd be doable to respec few chars with hero-changing)
4. It would refresh the game imho, more people would play with some role-play builds or with builds that they always wanted to try out, - summing up, people would play for fun more.

Or if you don't like this idea, then at least make STFs lvl 32.

Seriously I remember having to sacrifice my alt few years ago to transfer my MW item to my main. I remember STF being respecable but with 7 days cooldown. Remember loads of things that got changed over time to the state that we have now and I guess, we can all agree that those changes only did good to cRPG.

Players & wealth & attitude & levels & items have changed and those changes have to be followed by proper cRPG changes.

(click to show/hide)


tl;dr bla bla bla


Now tell me what you think should get updated to follow new cRPG's spirit and help it progress!

I think your suggestions are brilliant sir, I couldn't agree more with the respeccing being free with a 7 day cool down, its just logical in my opinion. Hopefully the devs will take heeds of this...
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Camaris on January 24, 2014, 01:22:23 pm
There should be a free respec for one loom every month or two.
Without cost, without penalty.
Also every 3-4 month a free character respec. It should be possible to change playstyle without new grind.
Not every day but from time to time.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: YnScN on January 24, 2014, 01:44:38 pm
I still dont know what would happen if we could respec at any moment without any cost? Whats too bad about it?
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Byrdi on January 24, 2014, 01:56:20 pm
I agree with the OP.

Though I think a week is too little time between free respecs.
I would rather have it be a month or two. This way you will still have the joy of expectation.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Maksimus on January 24, 2014, 02:33:25 pm
Free respec for one week is very nice idea. For example there were so many patches and my friend is 35 lvl. And his build sucks now. After last patch he totally destroyed his build, because he didn't know what changes had come. And now he doesnt have enough motivation to play. Make free respecs.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Spartacus on January 24, 2014, 03:46:25 pm
From chadz
Quote
2. Change the multi system
Yes, the multi system is silly. I have no trouble admitting that :]

It makes you stop playing when you drop to x1, and it forces you to continue playing when you have x5.

Therefore, we'll change the system to something that rewards personal skill and risk more. It will be, among other factors, proximity based, as we had in the early versions of cRPG. It will definately not be purely kill based, we don't want to reward fraghunters over teamplayers. It will also not reward proximity leechers. You can expect this change soon.
soon
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Kafein on January 24, 2014, 03:49:02 pm
Free respec for one week is very nice idea. For example there were so many patches and my friend is 35 lvl. And his build sucks now. After last patch he totally destroyed his build, because he didn't know what changes had come. And now he doesnt have enough motivation to play. Make free respecs.

Aaaah that friend again.


I don't believe free respecs right now would a good thing. It would just further separate the high levels and the not high levels, because the peasants would absolutely not profit from it, while those that already have it easy would fine-tune their builds even more, or go FOTM.

Your point about grinding becoming an unnecessary barrier for new players is correct though. Nowadays the norm is to have a full +3 set and be level 34. And whatever it happens to be, the norm should be reachable quicker than right now.
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: FleetFox on January 24, 2014, 03:59:26 pm
Aaaah that friend again.


I don't believe free respecs right now would a good thing. It would just further separate the high levels and the not high levels, because the peasants would absolutely not profit from it, while those that already have it easy would fine-tune their builds even more, or go FOTM.

Your point about grinding becoming an unnecessary barrier for new players is correct though. Nowadays the norm is to have a full +3 set and be level 34. And whatever it happens to be, the norm should be reachable quicker than right now.

Pretty sure all high level players have already fine tuned their builds so not sure that point is much of a barrier. Peasants could definitely profit from it because when they first start they play and put points into lots of skills not knowing its better to specialise, the implementation of a free respec a week would therefore help increase the chance of new players continuing with the mod as they don't have to waste half their game time when they realise they have fucked up their builds.

I strongly believe this needs some real consideration from the developers, and I would appreciate it if they responded to this thread, just so we have some idea how they feel about this topic :).
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Osiris on January 24, 2014, 05:44:38 pm
yeah my lvl 32 main feels pretty weak when it takes 5+ hits to the head with +3 military cleaver with 6ps to kill someone :(

my alts generally feel very weak :D hitting a guy 10 times then getting one hit at level 16 really gets annoying (so ive respeeced my 2h and pole alt to heavily str based :D)
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on January 24, 2014, 08:53:32 pm
I like the idea of giving players a free respec (with a 7 day, or even longer cool-down timer).  I dislike the idea of having a STF be level 32 (a lot of people wouldn't play main chars then). 
Pretty sure all high level players have already fine tuned their builds so not sure that point is much of a barrier. Peasants could definitely profit from it because when they first start they play and put points into lots of skills not knowing its better to specialise, the implementation of a free respec a week would therefore help increase the chance of new players continuing with the mod as they don't have to waste half their game time when they realise they have fucked up their builds.

I strongly believe this needs some real consideration from the developers, and I would appreciate it if they responded to this thread, just so we have some idea how they feel about this topic :).


That's actually not that true.   It sucks trying to grind through low level archer builds (especially low level horse archer builds).  But if you're already level 35, you no longer have the barrier of having to "suffer through" painful low levels as a horse archer.

Same goes for other things, I would never have aimed for a 24/18 build at level 34 when I was starting out and was at level 30, because for 100+million XP that would have meant not having a lot of skills (since I dumped them into the "skills to attributes" field).  But when I got the free respec, I was able to go 24/18 because I didn't have to worry about sacrificing skills for millions of XP until I got my perfect "min-max" build I was looking for.

So there are certainly "cons" to giving people free respecs, but I think the pro's outweigh them.  Especially the fact that devs could then make large gameplay changes without sending some players packing for the door and never coming back (looking at you crossbow usage without needing a skill associated with it like every other weapon type, e.g. throwing, archery, melee). 
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Sniger on January 25, 2014, 04:33:13 am
IDGAF  :lol:
Title: Re: The most outdated feature of cRPG is...?
Post by: Xeen on January 25, 2014, 01:00:54 pm
Lots of things.  If I had to name one, though, I'd go with upkeep.  They just need to be done with it and just fully balance the items.  Items like the scythe, low-end spears, the daggers (especially prenerf), regular maul, and shortened military scythe are all great examples of extremely dirt-cheap items that are actually really great at what they do with unique strengths that you don't find on any other items.  They could simply accentuate these features and have lots of balanced, varying items for us to choose from.