shut your whore mouth ranged my old friend
Archers have rarely ever decided a round.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Yeah sure, maybe a single individual archer (and even then that ignores a lot of the archer superstars who absolutely can influence a round on their own) but a knot of 5-6 my old friendchers hiding behind their inf blob? Are you serious?
And a group of infantry does neither decide a round? A group of cavalry doesnt either? You cannot tell me that you think 50 Archers will ever win vs 50 infantry players (who also have shields and probably throwing weapons).
Here it comes again, you don't see ranged as a real part of the game. Of course Archers are able to shoot down infantry while theyre fully protected by their own infantry. That's how it is intended to work.
No, whiny ass bitching melee elitists who wants to nerf shit is destroying this game, so fuck off. I myself play melee btw. But I guess most melee players are 14 year old girls with a constantly bleeding pussy.
No, whiny ass bitching melee elitists who wants to nerf shit is destroying this game, so fuck off. I myself play melee btw. But I guess most melee players are 14 year old girls with a constantly bleeding pussy.Thats messed up bro....
Infantry and cavalry decides 98% of all rounds.
Is that supposed to be adressed to me? If so, it's quite a retarded nonsequitur. But I guess most 14 year old girls on a constant period might have reading comprehension issues.Noone in general, why so sensitive?
It's as if a pure archer was complainging about meele classes being too strong.
What's killing the mod are people who refuse to use any countermeasures against ranged and then compain about them being too powerful.
It's as if a pure archer was complainging about meele classes being too strong.
This stupid hypocrisy is really annoying.
Isn't that exactly what Miwiw was doing?
Alot of people bitch about ranged, but I dont think they really mean what the say or claim cause the meleeonly servers are completely empty compared to the regular ones. Personally I feel like only having melee is just boring.
Such stupid threads, seriously. You're either totally dumb or seriously lost in hatred (cause you died once without being able of hitting back). Infantry and cavalry decides 98% of all rounds. It has always been like this. Be aware that crossbows usually count as infantry too as 90% of those got average melee skills as well (such as 100 wpf and 5-6 PS + IF sometimes and decent armor despite the use of their crossbows).
Archers have rarely ever decided a round. There are sometimes maps that are better for Archers during early and mid round when for example camping a certain high ground. If Archers are nicely split up they do easily shoot enemy inf to pieces. However it usually ends with infantry and cav getting close to the enemy and slaying them without any real effort.
Just compare it, an Archer can take down an infantry/cav player with a lucky shot to the head (not all of those 1hit). At lvl 28+ an Archer becomes as strong as an infantry if you compare the damage. However infantry really takes more hits. They got more armor, an Archer who's medium armored lacks movement speed and a little drawing speed + aim but only has around 35-40 body armor (and maybe some more due to gauntlets).
40 body armor is light for infantry. 80% of the infantry players wear heavier armor than Heraldic Mail.
Even with my last gear set up which gave me 55 body armor I had been a 1hit by a simple pole thrust (0 IF, infantry maybe had 5-8 PS). Usually you can be lucky to survive more than 1 hit.
Melee ability for archers are too costy if you compare it to additonal points in AGI/WM or PD. An Archer hybrid is only a bit better than an Archer in melee without any PS/wpf. You notice a difference tho but it's usually not enough when facing a dedicated 2h player who got at least 7 PS or 7 WM or maybe both (if skill level of both is the same).
For an Archer.... meh I just notice I cba to finish this post as most of the infantry players who are infested with hate vs ranged, will ignore anything but their own opinion and keep on claiming that a "certain" class was destroying the game.
That's the sad part about people.
In the end I had it far easier when playing 2h, I won far more rounds, got valour in 2/3 of my rounds and finished generations much faster than playing as archer.
Keep on hating.
Alot of people bitch about ranged, but I dont think they really mean what the say or claim cause the meleeonly servers are completely empty compared to the regular ones. Personally I feel like only having melee is just boring.
Agreed. And it makes cav completely OP. Archers and xbows are, sadly, a necessary evil.
i agree they have to be inside the game, for sure, but not as they are now; nerf them, put a number limit to ranged, do whatever you want but do something, and do it asap please; eu 1 is already empty.
Those words in bald are probably the most idiotic words I've ever read; anyway, even if I know i should have stopped at the first line (i love that 98% because it means you're accurate in your bullshits), xbowmen count as fucking ranged; the fact they can handle their selves in melee just gives points to me, not to your argument. Archers have rarely ever decided a round? are you sure you're playing crpg? i dunno maybe you're used to eu 2, i really hope so? I don't know if you noticed that after this patch, at the end of every round there are at least 60-70% of ranged. i'm not really going to comment the rest, since a sentence like "an Archer can take down an infantry/cav player with a lucky shot to the head" doesn't make any sense, and others like "I had been a 1hit by a simple pole thrust" are simply bullshit; I, with 7 ps, hardly ever take down an archer with a single hit, unless I hit him in the head (i don't see any problem in this case).
this is just like the great cav spam in 0`12, it will go away.
Those words in bald are (probably) the most idiotic words I've ever read; (...) I'm not really going to comment the rest (...)
Ye, you'regood at arguingproving points.
this is just like the great cav spam in 0`12, it will go away.It went away cuz heavy lance transformed into heavy glance and cav that didn't quit, it became 1h cav. You don't have many EU lancecavs except you Torby, Musashi, Oliviero and Grellenort (sorry to all lancers that I didn't mention). Also Ujin plays lancer from time to time but I don't see him very often on EU_1.
Here's where the basic anger against ranged comes from.As melee, invest 1-2 points into throwing, then you can use war darts and shurikens. Fight fire with fire.
You can hit your enemy without fear of immediate retaliation. There's nothing a melee guy can do until he reaches you. Shielders (in NA at least- we only have one or two high agi shielders that aren't gimmicks) are about as slow as archers and crossbowman- and the new spate of lance throwers have made this worst.
Control the battlefield, you win the round. If your team has more ranged, you control the battlefield because you're drawing the enemy to you. That's the advantage everyone instinctively dislikes, I believe. Not the damage they do or anything like that (though it does suck being one-shot by them) but the fact that they control the battle.
The other part of the frustration is that ranged these days don't get one hit or even two hit, contrary to XyNox' post. Spend the entire round sneaking up on ranged. Get there. Hit the ranged guy twice, hit his other friend thrice, they're both still alive, they shoot you in the face, you die. You know who one hits me? Not melee, usually. Ranged. Ranged one hits me.
You see, the team that s-keys wins, and if you have all the ranged, then you're forcing people to W-key.
Here's where the basic anger against ranged comes from.
You can hit your enemy without fear of immediate retaliation. There's nothing a melee guy can do until he reaches you. Shielders (in NA at least- we only have one or two high agi shielders that aren't gimmicks) are about as slow as archers and crossbowman- and the new spate of lance throwers have made this worst.
Control the battlefield, you win the round. If your team has more ranged, you control the battlefield because you're drawing the enemy to you. That's the advantage everyone instinctively dislikes, I believe. Not the damage they do or anything like that (though it does suck being one-shot by them) but the fact that they control the battle.
The other part of the frustration is that ranged these days don't get one hit or even two hit, contrary to XyNox' post. Spend the entire round sneaking up on ranged. Get there. Hit the ranged guy twice, hit his other friend thrice, they're both still alive, they shoot you in the face, you die. You know who one hits me? Not melee, usually. Ranged. Ranged one hits me.
You see, the team that s-keys wins, and if you have all the ranged, then you're forcing people to W-key.
-You wear light armour (and the ranged is heavy crossbowman or a powerful thrower) in which case it's your own fault)
Bow archer %30
xbow archer %70
People said get points in shield to combat ranged so i did, dosent work
People said use an agi build to catch the archers so i did, didnt work
People said play cav to counter archers so i did, horse gets 3-4 shot by archers ( that being a champion warhorse) and it takes 2 lance thrusts and 2 couches to kill an archer
i liked ranged the way they were before, there were enough to persuade the outcome of the battlefield but no too many that i would GTX because there were 10-15 archers standing on a hill.
The only reason why i wear heavy armour is because of ranged, i dont want to be 1 shot by an arbalest 24/7 or 2 hit by a bow, its just frustrating
Archers were fine before and only the bad archers complained about how bad it was, revert back to the old archery, it required more skill
IMHO whole Battle game mode has dumbed down quite a lot. When I started 2 years ago, there was less ranged overall (especially xbows), and they used to be much less skilled than nowdays. We also had much, much better variety of city / village maps + ladders. With all that combined, it used to be possible to do flank trips which made the battle so much more enjoyable (nothing beats 10 shielders jumping in the middle of enemy team from rooftop 8-)). And thanks to that the battles used to change place a lot more often than now.
Now most ranged are ADHD snipers who have eyes around all the time. If you try to flank you get shot instantly. Most of the maps are just open plains with hardly any cover, and ladders are gone for those few city maps that's left. Right now the only thing you can do is to stay with the big blob of a team, run around like headless chicken trying to not get shot and wait for the mindless blob to collide with the other team.
There may be no way of limiting the amount of ranged if that's what people really want to play, but a lot could be done with some map work and maybe introducing ladders back. Sure some would abuse them at first, but that could be fixed with some rules.
Just make classes that "counter" archers stronger at countering archers. Which basically means, create something that counters archers, other than just outnumburing, because that's not a counter.
If an effective counter existed, the population would balance itself out. More archers would push people towards the class that counters them, leading to less archers.
Xbows, wait for archer to take a shot, click, onehit kill from a mile away, repeat. What more of a counter do you need ?If anything archers (and throwers, and lancers, and anything that can hit them while they reload while staying out of melee sidearm range) counters crossbowmen...
They are obviously all inhuman bundle of stickss, because I can't conceive of any other way anyone could enjoy playing ranged in this game (beyond throwing maybe). That doesn't mean I don't think they are part of the game.Trust me, it is really fun playing ranged, sometimes ranged players play this game called target Oberyn or his horse constantly and do nothing else, trust me, it is really fun, you should try it.
More symmetric maps designed for balance would fix a lot of this whining. More flat ground would help, too. Most of the really bad ranged rounds come from one team having more ranged and being closer to a cliff/hill that's hard to get up without being shot to death or simple hilly plains and steppe maps.
Stay on the front line close to your enemies, and the archers won't take the shot.Are we playing the same mod? I believe cav will change their motto from "hitting afks, late spawners, and peasants since 2010" before the archer motto changes from "always take the shot".
Are we playing the same mod? I believe cav will change their motto from "hitting afks, late spawners, and peasants since 2010" before the archer motto changes from "always take the shot".
Well fact is even if they take the shot (which I agree they sometimes do) it is much harder to hit the guy and there is always the risk of hitting a teammate. So basically in a clusterfuck it can even stand as an advantage.Have some compassion ffs, think of the poor teammate, do you really wanna encourage archers to teamkill him?
Have some compassion ffs, think of the poor teammate, do you really wanna encourage archers to teamkill him?
16 inf/cav
17 crossbow/archers
1 thrower
I call that balanced (if the same amount of ranged is on each team). And nothing wrong about a lower populated server. You dont need 200 ppl to have fun.
best part of it is that then you get often most of that ranged in one team and other team cant do shit,
Imho, pure melee builds aren't really suited for battle anyways, except for hoplites and pikemen (not like they got a choice).
The time when player skill was limited to combat skills is over guys, get over it.
Ranged are easy to counter if you have appropriate tactics and awareness. If you don't have a shield, don't be on the front line. Constantly move unpredictably. Get a shield or heavy armor. Use cover. Stay behind agi shielders. Sacrifice a point of PS to get shield skill. You can pick them off the ground. Stay on the front line close to your enemies, and the archers won't take the shot. Wait for the initial shooting to end. Wait for them to come to you. Sneak behind if you can. Even better, be an agi-shielder and hassle them. Remember, if the ranged aim for you, they ain't aiming for someone else. Having three archers targeting you can be advantageous if you take twice the time to die as it would take if they were to target someone else.Ranged have the lowest DPS of the game. Adapt.
Honestly I only had problems with ranged when I was alone with many archers remaining at the end of the round. Simply because my teammates weren't arsed to pay attention to their surroundings and use the basic tactics to stay alive.
Great meleeists are no longer those who play the best in melee combat. They are those who can defeat opponents no matter their class.
If the other team has more ranged, it means you have more infantry. If you are a team of defenseless of slow cans, don't wonder why you die.
Talking as a 7 gen full str tin can whose real enemy was gankers.
It's all nice, but how is this "I'm going to keep telling myself I'm countering archers by hiding behind this wall" going to actually counter the archers aka kill them ? If that's what you call a counter, I'd suggest that the next patch makes archers counter shieldless infantry in exactly the same way : hiding behind a wall, not being able to avoid attacks when getting out of cover and being unable to retaliate when under attack. That sure does sound like a very effective way of countering something.
Not getting killed is the first step to killing, young grasshopper.
On a serious note,one has to remember that technically, shieldless meleeists are supposed to be weak to archers. I give solutions on how to avoid getting raped by a superior enemy. I told how the gazelle can avoid the lion, and you ask me how the gazelle can kung-fu the shit out of the lion.
Making ranged effective while the player doesn't invest much gold either through repairs or looms is the complete opposite of how to balance ranged.
Dunno about Crossbows now thou. Since they increased the bolts their repairs should also be quite gay
No, whiny ass bitching melee elitists who wants to nerf shit is destroying this game, so fuck off. I myself play melee btw. But I guess most melee players are 14 year old girls with a constantly bleeding pussy.