cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Game Balance Discussion => Topic started by: Panzerstyle on August 18, 2012, 11:21:35 pm

Title: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Panzerstyle on August 18, 2012, 11:21:35 pm
No matter how many kills you get as ranged, you will almost never beat a melee with half the kills.

I guess it is because you are getting rewarded for being close to dieing opponent.

Guess what... Ranged doesn't do that! That doesn't mean they dont contribute to the team or the teamplay if - as on many maps - the ranged are protected or gathering up at specific good spots.

Several times I have had or seen other ranged 15 kills and still Random_melee_or_cav_guy with 7kills has almost twice the score.

Fix this!

And if valour now is based on scores - fix it asap!

It is getting boring killing 3 per round and still only just make it to top 10 in scores.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Bulzur on August 19, 2012, 03:06:23 am
If score is going to help determining the xp and gold gained, instead of multy, it would be nice to tweak it a bit to reward good range.

At the moment, it's more rewarding to shoot an horse, than shoot the cav. And the headshots doesn't seem to give much score.

On the other one, one of my arrow hit a teammate who rushed to kill an ennemy range, after i had shot him twice, and i lost something like 6 points.

I did manage to get valour once with my dear archer though. (on NA1 xD)
Even though i can get it a bit more easily on my cav alt wich is 2 level less than my main, and that i only started playing as cav since the previous gen.

Indeed, the score is not in our favour (you can get 1points in melee with a hammer doing 1dmg everytime, while you get 4 for a fantastic headshot on a good cav player. Hourra.)
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Leshma on August 19, 2012, 01:08:49 pm
Being archer isn't that bad but if you're using arbalest, you won't earn many points, that's for sure.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tor! on August 19, 2012, 01:17:32 pm
Yep.. Arbalest is pretty hard on the points. Pull of a long range headshot, and get an amazing two points!  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Miwiw on August 19, 2012, 01:19:29 pm
Good point Leshma. I bet it's hard to gain a good score as dedicated Crossbowman. Those who regularly go into melee, and only rarely use the crossbow (like taking some shots in the beginning of the round), won't have that problem as they are not only going with the group but also engage in melee. Standing behind and doing 5 shots a minute, with 3 out of 5 missing; they won't get many points. Archers are a bit better in that case. A bit.

Some thought will be needed here if xp and gold will ever be about the score (which seems like it, why else would score be needed :) ).
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Dravic on August 19, 2012, 01:21:00 pm
Add more score for headshots and it will balance out easily for the best ranged.

Simple as that.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Peasant_Woman on August 19, 2012, 08:48:09 pm
Quote from: Dravic on August 19, 2012, 01:21:00 pm
Add more score for headshots and it will balance out easily for the best ranged.

Simple as that.

My thoughts exactly. More points for headshots will encourage skilled play from ranged if they want to do well, and help balance out the amount of points they lose for being far away from the melee.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Penitent on August 20, 2012, 06:30:38 pm
A hospillater archer was in 1st place this morning, and when I switched on my archer alt I made 1st/2nd place for a while too, with not that many kills.

If you hit ppl a lot, you will score well.  Also, if you stay near your team sometimes and support them!

In very large battles, this may be different (cuz lots of score sharing going on in the massed groups) but in med/small battles it seems to work fine.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: ThePoopy on August 20, 2012, 06:59:59 pm
add a multiplier for how far away the target is and how much it moves
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Rumblood on August 20, 2012, 10:13:45 pm
I haven't had any issue being near the top of the scoreboard, occasionally on top even. That would almost never happen before. I think it's doing the job it was intended to do.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Sylfirus on August 20, 2012, 11:12:41 pm
Try to be first in EU_1 New with a dedicated crosbowman :  Almost impossible... :mad:


Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Leshma on August 20, 2012, 11:23:47 pm
Only Dave can do it, but that's because he's fighting half of the time.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: dodnet on August 21, 2012, 12:21:28 pm
Quote from: Sylfirus on August 20, 2012, 11:12:41 pm
Try to be first in EU_1 New with a dedicated crosbowman :  Almost impossible... :mad:

Mission completed!  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: [ptx] on August 21, 2012, 12:24:49 pm
This is more apparent with slower firing, longer range ranged, not so much with hornbow spammers and such.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Sandersson Jankins on August 21, 2012, 08:39:30 pm
I am currently playing a 15-24 arbalestier with some 2h wpf, and I find myself earning just the right amount of valour. Sometimes when I plug a horse with my big ole' crossbow, I'll get 6 points. That's a fuck-shit-stack of points for something that was likely neither dangerous to me, nor difficult in particular. I'm not the best arbalest player, it's my first generation out of 7 as a semi-dedicated ranged player. I have earned my share of valour, and when I have, I always felt like I really helped my team win, and I ended up very high on the scoreboard. Often I end up getting flanked, lanced, or straight up melee'd if my team falls apart. Most of the time when I die with few points, it is entirely my own fault. I could have paid more attention to the flankers and lancers, I could have ran away in melee. I could have stuck with more competent teammates. I could have done any number of things. If I don't do well, I've no chance of getting valour. I feel that is how it should be.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Cyclopsided on August 22, 2012, 12:44:22 am
Quote from: Peasant_Woman on August 19, 2012, 08:48:09 pm
My thoughts exactly. More points for headshots will encourage skilled play from ranged if they want to do well, and help balance out the amount of points they lose for being far away from the melee.
Exactly.
Quote from: Tor! on August 19, 2012, 01:17:32 pm
Yep.. Arbalest is pretty hard on the points. Pull of a long range headshot, and get an amazing two points!  :mrgreen:
^ this is how it is currently.
Currently headshot points are nerfed, you will only get 2 points for a headshot kill. It is bugged, or definitely not working as intended.

Let me paint you a picture of a round I had the other day. it was the first round of a city map, That I don't know the name of. There is a thick corridor everyone meets at amongst the buildings that rise high above on both sides. The ground is flat. It is a 30 vs 30 battle. I have run with the front of my melee pack, and since it is flat the enemy hoard is headshot heaven...

I did 10 headshot kills in a row and had 21 points, was near bottom of my team in score and the top of my team nobody had more than 4 kills but all top 10 on scoreboard had 40+ and the top 3 had 50+ points. Should've screencapped that BS.
I killed a third of the enemy team from full hp to dead, but was in the bottom third of my team scorewise. Broken system.

Meanwhile if I had done bodyshots instead of headshots, I would usually twoshot, sometimes threeshot those people, getting 3 points per shot.
Do the math
if points for damage were working as intended, I should have been narrowly on top of my team's scoreboard.
(and I was by my melee team the entire time)
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Renten on August 24, 2012, 08:36:41 am
3 shots to kill my 30/9 friend from a distance. 3 points total. 3  shots into him near point blank? 8 points. I have a feeling distance lowers the points you get. Also hitting a guy 4 or 5 times with my side arm gives way more points than if I get a lucky face stab in and instagib someone.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: OssumPawesome on August 28, 2012, 02:27:07 am
Agreed.  I think the assist system would be better if it included points for someone dieing soon after you wounded them instead of or in addition to someone dieing near to you.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Rumblood on August 29, 2012, 01:18:15 am
Quote from: Renten on August 24, 2012, 08:36:41 am
3 shots to kill my 30/9 friend from a distance. 3 points total. 3  shots into him near point blank? 8 points. I have a feeling distance lowers the points you get. Also hitting a guy 4 or 5 times with my side arm gives way more points than if I get a lucky face stab in and instagib someone.

That's interesting. I wonder if you got points for the kill, and extra points for being in proximity of a kill. So when at long ranges, you only get points for the kill, but not the extra points for also being near a kill (even though you did the kill).
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: RandomDude on September 02, 2012, 09:05:06 pm
Quote from: Sylfirus on August 20, 2012, 11:12:41 pm
Try to be first in EU_1 New with a dedicated crosbowman :  Almost impossible... :mad:

Try playing a real class then!
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tydeus on September 03, 2012, 07:39:18 pm
Quote from: Panzerstyle on August 18, 2012, 11:21:35 pm
No matter how many kills you get as ranged, you will almost never beat a melee with half the kills.
It's the exact opposite for me on my archer. I am almost always top 5 on my team, if not top 5 for the whole server yet I rarely match other people in kills.

Played for about thirty minutes and got this screen shot showing the exact opposite of what you claimed. My archer is still only level 26, and it's also a hybrid with 5 ps as well (insignificant 20~ 1h wpf). I hadn't even struck anyone with my niuweidao when I took this screenshot.

visitors can't see pics , please register or login


It may have issues, but it's no where nearly as bad as you think it is. I have constantly seen ranged at the top of the score board, dedicated and hybrids, archers, xbowers and throwers. Ive seen ranged and cav fill the top with melee nowhere to be seen and I've seen the exact opposite as well.

Edit: That screenshot is without looms as well. I don't own a mw bow or arrows, imagine how it'd be if I did. I know I don't have to bring up how much stronger archers get when they have both loomed.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Kafein on September 03, 2012, 07:44:01 pm
And so what ?

Achers and crossbowmen did well enough when we had radius based xp.

And yeah if you need points just find a horse and do something with it.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on September 03, 2012, 08:02:40 pm
Seems to me I always gets 2 points per shot or something, *Throw a lance at a guys chest, guy got full hp* 2 points, *Shot a guy in the leg with an arrow on my my old friendcher alt* 2 points.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: BlackMilk on September 03, 2012, 08:13:27 pm
Quote from: Leshma on August 19, 2012, 01:08:49 pm
Being archer isn't that bad but if you're using arbalest, you won't earn many points, that's for sure.
visitors can't see pics , please register or login

25-0 with atleast 22 arbalest kills and not even close to the top of the scoreboard...not sure if it's even possible to top the scoreboard as a arbalest user though to be honest
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Siiem on September 03, 2012, 08:18:44 pm
Nerf ranged. Look past the score system and they kill more than they should.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tydeus on September 03, 2012, 08:33:45 pm
Quote from: BlackMilk on September 03, 2012, 08:13:27 pm
visitors can't see pics , please register or login

25-0 with atleast 22 arbalest kills and not even close to the top of the scoreboard...not sure if it's even possible to top the scoreboard as a arbalest user though to be honest
Siege.

Likely this is why I don't have a problem with the score system. It could be possible that the score system is just setup in such a way that makes it harder for archers to top the score board in siege than in battle. I get a lot of points from downing cav, but in siege where people don't use horses, there isn't really the option to get points that way. It could also be working as intended as well, siege is much less about kills and far more about objectives.

Whether it is or it isn't, what it should do, is take into account flag captures, flag touches and killing people who are on the flag. You should probably also get points slowly for defending the flag even if enemies aren't right on top of it.

Edit: Not sure why I didn't realize it earlier, but clearly the proximity bonus does far more for you in siege than in battle.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Lech on September 03, 2012, 10:08:37 pm
Quote from: BlackMilk on September 03, 2012, 08:13:27 pm
visitors can't see pics , please register or login

25-0 with atleast 22 arbalest kills and not even close to the top of the scoreboard...not sure if it's even possible to top the scoreboard as a arbalest user though to be honest

Play real class and support people around you and capture or protect the flag, not just go for the kill. Where you were when there was 7 of your teammates in flag building fighting against lesser amount of my teammates ? Shooting totally unimportant people. Great. Guess what ? We protected the flag and won the round because I was fighting inside, preventing your team from capturing the flag.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: BlackMilk on September 03, 2012, 10:30:55 pm
and you know why there were lesser of your teammates? because i was trying my best to cut they Way off for the support that were on their way to Flag so i don't get what your Problem is really
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Lech on September 04, 2012, 01:15:36 pm
And you get 99 points during that round ( if i remember right). It was nearly enough for valor (you missed it by 5-15 points). You WOULD get it with similar performance during about 90% of rounds, it's just valor system which is too all-or-nothing.

I also sometimes miss valor by few points, happens.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Adam_Bomb on September 09, 2012, 04:13:08 pm
This thread needs a bump...

Can't speak for the other ranged classes, but as a dedicated arby user, I am always near the bottom of the point rankings now. Before the new system (which I like in theory), I did much much better.  Most hits I only get 2-3 points for, kill or not.  If I were an archer and could fire off a ton of arrows, this would not be a problem, but as it takes 10 seconds to reload each time, there is NO way to keep up with the other players.  I just had a round where I hit with just about every bolt fired, and was barely in the middle of the rankings... Is this intended??? 2 points for a long range headshot is just stupid and insulting..

Extra points need to be awarded for long range shots and headshots, and maybe points given for arby shots just need to be increased in general.  Please fix this soon!!!

And before anyone argues with me about this, please grab an abry and try it yourself.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Gurnisson on September 09, 2012, 04:32:05 pm
It's hard to get valour with a 15/27 dedicated arbalest player, but with a 15/24 it's quite easy (both level 30 builds). Killing off the archers while being out of the fray in the start an start mopping up with the mace afterwards gives quite a bit of points. 8-)

However, with no ps like with the 15/27 it's way more situational, though I certainly agree, long range shots, especially headshots, should be more rewarded. :wink:
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Adam_Bomb on September 09, 2012, 04:40:57 pm
Quote from: Gurnisson on September 09, 2012, 04:32:05 pm
It's hard to get valour with a 15/27 dedicated arbalest player, but with a 15/24 it's quite easy (both level 30 builds). Killing off the archers while being out of the fray in the start an start mopping up with the mace afterwards gives quite a bit of points. 8-)

However, with no ps like with the 15/27 it's way more situational, though I certainly agree, long range shots, especially headshots, should be more rewarded. :wink:

Not hard, i'd say impossible... So I should have to be a melee xbow hybrid if I want any kind of score, thats bullshit sorry.  I play this game to shoot, I always have, ask anyone in NA.  My K/D ratio is good, WHY as a ranged player do I have to melee for my points now??  I'd like to hear the complaints of two handers if you told them, "yeah as a dedicated melee player, its now very hard to get valor, but all you str build players have to do is pick up a bow and fire off shots if you want any points"  Come on, just fix it, and stop defending this broken system..
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Gurnisson on September 09, 2012, 05:03:07 pm
Impossible? I've done it a couple of times these last few days and I rarely play that characater. Anyway, it's your choice if you want to go absolutely full ranged or a hybrid. You get points the closer you are to the battle and you get points by actually doing hits in melee, and unlike most infantry, you're not getting points for either of those. The only source of points you have as a dedicated sniper are your shots. That you want to stay untouchable, out of reach for most of the enemy team is fine, but it just doesn't produce as much points as some other classes, and I find that fine, you're not exactly as valorous as someone being in the fray, are you now?

I agreed that the points for long range sniping is too low, especially considering you'll rarely get any points for being near the actual combat, but a dedicated sniper shouldn't have the same chance of valour as most infantry, at least in my opinion.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tydeus on September 09, 2012, 06:18:26 pm
For battle, I think the system is fine. Ranged should be focusing cav more than melee, and the point system reflects just that. If as ranged you rarely shoot horses, you're limiting your points by a ton. Horses tend to have a larger affect on the overall battle than a single infantry or ranged character. For siege, where there are far fewer horses and where kills matter much less, the system should probably be changed significantly.

Sadly though, I don't believe that it can be balanced without first changing siege mechanics. Obviously you should get points as a defender for defending the flag and for attackers points for attempting to take the flag, but certain maps don't really allow ranged classes to efficiently do that. You'd have to base the "objective" points on the enemy's proximity to the flag, not your own. Which would mean that if the defenders are putting up a strong defense all round, we're back to where we started, with ranged (specifically crossbowmen) scoring lower. With more objective points, that grants ranged players more chances to get objective points.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Adam_Bomb on September 09, 2012, 07:37:13 pm
I dont play siege so I can't comment on it, but in battle I shoot plenty of horses, still the same 2-3 points.  You don't think its a problem if you can fire off hits all round and still the highest you can get in the scoreboard is the middle?  This mod is just one nerf after another for ranged and it gets old.  There are plenty of archers to speak up and defend their chosen style, not so many arby users (and I think the arbalest should be considered a different playstyle than a regular xbow) so we get the short straw every time and no one cares.  And honestly I don't care about valour, I quit retiring a LONG time ago, xp is meaningless.  Just hate being at the bottom of the scoreboard with as many kills as people near the top.  Had 3 kills after a round today (all long range not easy shots) and had a grand total of 6 points.  It needs to be fixed. How would it hurt the people arguing against it anyway??
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tydeus on September 09, 2012, 08:27:39 pm
Could be that crossbows, or the arbalest specifically, score lower because they land fewer hits per round. It does seem like it's more important to simply land a hit with ranged, than to do a lot of damage. Not really sure how you can balance this though. I certainly don't believe an arbalest user should get more points for doing the same amount of damage in a round that an archer does.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Turboflex on September 12, 2012, 03:51:19 pm
I think there's something wrong with headshots in general? I haven't really tested it but even in melee I seem to get much less points headshotting someone clean in 1-2 hits then taking 4-5 hits to kill some heavily armored str guy with body shots. Anyone else noticed?
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tears of Destiny on September 12, 2012, 10:26:09 pm
There is something wrong with headshots, considering the points is damage divided by 10 for a hit (Or 50 for a horse with a rider), and I know full well when I smack you in the head with an arrow and one shot you, you did not have a mere 20-30 HP and that is all the damage I dealt. I've never seen a HS score more then 3 points, which is pretty silly considering it encourages much higher scoring bodyshots (Despite previous "nerfs" claiming this mod was promoting skill for range thus the HS Damage Buff).
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Cyclopsided on September 12, 2012, 10:57:45 pm
Quote from: Turboflex on September 12, 2012, 03:51:19 pm
I think there's something wrong with headshots in general? I haven't really tested it but even in melee I seem to get much less points headshotting someone clean in 1-2 hits then taking 4-5 hits to kill some heavily armored str guy with body shots. Anyone else noticed?
(click to show/hide)

There's something fucked up regarding damage-point calculations, especially for headshots.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Juhanius on September 19, 2012, 12:23:15 pm
How about change score system to show only damage done per player and remove all other fancy calculations that make no sense. :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Rumblood on September 19, 2012, 05:25:44 pm
Quote from: Juhanius on September 19, 2012, 12:23:15 pm
How about change score system to show only damage done per player and remove all other fancy calculations that make no sense. :rolleyes:

Perhaps in addition to the current points system. That way you can see both raw numbers AND the points reflect the importance of the activity.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Juhanius on September 19, 2012, 08:33:48 pm
Quote from: Rumblood on September 19, 2012, 05:25:44 pm
Perhaps in addition to the current points system. That way you can see both raw numbers AND the points reflect the importance of the activity.

Yep sounds good... earlier comment I made was over simplified.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Phew on September 26, 2012, 06:57:48 pm
Ranged do get screwed on scoreboard. For instance, I have 5 PT, and +3 Heavy Throwing axes. They hit most people for 30+ dmg.

On siege defense (standing on top of a ladder), I can throw an axe, take half a guy's health, and I get 1 point. OR, I can sit AFK on top of the ladder, and let a teammate kill the guy when he gets to the top, and I get 2 points. I get a 1 point penalty for actually contributing to the team...

I throw the axes anyway (because it's fun to chuck lumberjack implements at people), but stupid that I would be rewarded more by doing nothing.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tzar on September 26, 2012, 07:04:51 pm
The problem i think is that if ranged where to be given the same points as melee everyone would go range simply because lets face it its fuckin easy to hit multiple targets as an Archer fx.

I agree that throwing is different but i don't think the devs can make it archery only if they where to change it.

Dunno if its true but i doubt we get any feedback from our dear leaders  :lol:

But yeah it is really annoying for throwers since we have shit ammo an its not a walk in the park to hit anything with our shitty projectile speed and acc...

For the guys with 60 arrows and hes medieval machine sniper gun bow well.... fu  :lol:

As if it inst hard enough all ready to compete with the every day random x key cav hero´s in terms of gettin that sexy time valour....

Also very soon every class will become obsolete when Armpit sweat Teminator dildo molester robot gets approved and released after CMP test drives it.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: justme on September 26, 2012, 08:55:38 pm
just dont shoot from the other side of map and expect high point for that..
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tibe on September 26, 2012, 09:31:20 pm
Tiborur is always ontop of the scoreboards and he never uses anything besides a bow. Ofcourse he never misses an arrow too. I think the meleebuilds just give out more damage per round than archers. I think an archer makes like 6-7 hits per round. While a meleedude can run around and slash everybody whose back is turned in a messy fight  and many players make like 2 hits before getting gangbanged by a group of enemies. Some guys single slash is stronger than an arrow. Still I can see it being a problem thou.

And yes, headshots and cavalrycouches give out  little points.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tzar on September 26, 2012, 10:16:09 pm
Quote from: TiberiusX on September 26, 2012, 09:31:20 pm
And yes, headshots and cavalrycouches give out  little points.

Headshots takes atleast some skill while Couches... well you know............................................

Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Adam_Bomb on September 26, 2012, 11:08:47 pm
Quote from: justme on September 26, 2012, 08:55:38 pm
just dont shoot from the other side of map and expect high point for that..

Lets see you reload an arbalest in the middle of a melee and see how many shots you get off before dying...

The problem is much worse for arbalest users than for archers I might add
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Boss_Awesome on October 09, 2012, 08:24:24 pm
The scoring system is a joke.  Proximity needs to be removed.  Why should some guy get points for just being close to someone who is doing well?  Often I see people with zero kills at the top of the scoreboard.  Doing damage is extremely overrated.  Putting a target down so that he can't fight back is much more valuable to a team.  Head shot points are currently a joke by the man to keep the archer down.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Teeth on October 09, 2012, 08:39:34 pm
Quote from: Boss_Awesome on October 09, 2012, 08:24:24 pm
Doing damage is extremely overrated.  Putting a target down so that he can't fight back is much more valuable to a team.
Imagine two people fighting one guy. They are both trying to kill him. The first guy manages to hit him 3 times, the other guy gets the last hit. Should he be rewarded more, just because his hit happened to be the last hit? Same intention, does way less damage, but gets lucky and gets the last hit. Bra-fucking-vo!

Dealing damage is something you should be rewarded for, cause it is something you control. Whether it is the last hit or the hit before the last hit is not something you control, so you should not be rewarded for it. People are killhungry enough anyway, and the e-peen on the scoreboard is enough reason to kill for everyone apparently.

Quote from: Boss_Awesome on October 09, 2012, 08:24:24 pm
The scoring system is a joke.  Proximity needs to be removed.  Why should some guy get points for just being close to someone who is doing well?
Oh I don't know, maybe because the downblock you've been holding is the only reason why your teammate manages to kill him with a sideswing. Presence close to an enemy is a huge distraction to him and a huge part of teamfighting is helping your teammate getting the hit. Damn shame if I should stop effectively teamplaying because only kills get rewarded.

Quote from: Boss_Awesome on October 09, 2012, 08:24:24 pm
Often I see people with zero kills at the top of the scoreboard.
So? If anything kills are overrated. The new system is a lot better at showing who is actually valuable to the team compared to the kills list. It's just ranged that get very little points.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Arrowblood on October 09, 2012, 08:48:17 pm
im ok with the score system, but if i shoot someone with my herobow over 300m i want more points. 8-)
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Arrowblood on October 13, 2012, 03:01:20 pm
eu1 today :D:
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on October 13, 2012, 03:16:34 pm
k, remove kiting.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Arrowblood on October 13, 2012, 03:22:57 pm
Or 0 points for shots under 15-20 m.
And that was no kiting, that was the beginning of the round when we all charge into the village.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: karasu on October 13, 2012, 03:32:40 pm
   The score system is just a silly way to make ranged people rage and respecc to melee chars. It's just another way to "balance".

   I'm an arbalest/1h hybrid that spends most of his time meleeing like a berserking maniac and even like this only sometimes I have enough "score" to raise up, and get some random valour.

     I mean, how can you explain that a guy with negative kills has more score than a guy with more than 10 kills? It's pretty pathetic.

(click to show/hide)

     Another example of retarded scoring:

(click to show/hide)


From time to time I can get plus 200 score (siege-wise) from meleeing like a bitch, and might even get a lucky valour. But I can imagine the pure archer players pain these days.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Mlekce on October 13, 2012, 03:51:37 pm
Kapikulu robinhood always top score,so you guys just sucks so bad at archery. Not fault of valur system.
You also play like cunts shooting ppl from far away,and then running away,you don't deserve valour.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Arrowblood on October 13, 2012, 03:59:14 pm
Quote from: Mlekce on October 13, 2012, 03:51:37 pm
Kapikulu robinhood always top score,so you guys just sucks so bad at archery. Not fault of valur system.
You also play like cunts shooting ppl from far away,and then running away,you don't deserve valour.

You Sir,

Do you really think its hard to top the score if you play with a mw Rusbow 8 athletics 9 weaponmaster and ultralight armor and you kite the fuck ou of your enemies AND your bodyguard arbalester is always arround you??? And now tell me we are the cunts and run away. You just fucked my day with your absolute fucking answer.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on October 13, 2012, 04:18:44 pm
Quote from: Deutschritter on October 13, 2012, 03:59:14 pm
You Sir,

Do you really think its hard to top the score if you play with a mw Rusbow 8 athletics 9 weaponmaster and ultralight armor and you kite the fuck ou of your enemies AND your bodyguard arbalester is always arround you??? And no tell me we are the cunts and run away. You just fucked my day with your absolute fucking answer.
Robinhood is just as much of a kiting my old friend as you, happy?
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Arrowblood on October 13, 2012, 04:19:20 pm
Quote from: Zlisch_The_Butcher on October 13, 2012, 04:18:44 pm
Robinhood is just as much of a kiting my old friend as you, happy?
yes a bit more happy.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on October 13, 2012, 04:27:45 pm
Quote from: Deutschritter on October 13, 2012, 04:19:20 pm
yes a bit more happy.
Then 1+ me please.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Arrowblood on October 13, 2012, 04:30:48 pm
u got twice +1 so +1 me once pls.

edit: tzar is evil.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on October 13, 2012, 04:44:50 pm
Tzar stop interrupting our peaceful renown circlejerk.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Tzar on October 13, 2012, 04:48:59 pm
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Lannistark on October 13, 2012, 04:56:51 pm
Well, score also rewards damage inflicted. When you are a balanced build, or have less powerful weapons such as 1h, you receive a lower score than you actually should. Tweak that as well.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Kafein on October 16, 2012, 12:57:35 am
Score rewards the time you spend alive near enemies getting damaged and killed more than anything else.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Adamar on October 16, 2012, 12:32:17 pm
Quote from: Kafein on October 16, 2012, 12:57:35 am
Score rewards the time you spend alive near allies, supporting each other, rather than getting damaged and killed and overall ramboing, more than anything else.

fixed
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Lannistark on October 16, 2012, 05:25:58 pm
Quote from: Kafein on October 16, 2012, 12:57:35 am
Score rewards the time you spend alive near enemies getting damaged and killed more than anything else.

Well sometimes I've died in siege, and the score kept increasing for me. Your corpse is included too?
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Piok on October 18, 2012, 07:18:00 pm
I was relatively high in scoreboard with throwing dagger joke build. Rarely I lived longer then 2 min not to mention k/d ratio which was teribad. But still I was in upper half of scoreboard thanks to bombarding of cavs and never reached lev 30 coz I ragerespec.
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: Osiris on October 18, 2012, 08:26:22 pm
ranged get less score for being in less danger :P
Title: Re: Ranged are overlooked when calculating scores!
Post by: IG_Saint on October 18, 2012, 08:41:07 pm
Quote from: Osiris on October 18, 2012, 08:26:22 pm
ranged get less score for being in less danger :P

This. If you're a sniper you get less points, if you stand near the melee interupting all the 2h heroes with your unblockable attacks you get lot's of points. People need to stop blaiming the system when it's really just their playstyle.

That said, more points for headshots and difficult shots (maybe using the native ranged difficulty system) wouldn't be a bad thing.