Author Topic: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you  (Read 7136 times)

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Offline Jona

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #30 on: November 16, 2017, 05:49:58 pm »
-3
Jona, some constructive feedback would help way more than all this subjective arguing and finger-pointing, it's already impressive that we even got people who still invest a lot of time in trying to fix this ancient mod. What do you think would be best for the mod to do?

The first step is to manage to convince the 'infallible' devs that they've actually made a mistake, or at least taken a suboptimal approach to something they've perceived as a problem. This requires constant berating to pound it through their thick skulls. Once that step is accomplished and they say something along the lines of "oh, i begrudgingly admit that your argument holds some merit, what would you recommend we do to remedy the situation?" then I'll gladly start brainstorming ideas with them. Unfortunately, each iteration of the crpg dev team fails to own up to their mistakes and only after the entire community (or at least the vocal minority) turns against them is there any hope of change.

(click to show/hide)

Finally, someone else who didn't waste their time grinding endlessly for looms and can sympathize to some extent. After I made a complete set I stopped retiring and would eventually gather enough gold to purchase a few extra looms on my way to higher levels. As I previously posted, I could have retired at least 55 more times and still be in the same boat I am with this current leveling system. I've got nothing to show for the ceaseless grinding I did beyond what is currently the cutoff for level 33. Sure our xp wasn't "wiped" out, but our levels were. And there's simply no point in having any xp over level 33 with the new system, so why should we care that our "xp wasn't wiped?" I couldn't care less if I had 1 million or 1 trillion xp, as that is nothing more than a means to an end. All I care about is maintaining my level, which didn't happen.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 06:11:30 pm by Jona »
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Offline RD_Professor

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #31 on: November 16, 2017, 06:36:25 pm »
+5
The first step is to manage to convince the 'infallible' devs that they've actually made a mistake, or at least taken a suboptimal approach to something they've perceived as a problem. This requires constant berating to pound it through their thick skulls.
Oh my fucking god. That is all I can say. If you took ONE minute out of your day of bitching on the forums to join the discord, or even just shoot me a message on steam, you'd have found that I'm normally very receptive to input. But no. You had to bitch and bitch, and guess what? That's doing more to kill the mod than anything else, because that sort of shit ruins the incentive for us to actually keep working on the mod.

Don't you worry, I'm a stubborn shit, so I'm not done working on this game yet. But just know that your behavior is fucking awful.

Couple of points to be made here.

The new level system has a few flaws.

1) Skip the fun (level 31) *zero grind* has at most 2 attribute and skill points less than a person that spent years and years grinding XP. It make's us oldies a bit sore when we look at this way (4 years of grinding XP) vs (1 click of a button) benefits? - 2 attribute points and skill points over the (click of the button). So, all in all, we could have all been retiring for 4 years accumulating more and more looms and that would have been more logical *if this XP system remains unchanged*

2) the soft cap is a bit too extreme if you create a line-graph that compares the 3 sets of xp systems you'll see that the new one escalates very rapidly in an unrealistic manner that makes it leveling past level 31 basically out of the question. There are no real benefits from this course of action anymore and everyone is better off retiring/ skipping the fun.

3) I too feel the soreness of Ashram's/Jona's argument as I am in the same boat. *not that we can't adapt or alter our builds of choice*
Years and years ago probably 2013 I made the choice that retirement was no longer relevant to my character and the only way to continue with a sense of progression was to go beyond level 31 (retirement level) So I did just that. At the time the Patch of destiny came out I was level 35 and shot up to level 37 nearing level 38 (nearing as in like half way there lol) Now I was never a fan of having all of those extra skill points and always viewed it as a mod breaking thing having SO many extra points to play around with. So I definitely see what you are trying to do with this new XP system and I am not opposed to reducing the total amount of points a build can utilize.

That is a good goal to have; though with that said the majority of us are not new. The majority of us have made specific decisions regarding our characters many years ago and this system is effectively punishing those choices we made many many years ago I could understand why that would make the oldest of us a bit frustrated.

(click to show/hide)

Look at this instead. This is an example of constructive criticism, with ideas. In fact, I'll probably implement something like this.

So in general, Jona, you'll find people are more open to suggestions when you aren't behaving like a cunt. Try to get that through your thick skull.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 06:41:18 pm by RD_Professor »
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Offline Jona

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #32 on: November 16, 2017, 07:43:49 pm »
-2
(click to show/hide)

Oh my fucking god. That is all I can say. Same old excuses. You realize people work, right? And that typically hopping on discord or steam while at work would be a big no-no for most companies, while a forum would be much more acceptable. There is no reason civilized discussion can't take place on this forum, apart from the fact that you'd need both parties to remain civil. Reread the OP of this thread, in short, all I said was "this partial wipe isn't what the poll was for, what gives? If you were aiming at a partial wipe, HERE'S MY INPUT ON WHAT IMO COULD BE A BETTER METHOD OMG YES I ACTUALLY GAVE SOME ADVICE IN HERE SINCE THE FIRST POST WOW READING IS SO HARD." At which point in typical crpg dev fashion you had to get overly defensive and instead of providing any answers to the proposed questions you dodged them altogether almost as expertly as a seasoned politician while passing off all my posts as baseless hate, trolling, shit talking, mod-killing, not-advice-giving, etc.
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Offline Asheram

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #33 on: November 16, 2017, 08:40:23 pm »
+4
They should change the name of new crpg to OKaM 2.
Edit- oh and by the way you guys moved Jonas thread to the bitching chamber of tears section and now you are bitching about him bitching in the bitching sub forum? Isn't that what this part of forums is for?
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 09:30:13 pm by Asheram »
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Offline Jona

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #34 on: November 16, 2017, 11:25:52 pm »
+1
oh and by the way you guys moved Jonas thread to the bitching chamber of tears section and now you are bitching about him bitching in the bitching sub forum? Isn't that what this part of forums is for?

Aaaayyy, at least someone gets it.
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Offline Dupre

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #35 on: November 17, 2017, 01:06:59 am »
-1
I moved it. Jona's crying and complaining is toxic, useless and a waste of time to read. If you have no time to test current or future changes, don't reply or create a thread to complain on main forums.  We don't want your feedback if you aren't playing. I'm just going to delete your thread next time. Now go to work before I call your manager.
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Offline Jona

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #36 on: November 17, 2017, 01:15:58 am »
0
Oh snap I'm getting threats now? Neato. And as I said before, one needn't play crpg to know what level 33 feels like if they have played this game at all in the past. Unless you've mysteriously changed all the mechanics behind the scenes without telling anyone, there's nothing new to see here.

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« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 01:56:23 am by Dupre »
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Offline Dupre

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #37 on: November 17, 2017, 01:30:50 am »
0
Well maybe you should take a hint Jona. If you dont want to hear the same response maybe you should think of a new way to give us feedback. There might just be a good way of doing that if you take 1 second to read nightingle's post.
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Offline Asheram

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #38 on: November 17, 2017, 02:52:08 am »
0
I moved it. Jona's crying and complaining is toxic, useless and a waste of time to read. If you have no time to test current or future changes, don't reply or create a thread to complain on main forums.  We don't want your feedback if you aren't playing. I'm just going to delete your thread next time. Now go to work before I call your manager.
My comment wasnt about you moving it it was about Rd bitching about Jona bitching in the thread after it was in the bitching section. Apparently dont shed tears in the chamber of tears section either. I dont really care for this change either but for different reasons than Jona as I never tried to go past lvl 33 in pre pod, if I hadn't retired 3x at lvl 33 and started wasting time on alts I might have gotten there then.
 What time is needed to test something you played for years before pod? With obviously even more level restraints? If all you wanted to do was " create an environment where there are not players that have high level advantages you could have left it the way it was and hobbled the going high levels past retirement. I would rather play a level 35 stf character with no looms, or even a level 34 before retirement character with no looms than what you just did.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 02:59:55 am by Asheram »
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Offline RD_Professor

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #39 on: November 17, 2017, 05:24:19 am »
0
Oh snap I'm getting threats now? Neato. And as I said before, one needn't play crpg to know what level 33 feels like if they have played this game at all in the past. Unless you've mysteriously changed all the mechanics behind the scenes without telling anyone, there's nothing new to see here.

(click to show/hide)
Just for your information, if you are able to stop being unpleasant and PM me with the intent of civilly discussing the issue, I'll gladly discuss it as well. Otherwise, I won't feel compelled in the slightest to treat you with respect.

What time is needed to test something you played for years before pod? With obviously even more level restraints? If all you wanted to do was " create an environment where there are not players that have high level advantages you could have left it the way it was and hobbled the going high levels past retirement. I would rather play a level 35 stf character with no looms, or even a level 34 before retirement character with no looms than what you just did.
When I was talking about the time needed to test, that was about how the build felt in regards to other players. Obviously yes one can know what a build feels like after playing for a large amount of time, but given that everyone's levels changed, you can't know how the build compares to others until you try it out.


As a reminder.
Basically, all this shit is a work in progress. The post-31 xp for levels can change, item difficulties can change, etc.
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Offline Tristan_of_Erzoth

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #40 on: November 17, 2017, 06:06:58 am »
+1
When the fuck was Professor a developer in 2015
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Offline Asheram

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #41 on: November 17, 2017, 06:09:37 am »
0
You took away the two main things that made me want to play this mod:
1. Asheram was my highest level and you doubled the xp he needed to get to his next level
2. Gunanrun is what I found fun and you basically eliminated his build
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Offline Nightingale

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #42 on: November 17, 2017, 06:36:51 am »
0
You took away the two main things that made me want to play this mod:
1. Asheram was my highest level and you doubled the xp he needed to get to his next level
2. Gunanrun is what I found fun and you basically eliminated his build

what was Gunanrun's build exactly?

Offline RD_Professor

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #43 on: November 17, 2017, 07:02:25 am »
+3
You took away the two main things that made me want to play this mod:
1. Asheram was my highest level and you doubled the xp he needed to get to his next level
2. Gunanrun is what I found fun and you basically eliminated his build

Another reminder:

Basically, all this shit is a work in progress. The post-31 xp for levels can change, item difficulties can change, etc.
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Offline Oberyn

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Re: Can we get a real leveling system revert? Please and thank you
« Reply #44 on: November 17, 2017, 01:40:26 pm »
+1
toxic

Lol cRPG confirmed for dead. cRPG'ers are dead. cRPG'ers don't have to be your audience anymore.

Although I can understand the frustration on dev parts too. The level revert thing had been announced and discussed on forums, if you had shit against it maybe you should've mentioned something then. I don't even play anymore and understood that to mean "high levels builds will no longer be viable" as an automatic part of it, which some other people apparently didn't understand.

Looks like current devs are finding out just how entitled and whiny the cRPG playerbase is and always has been. No matter what you do someone is going to go "REEEE YOU RUINED THE GAME FOREVER" (Which is why a wipe is the only answer and you should not listen to any whining about MUH LOOMs and MUH LEVELS, ever).
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 01:45:08 pm by Oberyn »
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