anyone else hates archery?

[Keshian]

Kesh, you're not an archer anymore? This is a sad day

One of my alts is ana rcher, but I play it for what its worth.  A joke class now where you annoy melee fighters so your allies can kill them.  I made my main into 1H/polearm/shiedler/cav and my other main alt into 2h/thrower.

Two points:
1) Javelins are highly effective and 3 stacks is plenty especially on servers with fewer people.  Unlike archery you dont need to put every available wpf into archery to stand any chance at being effective so easy to have 100 in throwing and 80 in 2h (more as i level up from 20)  Similar build going for 24 str, 12 agi (2 converted points, 5 IF, 7 PS, 8 PT, 4 ATH, 4 WPMSTR).  Unlike archery no real nerf for heavy armor so get a lot more health, armor, do more damage... basically just overall easier then archery now.

2) Will do my second heirloom of the khergit bow on my archer alt when retirement comes back, maybe even a third and another one for the second one for bodkin arrows (+2 damage), but archery will remain a clown class until chadz makes changes (but all his fellow programmers are tin cans anti-archers, so not likely).  Hell, the only people that benefitted from switching from piercing to cutting is tincans... not noobs, not peasants, not agility builds, not shielders... tincans.  Do we really need to buff tincans?  Were they some kind of endangered class?  Like the elephant and rhino riders?

[Kophka]

Its not true that you cant be thrower only, I am thrower only, 27 strenght, 9 powerthrow, 3 stacks of throwing lances (thats 6 lances) and shield, 127 throwing wpf. I always have more kills then deaths, most of the times i survive battles till end. But still even with throwing lances there are people who survive on shot so i need to shot them again, i tried other throwing weapons, but none is like lance. And its ton of fun. I've been polearmer and archer and i can say beeing thrower is more fun, and i get better scores as thrower.

Yes, but lances aren't the only weapon in the throwing roster. And after you throw your 6 lances, what do you do? Lances are the lolaxe / spamberge of the throwing world, yes they are effective, but like the lolaxe, lolpolehammer (old BoaS) and spamberge, they are a novelty weapon. But unlike the lolaxe/lolpole/spamberge, lances can be negated by the simple act of moving.

[Trout4711]

Just go throwing put 100+ wpf in it and 6 or more powerthrow, almost like archery except a little bit less range, faster shooting, and insta-kill with 34 pierce just for javelins, not even talking about jarids and throwing lances.

shhhh

Don't let anyone hear, or throwers will be nerfed into oblivion too.

[Duster]

bla bla said the melee guy without being asked  anything
I am asking other players who used to play this class if they are having real issues or they can continue playing this class

Im pretty sure he was serious but anyways yeah archery is definetely less fun, you barely hurt people and shoot slow as molasses. I just rolled a horse archer however, and even though I am pretty bad its still fun.

[Emgee]

I think the best archery change that could be made right now is to remove the accuracy penalty from power draw.  WPF has been stiffly softcapped and with the damage and speed nerfs, archers don't need a double penalty on accuracy.  Plus it makes power draw stop working differently than the other Power * skills.

According to my calculations, you need about 175 archery WPF to offset the PD6 you need to use a warbow.  You just can't get that much WPF until level 28ish and that's with a 100% focused 18str max agi all points only in WM+PD build.  I can't think of another item in the game that you are simply unable to use until that late...can you?

[Trout4711]

Im pretty sure he was serious but anyways yeah archery is definetely less fun, you barely hurt people and shoot slow as molasses. I just rolled a horse archer however, and even though I am pretty bad its still fun.

The "slow" shooting does not really trouble me. That just increases the amount of player skill needed (you can make your arrows count) which is a good thing.

I don't understand why both the accuracy and damage nerf was needed. The WPF nerf makes kinda sense to me because headshot snipers are fucking annoying. However: how many of those super-accurate (aka x-th generation) archers did *really* exist before the patch, and why wasn't it enough to remove their retirement WPF-boni?

The damage nerf is a joke. I don't even bother shooting horses any more, and archers were always an important part of anti-cav defense. Well now everyone has to have a pike and watch out for horses themselves - because I cant really help them any longer. Same goes for tincans. After the cut damage, tin-cans have not all that much left that they need to fear - I won't bother shooting them.

Perhaps chadz could enlighten us: would you tell us the resoning behind 3 nerfs at once and why they were necessary?

[gazda]

Yes, but lances aren't the only weapon in the throwing roster. And after you throw your 6 lances, what do you do? Lances are the lolaxe / spamberge of the throwing world, yes they are effective, but like the lolaxe, lolpolehammer (old BoaS) and spamberge, they are a novelty weapon. But unlike the lolaxe/lolpole/spamberge, lances can be negated by the simple act of moving.

well i tried out jarids, javelins, throwing spears, axes..., well almost every throwing weapon but throwing lances are awsome.
'bout running out of ammo there is one gold rule

When you miss, go there, pick it up and make the second one hit(very important, if not followed you are as good as dead)

and if you somehow end with no weapons just pick up some from battlefield, i survived many times thanks to this, i just pick up some weapon lol

And only throwing weapon worth buying except lances are throwing axes, they are accurate and deal descent dammage

[Thomek]

Archers seriously gotta stop their rage.

It still takes only 2 TWO hits from a lvl 28-30 archer to knock me out. In stead of 1, which was the case with the very top tier archers pre-patch.

 

Just because you are no sniper-gods anymore you cry. Well I'm no Ninja-god with 10 athletics anymore either, and I accept that. Everyone got a nerf.

[Nick_Larking]

Archers seriously gotta stop their rage.

It still takes only 2 TWO hits from a lvl 28-30 archer to knock me out. In stead of 1, which was the case with the very top tier archers pre-patch.

 

Just because you are no sniper-gods anymore you cry. Well I'm no Ninja-god with 10 athletics anymore either, and I accept that. Everyone got a nerf.

You mean 2headshots, cause in the chest it will take 5hits (unless you wear robes). Even on a naked it will take 2hits minimum before he drops.

[Trout4711]

Archers seriously gotta stop their rage.

It still takes only 2 TWO hits from a lvl 28-30 archer to knock me out. In stead of 1, which was the case with the very top tier archers pre-patch.

 

Just because you are no sniper-gods anymore you cry. Well I'm no Ninja-god with 10 athletics anymore either, and I accept that. Everyone got a nerf.

Are you a tincan? Are you a horse? Prolly not, right?

[Thomek]

Then check your build and level.

We'll I'm more or less the same as pre-patch. Same armor, no IF, but less HP because 11 less levels.

I swear i'm getting two shotted by some archers now. (And I know they are probably between 28-30 as there should be extremely few lvl 31 guys so soon.

I'm no tin-can or horse of course, but as a damage-meter I testify that archers have a reasonable amount of damage now. There are far fewer tin-cans around as well. You have to choose your battles, and most archers can run away from tin cans. Problem happens when they suffer from tunnelvision and become static targets. Archers should have to play smart like everyone else, and pay for their ranged ability.

[Leiknir]

You forget one main point:
As thrower you have to pay upkeep for equipment worth 30k, just for 16 shots. Archer pays what? 10k for his weapons at most. So, throwers have to be 3times as effective as archers. Nerf archers more.

[Poetrydog]

Let me tell you the meaning of "I hate archers!!!"  :

  "I tried to play as archer in the past and I sucked"

Or it could mean: I hate archers because they really are annoying?
You don't think that us other melee guys think archers are annoying because we haven't tried being one? I mean 

You mean 2headshots, cause in the chest it will take 5hits (unless you wear robes). Even on a naked it will take 2hits minimum before he drops.

Don't lie to get your point through. You just loose credibility doing that. I've been in light leather and been 1-shotted with 2 IF (to give you all the info)

It's true that archers have indeed been nerfed. Maybe also overnerfed. I wouldn't know as I don't play them. I wouldn't mind them getting a little buff but certainly not back to before the patch.

[buy_dsr]

Archers seriously gotta stop their rage.

 In stead of 1, which was the case with the very top tier archers pre-patch.
 
Just because you are no sniper-gods anymore you cry. Well I'm no Ninja-god with 10 athletics anymore either, and I accept that. Everyone got a nerf.

it was your choice to circle the enemy group in fancy black clothes; if some archer happened to see you it was the natural outcome - you being oneshoted that is - don't you agree?

[Formless]

You forget one main point:
As thrower you have to pay upkeep for equipment worth 30k, just for 16 shots. Archer pays what? 10k for his weapons at most. So, throwers have to be 3times as effective as archers. Nerf archers more.

Lol, can archer's be nerfed any more?   

What else can you do to them, make them shoot blind, bent over backwards, using bows bought at Walmart, on 75% off sale with cat whiskers for bow strings?

Seriously, in order to know how effective archery is instead of relying on guesses and conjecture we should ask one of the server admins to post the stats for kills and deaths for archery and compare it to the stats before the patch.  Gorath posted stats from one of the NA servers once, we should ask him to do it again.  If the deaths caused by archery have fallen by a severe precentage then you know archery has been nerfed too much.  If the deaths caused by archery have fallen by just a bit then you know archery is still okay.  Let's see some evidence before we start crying for archery or against it.