Nerf ranged

[Leshma]

Way too many ranged everywhere (Siege, DTV, Strategus, Battle). Please nerf

Suggestions: Big xbows back to 3 slot (heavy xbow, arbalest). Upkeep increase for archers obviously doesn't work (since selling heirloom points became possible upkeep has no meaning). Find some other way to nerf them. But this time don't nerf their melee ability because most of them can't or simply don't use melee weapons. I'll be happy with removal of projectile stun but situation is in pretty bad shape atm, ranged nerf should be hardcore to put things into shape once again.

Edit: I'm aware that I don't wear armor and shouldn't complain. I'm actually complaining because they take 80% of my HP in one shot while wearing heaviest possible armor in Strategus and there's ton of them in Strat.

[DaveUKR]

Nice thread, xbows back (?) to 3 slots - were they ever using 3 slots? And nerf ranged I don't know how.

Very useful and important suggestions coming from Leshma. If you want to take any reasonable changes = you're welcome.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WdO5aOiP-LFb2pxWf9n-GVhXHETQuxzRncmeGWX1pWc/edit

[Teeth]

Crossbows do need a nerf, I wouldn't say their ranged capability is that much below archers, while they have much better armour and melee capability. An 8 athlethics build with a 1h stab sword and 70 wpf is a great build considering crossbowers usually stay away from the main fight and often fight 1 opponent at a time, otherwise they can just run. The high ranged and high melee capability while being the best class to take out the heavy hitters on the opposing team makes it a much too win-win class.

Individual ranged or melee capabilities are fine, it is just the combination of the two in one sweet melange of asskickery.

[Rebelyell]

Bodkin Arrows
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Thrust:2 pierce

Pierce dmg is only problem with archers in my opinion

[rufio]

didnt read just +1 for title

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

Pierce ranged (and to a slightly lesser extent regular ranged) seems way more effective than pierce melee in ignoring armor, really, whether I'm wearing cloth or plate a boltfromthesamecrossbow/arrow/throwingweaponthatispierce will usually take more or less the same amount of my hp. Facehug shooting is by far the biggest issue with ranged though.

[Leshma]

Nice thread, xbows back (?) to 3 slots - were they ever using 3 slots?

I believe Arbalest was 3 slot at one point. Considering the fact there's quite a few excellent 0 slot items, I see no problem there. MW Italian Falchion combined with high AGI build (8 or 9 ATH) is enough to kill anyone.

Change will be more psychological in nature and will lead to less xbowers. Every nerf, no matter how small leads to change of builds. Because of combination of higher average melee skill of cRPG community, wpf buff for high WM pure builds and free respec way too many players repecced to ranged class (high level ranged class). Nerf will force them to respec again, lose a level or even retire. Ranged is fine at level 30 but at higher levels (lvl 35/36) it becomes too powerful.

But biggest problem is number of ranged players, this game completely lose fun factor if there's more than 50% of ranged on server. Even archers hate to shoot other archers.

[Erzengel]

Make shields useful again versus ranged (and make them easier available). The "forcefield" ist just a bad joke at the moment. Would solve a lot of problems.

[Herkkutatti666]

didnt read just +1 for title

[Penitent]

Ugh, not the nerf-ranged bandwagon again. 

My main is a shielder.  I have a 2h alt and archer alt.  I think ranged is fine.

Just because they are numerous is no reason to nerf them.

Bodkin damage vs tartar arrow damage is hardly different.  Use the ranged damage calculator.  2 pierce vs 8 cut means that bodkins on average do about 1 or 2 points more damage vs someone with 55 armor.  But they have less ammo so its balanced.

[kinngrimm]

...
But biggest problem is number of ranged players, this game completely lose fun factor if there's more than 50% of ranged on server. Even archers hate to shoot other archers.

this, but i would concider >20-30% ranged = no fun

[tizzango]

I've always thought it was silly to 'nerf ranged into da ground' to make it an undesirable class. It makes playing melee so much more interesting and thought provoking, I think anyway.

I also think that too much ranged ruins CERTAIN maps. It is a circle, if you will, but the answer is definitely not to nerf them into being not fun. I'm not sure how viable it is (technically- within the game limitations) to make an archer melee efficient, whilst being ranged efficient.

The answer for me, if it is possible, is to limit the amount of arrows per stack and also allow ranged players to have a somewhat effective melee build without being level 34.

[Grumbs]

Ranged should be good at ranged, melee good at melee, not these ranged melee hybrids that pretty much every ranged guy is as long as he can manual block.

Xbows are worst in this instance, heavy armour, 1 hit killing, great in melee. Archers can be just as bad but at least they dedicate some points into PD and seem to need to wear less armour

[Tzar]

Just rework their ammo.
Less ammo, less flying shit in the air 24/7

That´s right, my suggestion would solve the range fest problem.

/End Thread

PS:

(click to show/hide)

Also xbow hybrids are a joke, dunno why it still haven't been added some PD skill for em to be used.

[Leshma]

I've always thought it was silly to 'nerf ranged into da ground' to make it an undesirable class. It makes playing melee so much more interesting and thought provoking, I think anyway.

No it does not. Maybe if there're few archers on the whole map shooting different targets but when there are so many archers that only you get aimed by at least 4 when fighting melee enemy, that's not fun at all.

I've exiled to siege to enjoy melee and don't get mad because I'm constantly shot by ranged. But today there were so many archers on siege that even me, who can handle ranged fest, had to GTX.

Bring a shield argument is bullshit because shield doesn't help much and if I wanted to play a shielder, I would make one. Playing a shielder is completely different from being shieldless infantry, don't force us to be shielders just because this game attracts so many Counter Strike players.

Edit: I would like to quote certain NA archer who was playing siege with us on EU2 one day. He said that if NA guys knew how bad ranged fest are EU servers, they wouldn't complain. So, it's obviously not the same for both communities and because of that I kinda feel bad for asking to nerf ranged. But there is no other choice. Maybe limiting ranged per server, but not sure is that doable at this point.