WPP Sum and Cost Formula Rework(Includes WM)

[oprah_winfrey]

Can you respec my looms while you're at it?

[StonedSteel]

lol 45 wpf ...so far....aint all that bad

fuck diamonds, a str whore is forever

[Malaclypse]

lol 45 wpf ...so far....aint all that bad

fuck diamonds, a str whore is forever

Yeah, I didn't think it would really be that bad. Proficiency definitely helps, but playing 2h/pole/1h without prof never seemed much different to me when I played a 33+ STR build.

[Templar_Steevee]

Ranged got an indirect accuracy buff, time to nerf all missile speeds by 10 and finally introduce skill on both sides of the arrow

Remember that timing and predicting where enemy will be is also a skill.

Why you want to reduce missile speed, fot top tier bows like rus and long bow arrows are already slow. Tiny bows have higher missile speed...

Standard lvl 30 archers with 6 pd almost don't have any byff from wpf change (few points only). Only high lvl one got bigger buff (I gained 15 WPF in archery).
But comapying my buff from wpf to buff wich melee have is nothing. Now melee with same wpf i have from all melee proficiencies in total 350 wpf like Corsair831 (hybrid).
Dedicated melee having same amount of wpf in his class have additional 33 wpf in 2 other classes...

You can say that hi lvl archers are OP now,  but we were op before path (I mean Bagge, Robin, Schokoshugi or me). Now you start complain about amount of HA on EU1

[kinngrimm]

Remember that timing and predicting where enemy will be is also a skill.

Why you want to reduce missile speed, ....

a thought, so that it is more player skill based and less gear based?
Imagine, archers need to anticipate more ... perhaps they then would even learn not to shoot their own guys in melee ... mmmk not going to happen ... still.

EDIT: also there had always been some exceptional 'ranged' as with every class there had been exceptional players. I would but try not to judge ranged by them but by the avarrage experience ... which is i get more headshots nowadays then 9 months back, and 9 motnhs back i got more headshots then before one of these ranged balancing patches ...
and since i started playing cRPG my subjectiv feeling is that the overall amount of 'ranged' has grown, that the effect of high lvl ranged is not taken into consideration as well as high lvl melee players. That the skill increase of players with ranged has a bigger proportional effect then in comparison of melee or even cav.

[Teeth]

Remember that timing and predicting where enemy will be is also a skill.

Why you want to reduce missile speed, fot top tier bows like rus and long bow arrows are already slow. Tiny bows have higher missile speed...

Exactly because timing and predicting where your target will be is a skill. Reducing missile speed means archers will have to lead targets more, predict their movement, thus making the effectiveness gap between skilled and bad archers bigger. Also makes proper dodging more effective, as it often is not, even though I know how to dodge properly.

[Kafein]

Exactly because timing and predicting where your target will be is a skill. Reducing missile speed means archers will have to lead targets more, predict their movement, thus making the effectiveness gap between skilled and bad archers bigger. Also makes proper dodging more effective, as it often is not, even though I know how to dodge properly.

My thoughts exactly. The point of going towards lower missile speeds and higher accuracy is to remove the randomness of cone of fire mechanics with better accuracy, thus favoring skilled archers; and making target leading harder thus favoring skilled archer and people that can dodge. Right now dodging is very unrewarding, any decent archer will not let anybody he is aware of closer than 5 meters, and most of them can hit you anyway at 50 meters too even if you move like a cockroach.

[Templar_Steevee]

IMO missile speed on 6 PD bows is ok, and there is no reason to reduce or improove it. I can't tell anything about bows like tatar or nomad, because i'm not using them, same with x-bows

[Mendro]

Exactly because timing and predicting where your target will be is a skill. Reducing missile speed means archers will have to lead targets more, predict their movement, thus making the effectiveness gap between skilled and bad archers bigger

Sounds like throwing 

[Prpavi]

love it when kinngrimm talks about balance and using skills over gear etc. makes my day 

[kinngrimm]

love it when kinngrimm talks about balance and using skills over gear etc. makes my day 

You may or may not remember the guide i wrote/compiled "worth of a player", perhaps it is not all about skill but about who has not his head in his ars 

EDIT: wonder if something in that guide still is of use

[XyNox]

So choosing a low damage / high missile speed ranged weapon is bad because it gets easier to hit enemies, which however comes at ( wait for it ) the cost of damage ? Hence, lowering the missile speed would be a good thing because it would make ranged more skill based ?

By that logic, cant we just lower the speed rating of all 2h weapons by 20 so 2h gameplay would become A LOOOT more skillbased instead of just spam spam spam ? 

[Rebelyell]

So choosing a low damage / high missile speed ranged weapon is bad because it gets easier to hit enemies, which however comes at ( wait for it ) the cost of damage ? Hence, lowering the missile speed would be a good thing because it would make ranged more skill based ?

By that logic, cant we just lower the speed rating of all 2h weapons by 20 so 2h gameplay would become A LOOOT more skillbased instead of just spam spam spam ? 

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[_Sargon_]

wonder if something in that guide still is of use

all of it =)

P.S.: it would be nice if you add some guidelines for the sielders.

[juv95hrn]

Was the insane ranged spam part of the patch-plan?
Werent you going to reduce the effect of wpf on ranged weapons?

Did you ever try to shoot a long range shot in cRPG or ever played range? Just wondering since most whining about range doesn't seem to ever have tried it themselves.