WPP Sum and Cost Formula Rework(Includes WM)

[NJ_Legion_Icedtea]

Am I the only one who thinks that I might just go str whore after this? yeah I would be slow but with the giant increase in agi builds I would be taking like fuck all damage

[Torben]

agi builds do a fuckton of damage...

[Tydeus]

Well, that rework is not that bad(I don't like these str maul builds ) but I don't like this, that it will hit a bit damage of yet normal str builds(3 to 5 wm) but agi builds seems to be buffed to much(that jump from ~175 to 200184 wpf + more dmg WOW). The thing I don't like the most is nerfing balanced hybrids, that's just wrong. WRONG.
Need to rethink my builds...

8WM right now allows you to get 172 WM, after the patch it'll be 184, as per the graph in the OP.

[Dooz]

thanks graph

[HappyPhantom]

Yes.

Hmmm, as far as I've noticed higher WPF seems to affect the length of time I can hold a small reticule, and my arrows go straighter rather than veering off. Increasing this IMHO isn't a huge buff to an archer.

It's still up to the archer to manage trajectory and timing, which isn't made that much easier.

As long as it doesn't affect strength of hit I don't think melee will notice much of a difference in archers?

[Jarlek]

Hmmm, as far as I've noticed higher WPF seems to affect the length of time I can hold a small reticule, and my arrows go straighter rather than veering off. Increasing this IMHO isn't a huge buff to an archer.

It's still up to the archer to manage trajectory and timing, which isn't made that much easier.

As long as it doesn't affect strength of hit I don't think melee will notice much of a difference in archers?

You forget that WPF also makes your arrows do more damage.

[Dooz]

reimbursing something like 6 Strength attributes and however many skill points that amounts to(This is currently the plan)

i don't understand. added to whatever we already have? or be able to respec up to those amounts? or what.

-edit-
oh saw edit cool

[Leshma]

Instead of getting fun patch aka buffed melee hybrids, we are getting lazy ass spammer patch

Seriously, how come none of you see advantages of melee hybrids running around in packs. Playing whole time with just one weapon make you specialized because you're used to it and its length. But when you use more than one weapon per round/map you'll have to adapt a little bit every time and won't be as effective like when using one weapon all the damn time. Also, using more than one weapon is fun.

Bring us fun patches!

[Radament]

wpf_gained_per_WM_increase = 55 + 20 * new_WM_value
wpf_gained_per_AGI_increase = 14
sum formula: 15+55*WM+20*(WM*(WM+1)/2)+14*AGI
cost formula: floor(.0005*wpf^2+3)

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[Tydeus]

You forget that WPF also makes your arrows do more damage.

Hmmm, as far as I've noticed higher WPF seems to affect the length of time I can hold a small reticule, and my arrows go straighter rather than veering off. Increasing this IMHO isn't a huge buff to an archer.

It's still up to the archer to manage trajectory and timing, which isn't made that much easier.

As long as it doesn't affect strength of hit I don't think melee will notice much of a difference in archers?

Tested this already with Urist's archery damage calculator.

So if for an 18/27 6PD 9WM archer you think 1.4 (61.30 to 62.69) more raw(meaning you can expect the actual difference to be cut down to half a point after armor) damage is a large difference, then sure. Huge buff. Keep in mind this is 1/3 of the damage you'd gain if we buffed ammo or bows by 1 damage, or 1/6 of what you'd gain by adding 3 more str and 1 more PD. 

[En_Dotter]

Arrow damage is also reduced by distance, dont forget it. Those numbers (if they are accurate) apply only for point plank hit. The further the target the lest the damage.

[dynamike]

You're level 34 you suffer a penalty basically(removal of free wpf based on level), but you've also got that triple hybrid build, so the numbers aren't going to be pretty.

Here are what some of the possible splits would look like.

88/88/88
82/82/98
75/75/108

Lowering STR by 3 and getting one more WM gives...

99/100/100
95/95/108
88/88/118

For the sake of upkeep though, I'd consider making sure your highest effective melee wpf stays above 100.
Haha, very sorry. I corrected it.Yeah, that was a typo, very sorry.

Thanks for explaining Ty, I appreciate it.

This is very disappointing for me though since the only thing that kept me engaged in this game for this long was my variety in play styles (together with my thousand alts). If I am being forced to cut down to a simpler build it will take a lot of the fun out of it for me.

Plus in general, the nerf for hybrids seems like it would lead to a simplification in the game with less "class" variety. Is there no way to make the changes without hybrids being negatively affected? If you ask me, diversification should even be buffed, since it sacrifices the min/maxing capabilities of more dedicated "classes". It is also more team oriented to play as a hybrid, since you can switch to whatever role your team is lacking during a battle.

Any way to address this?

[HappyPhantom]

Tested this already with Urist's archery damage calculator.

So if for an 18/27 6PD 9WM archer you think 1.4 (61.30 to 62.69) more raw(meaning you can expect the actual difference to be cut down to half a point after armor) damage is a large difference, then sure. Huge buff. Keep in mind this is 1/3 of the damage you'd gain if we buffed ammo or bows by 1 damage, or 1/6 of what you'd gain by adding 3 more str and 1 more PD. 

Ok.. good to know. I didn't realise WPF also added to damage.

How many 18/27 archers are around? I've only ever managed to go to level 32 at 18/24 (6WM / 172 Bow WPF)

Arrow damage is also reduced by distance, dont forget it. Those numbers (if they are accurate) apply only for point plank hit. The further the target the lest the damage.

Yup at point blank I'm usually about now dropping my bow (arrows) so I can make actual use of my AGI, and glance attacking on my  enemy with my no PS ;)

[Huscarlton_Banks]

Think the bigger balance change for 18/27 archers is that they will be able to go 18/24 and more or less maintain the same WPF, freeing up 7 skill points.

[WITCHCRAFT]

It has been mentioned over and over at this point that ranged will be balanced to match its current level of effectiveness. How long until the patch after this WPF/WM change, who knows. But it's the next thing on the table.

Also the more I mess around with a character calculator, the more I want to retire from 1H/shield to 18/24 or 18/27 2H when the patch comes around. Then I'll have to respec an alt so I can use all my +3 daggers and knives and cleavers...