New DTV map sucks

[Falka]

Yup, that's true, new DTV maps suck. They're all made with the same pattern; invisible walls everywhere and narrow passages which let us play in only one way: slaughter bots with overheads in one narrow gap. No more charging (invisble bariers basically everywhere), no more "trains" (did I mention about walls? bots can move only along corridors leading right to the virgin).

On a few maps there's even no place for everyone to fight, so when server is full half of the team can leech in peace cause gateways are too narrow to let everybody fight. Bah, in a few cases even archers can not shoot at bots cause there's no accessible roofs or some other platforms.

Fips, you said "no more abusing maps". According to me new maps mean no more variety and flexibilty, no more tactics, only endless spam in tiny passages.

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Yup, I'm crying 

[Fips]

But having Yaragar/Rizi/Istiniar almost 24/7 on the server didn't bother anyone either.
Like there were any other tactics than the ones you are using on the server now with the new maps and the ones that exploited huts/roofs/barns/fences. I'm just getting rid of the latter.

About that ranged aspect, i've seen 2 maps where they are completely useless and i'm going to fix that, but the rest of the maps are basically a ranged heaven.


And most invisible walls will stay. I'm not going to put some retarded walls, stakes or anything else where the invi walls are right now just because they shouldn't be invisible. Like a rounded circle of walls around the entrances to the chokepoints of the maps would look any good. People will get used to the placement of the walls and the maps won't look like shit.

Also i'd like to remind you that you should be happy that Shik and myself are actually working on the mode at all, because noone else gave two craps about it. I could have just gotten rid of the exploitable maps and be done with it as well. But no, instead of just letting Shik nerf the bots i decided to rework some maps and make new ones, so give me a fucking break, gosh. It's been on a testrun for not even a day and there is also EU7 with the old rotation ~_~

[Hellsing]

Bots stuck on this map:

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[Falka]

Also i'd like to remind you that you should be happy that Shik and myself are actually working on the mode at all, because noone else gave two craps about it.

so give me a fucking break, gosh.

I appreciate your work Fips, I really do, but you can not expect only praise I tried to keep my whinning at reasonable level and point out flaws in your work, so that you could improve it

Old maps aren't perfect, that's obvious, but I think they let us for more diversified approach. Mindless spam in narrow passages can be funny from time to tiem, but on all maps? Meh, not my cup of tea. Also, as I mentioned, a few maps don't let all players actually particpate in a fight. E.g. map borrowed from siege, flat village on a shore with liftgate in front and small passage on the left. When gate is closed there's room only for 3-4 melee players, the rest of them can not fight cause there's no place for it.

[Uther Pendragon]

I was sceptical about this new tight map-stuff, but when I saw the good ol' Sea Raid...
My eyes were sweating, I swear. Keep up the good work.

EDIT: After playing the new maps for quite a while, I have to say some are indeed broken, but some are brilliant. What is a perfect example of a balanced map are the Arena and the Sea Raid

[Sir_Hans]

I enjoy about half of the DTV maps and welcome a change of new maps.

But I do agree with everyone on that there shouldn't be invisible walls. When I did QA game testing contracts for EA and Namco that was a Class A or B bug... aka high priority to fix, whenever you ran into invisible collision on games.

I can see where your coming from it would look shitty with fences along all of the invisible walls on some of the maps. But if that's the case we need new maps with cliffs or very steep hills/ terrain along the invisible walls. There seems to be a lot of willing people to make DTV maps, Just tell them what you need is closed off "Corridor" type maps. Instead of picking up wide open maps and adding a ton of invisible collision (invisible walls) everywhere.

Ohyeah and that one corridor map with the single ballista and Steep Cliff on the left side needs an invisble wall near the AI spawn (or maybe there already is one and they spawn on the other side of it) either way that map needs a fix... There's always a bot or two going 50ft up the mountain side and is unreachable except for range.

Other than that I think maps are pretty good, there is a decent variety and I really like that one that puts the viscount indoor with enemies spawning above and going into the 2nd floor as well as on the beach running through the 1st floor door eventually... there should be more unique dtv maps like that one. (though there are some exploits on the map like running out behind one of the invisible wall/fences near the main building.


PS: Take out those trashy Helms Deeps maps... neither are fun, they both look like crap, and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

[Razz]

I must  say, those invisible maps are the most annoying, they block ypuff and basically get slaughtered by the bots.
It's like you are inviting us like ''wow look at all this room to play'', but yeah half the map is blocked off anyway..

[Patoson]

On this map, the viscount spawns inside the wall sometimes and bots can't reach him.

And the map with the mountain road usually has the last bot stuck on the mountain until an archer shoots it or luckily it decides to come down after a while.

[HappyPhantom]

But having Yaragar/Rizi/Istiniar almost 24/7 on the server didn't bother anyone either.
Like there were any other tactics than the ones you are using on the server now with the new maps and the ones that exploited huts/roofs/barns/fences. I'm just getting rid of the latter.

About that ranged aspect, i've seen 2 maps where they are completely useless and i'm going to fix that, but the rest of the maps are basically a ranged heaven.


And most invisible walls will stay. I'm not going to put some retarded walls, stakes or anything else where the invi walls are right now just because they shouldn't be invisible. Like a rounded circle of walls around the entrances to the chokepoints of the maps would look any good. People will get used to the placement of the walls and the maps won't look like shit.

Also i'd like to remind you that you should be happy that Shik and myself are actually working on the mode at all, because noone else gave two craps about it. I could have just gotten rid of the exploitable maps and be done with it as well. But no, instead of just letting Shik nerf the bots i decided to rework some maps and make new ones, so give me a fucking break, gosh. It's been on a testrun for not even a day and there is also EU7 with the old rotation ~_~

Did anyone actually complain about the rizi/instinar maps? Why do you feel like they were a problem?

I'm guessing people liked and exploited them because they gave a ton of xp. But not nearly the fuckton that the new map, where people make shieldswall at entrance to city give; that always fills the server; but is boring as hell. I don't see how it's a 'better' map than rizi or istinar?

Why is it such a binary choice? Can't we have both kinds of maps? Why not?

And I'm sorry but those invisible walls are fucking stupid, unintuitive, and bad game design. Put visible barriers up so we know where our boundaries are. It's impossible to memories all invisi-boundaries. I just don't understand your view on this at all... Aesthetics? Please.

Fips, do you play DTV?

[MountedRhader]

Did anyone actually complain about the rizi/instinar maps? Why do you feel like they were a problem?

I'm guessing people liked and exploited them because they gave a ton of xp. But not nearly the fuckton that the new map, where people make shieldswall at entrance to city give; that always fills the server; but is boring as hell. I don't see how it's a 'better' map than rizi or istinar?

Why is it such a binary choice? Can't we have both kinds of maps? Why not?

And I'm sorry but those invisible walls are fucking stupid, unintuitive, and bad game design. Put visible barriers up so we know where our boundaries are. It's impossible to memories all invisi-boundaries. I just don't understand your view on this at all... Aesthetics? Please.

Fips, do you play DTV?

This.

[Patoson]

The new maps are fine, except those wrong-placed spawn points, but it would also be nice to play on some open maps like the old ones, making sure they would have no access to rooves at all and no fences or any other type of exploitable object (forget about Yaragar, Rizi or Istiniar).

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

Some of the new maps are great, some are absolute trash, I'll post a list with the maps I feel need change/removal and what.

[Sharpe]

Fips, do you play DTV?

His clan has a server, that has to count for something right?

[Jona]

His clan has a server, where they all go and strategize like hardcore nerds and then expect everyone else who isn't in the same TS to copy them play-for-play. Because obviously everyone thinks just like the HRE and enjoys being pansies hiding behind shieldwalls and such instead of charging into the mindless slaughter that is DTV.

tl;dr HRE apparently doesn't know how to have fun, and simply made themselves a game mode to make their grind easier.

[Dalfador]

Giving my opinion on these forums is never something I have been fond of, but in this case, I feel it is necessary.

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I hate the new DTV. The only reason I played it before was for the familiar community of DTV heroes and having to actually fight. NOT vertically swing between two shields or easily take down 2-3 enemies with a ballista. All of the XP and gold has attracted the worst part of the community and it is now filled with power gamers. I know from first hand experience. I have a friend, who shall remain anonymous, barely even touched DTV before this. Now he won't shut up about the fucking game even at school. He plays games to level up and be the best (power gamer), so no wonder why he loves this XP grind that some of you call a game.

I used to hop on cRPG daily and play DTV for an hour or two, and have played it for over 3 years. However, ever since the patch that brought these invisible funnels, shieldwalls every game, and a server full of power gamers, I fear I have lost taste for cRPG entirely. You have hurt not only me, but many others who loved this server for what it once was.

Good day.