Understanding the rise of China

[Prpavi]

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http://www.ted.com/talks/martin_jacques_understanding_the_rise_of_china.html

I have a m8 studying in Shanghai and we are talking quite a bit about cultural, political and other differences between our world that is Europe and China and there are quite a few 

I'm curious what you guys think. I don't mean in brute numbers, financial or military strength of China compared to US but more cultural impact it will have on the whole world especailly western world once it surpasses US and becomes the true world leader. Will it ever surpass even? How will EU and US handle it? Discuss.

[[ptx]]

I really have not done any research, so i can't comment on when and if it will surpass other current world leaders in various areas.
But i'm pretty sure it will not have much of any cultural impact on the western world when/if it does that. Western culture is just too embedded as a global, international culture, even in China, to be dislodged by economic means, imo.

[Prpavi]

The thing I believe will get us the most is work ethics.

[Reyiz]

Tiny penises...

[Teeth]

China will definitely surpass the U.S. economically. Maybe not in GDP per capita but definitely in overall GDP. It's kind of a numbers game, 1.3 million people just produce a fuckload of shit once they start to catch up their technological disadvantage, espescially if those 1.3 billion people are willing to work a lot more. The consequences this will have are among others, much greater power of China in international economic organisations like for example the WTO. India has been very successful in negotiations conducted inside the WTO since they became a major economic power as well. It's a very strategic game those negotations and honestly India seems to understand it a lot better than China so far.

Another consequence is the economic center of gravity is going east rapidly. The entire region will benefit from China, and of course the other extremely fast growing economies there, Europe might for the first time since like the 16th century, stop being the center of the world. The enormous consumer markets that are being created in India and China are a catalyst of growth for those countries and whoever manages to export there. The EU is now one of the most important markets, but attention is shifting eastwards. Austrialia and New Zealand realise this and are gearing towards the east, so is Latin-America and so is the U.S. to some extent. EU has focused on the U.S. and its inside market for the past century and is having trouble switching, which is even more difficult due to large physical distance with China.

This shift in attention and perhaps a failure to switch especially by Europe might in the longer run cause the Western world to no longer be the most affluent region in the world, which might be shocking for us after generations of a superior material position. China's military might outgrow the U.S. as well at some very far point in time, but I am not too worried about that. China still believes in non-interventionism so doubt we are getting a Chinese policeman of the world.

Now one could argue how this will effect life in Europe and if it is a bad development, but that is too far a stretch to say in my opinion. I still see some problems with China's increasing affluence that might cause them get slowed down a lot. Economic growth requires educating your people. In the western world increasing affluence and education almost always caused a desire for political influence, the same might happen in China. It all depends on how the regime handles it and how the people respond to the regime when getting richer and more educated. The entire regime might collapse under civil pressures, who knows what happens then with China's development.

[Molly]

My personal experience with the Chinese students at my University is that those students are adapting really fast.
Yesterday was the start of the new semester and over the next few weeks you can clearly see the "new guys" out of the group changing. It starts with loosening up in public (which is probably just normal after being in a completely different country) and then you see a change in clothes, food and... politeness.
At the beginning they are like overly polite that it's even uncomfortable for my co-workers and me but let them be here for a month and they actually become quite the opposite. Not every single one of them, of course, but the majority starts to act rather rude by "our" standards. Being loud, spitting on the floor, throwing garbage on the ground and being impolite in conversations... that is personal observation by co-workers, Professors and me.

Another thing I noticed is the lack of creativity. The goal of the studies I did/do is that you learn and understand things to a certain depth that you can freely use those tools in a creative way to solve certain "challenges" (I never use the term "problem" connected with my work - there are no "problems", only challenges with different difficulty ).
They have really good grades when the exams are just testing "knowledge".
If the test isn't just about repeating what is written in a script or book, I'd say 90% of them fail at the exam questions where you actually have to use that knowledge to come up with a solution.

A personal note: What I really don't understand is their lack of language. Personally, if would study in a foreign country, I would want to learn the local language and use English just to help out. Our Chinese students neither speak English nor German properly, at least the big majority doesn't. Unfortunately most of them stick to each other and barely have any contacts outside their Chinese community which is a pity.

How is their impact on "our" culture? I haven't noticed any... yet. And I don't think we will for quite a while. Cultures grow over hundreds of years and are "taught" from birth on. That isn't something that happens in a few years.
Some may argue that European culture is deeply influenced by the American culture, why shouldn't it happen with the Asian/Chinese one too?
I think there is just too big of a difference between those to have a big impact on each other. The more interesting question would be if the Asian/Chinese culture will be influenced by the American culture and to which degree?

I remember reading an article about McDonald's and with a paragraph about them opening the first shop in Moscow. For days there were hundreds of people waiting outside all day in 3 rows just to buy a burger... wonder how it went with the first McDonald's being opened in China. Nothing about that in the article...

[Kalam]

As long as they don't have a social revolution (which I believe will be tied to how many young peeps have access to internet) I believe they'll dominate economically. There's more control there than anywhere else, and they're intrinsically linked to the rest of the world now.

Most of Chinese immigrants are fluent English speakers, but maybe it's a difference in immigration policies. It is odd that Japan has more of a cultural influence on us than China does. We definitely have a significant impact on them. I know back in South-East Asia, a flood of Chinese immigrants has changed the culture there quite drastically. I guess it's a question of volume, and how many movies/games/etc that they develop get popular in the west.

[AntiBlitz]

As long as they don't have a social revolution (which I believe will be tied to how many young peeps have access to internet) I believe they'll dominate economically. There's more control there than anywhere else, and they're intrinsically linked to the rest of the world now.

Most of Chinese immigrants are fluent English speakers, but maybe it's a difference in immigration policies. It is odd that Japan has more of a cultural influence on us than China does. We definitely have a significant impact on them. I know back in South-East Asia, a flood of Chinese immigrants has changed the culture there quite drastically. I guess it's a question of volume, and how many movies/games/etc that they develop get popular in the west.

wasnt it China that had a similar revolution before, where the young rose up and lopped off the head of the old ruler and installed a new younger ruler with views more pertinent to the time.  I dont remember the time of when this occurred, it might be too old to really relate, i tried lol.

I think that as immigration occurs, there will be alot of influence occurring in our more western states, just look at all the Japanese in California and Hawaii and how they impact culture there, though it may be small, it is something.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

You're all overthinking this shit, just blame MacArthur.

[Kafein]

First things first, China will become the world leader together with all the developping countries that followed the same rythm, which means all the big ones like Brazil and India and Russia even though Russia is really different. This is why I do not think things will change much for the west. The game will be more level, but not actually tilted in China's favor that much.

Second, China's finest hour will only last that much. In maximum one hundred years from now Africa will boom economically and demographically, overtaking any other continent.

When that is done maybe we will be able to stop touching ourselves and get the fuck out of this shit cradle.

[Christo]

In maximum one hundred years from now Africa will boom economically and demographically, overtaking any other continent.

I don't even.

That would be insane

[Kafein]

I don't even.

That would be insane

Like it or not, it's happening.

[Christo]

Like it or not, it's happening.

butbutubutubutbut

.-.

[zagibu]

Even if they will surpass the western economies, their growth isn't sustainable. The question is not whether they will fall, but whether the west will be so dependent, that it will fall with them.

[Kafein]

Even if they will surpass the western economies, their growth isn't sustainable. The question is not whether they will fall, but whether the west will be so dependent, that it will fall with them.

How is China's growth not sustainable ? I mean, it will stop eventually, but I don't see China exploding and turning into ashes.


Also, in the west power is shifting away from the governments, not in China.