Suggestions to re-balance throwing.

[Lichen]

Yeah I thought that might be the case. You are a hybrid and have next to no powerthrow, which would have been good to mention beforehand. Honestly I don't know why you bother with the two powerthrow at all because it doesn't make much difference until after PT6. I believe it's just hurting your accuracy with little damage benefit. Also, if you're willing to use throwing weapons in an agility hybrid build, with a lot of wpf, you should actually get something for the damage trade off. Weather you like it or not. It makes sense that your accuracy should be much higher then ours, but god damn your accuracy is no where what it should be for that amount of investment.

I only have the minimum requirement pt for the weapons I want to use (axes mainly). When I get one more point in strength then I can go up to heavy throwing axes at 3 pt. I really don't even use any 1 handers so it's a more gimped build than necessary (I thought it'd be more fun running around with a dagger but don't often use it). So if you put all wpf points into throwing it should be even better for an agility based thrower build. Works for me. May not be a build for everyone though.

[Cheap_Shot]

I've been wanting to check out agility builds, but I've gotten heavily into the swing of strength throwing. I'd like to make sure it doesn't remain ruined forever before I try anything else. Wont abandon ship and let strength throwing sink!

[EponiCo]

Lichen, how good is your damage (especially when using darts, not axes). How many body shots do you need to kill someone in mail (44 armor)?
Because with my stats 5PT, 90WPF it seems to take 10 darts, 3 spears. Dart accuracy is ok yeah, though the spears is really crappy. Though then I've got some really tight groupings in my tests, twice even all spears directly into the same spot (you could only see one spear so accurate was I) ... something seems to be wonky here.

[Native_ATS]

I've been wanting to check out agility builds, but I've gotten heavily into the swing of strength throwing. I'd like to make sure it doesn't remain ruined forever before I try anything else. Wont abandon ship and let strength throwing sink!

thing of the  past... just like 300wpf bowmen

[Timotheusthereal]

+1 Cheap Shot! Very good!

GIEF BACK THROWING!!!!


Not an intelligent message but I think.. it's all needed to be said. I am still thrower and since the patch its a disgrace to use throwing weapon

[Lichen]

Lichen, how good is your damage (especially when using darts, not axes). How many body shots do you need to kill someone in mail (44 armor)?
Because with my stats 5PT, 90WPF it seems to take 10 darts, 3 spears. Dart accuracy is ok yeah, though the spears is really crappy. Though then I've got some really tight groupings in my tests, twice even all spears directly into the same spot (you could only see one spear so accurate was I) ... something seems to be wonky here.

I don't use darts or war darts but I tried war darts just to see on siege. I 2 (or maybe even 1 shotted) to the chest a guy in a studded leather coat. Don't know how that happened unless he was pre injured but he was fresh from the ramp and had no arrows sticking out of him so..... Also got a 1 shot headshot on a guy wearing a mail coif + sarranid guard armor. Also got a few more kills but there was too much chaos for me to see their condition or what they were wearing exactly. I tried against some heraldic mail guys and hit some of them 2 times but couldn't hit them a 3rd time to see. My impression is that against lower armored targets they are pretty effective but if I wanted to take down more highly armored foes I would get more PT and go with throwing spears or jarids etc. But I would personally only get as much PT as required for whatever weap(s) I wanted to use and make sure to get weaponmaster as high as possible as the 2 main priorities.

[Wallace]

Being one of the biggest moan and groaners toward throwing even I agree this is a bit over the top.

My concern was that noobers that couldn't kill me otherwise were one shotting me with throwing lances.

By no means do I think throwing should've been ball tapped this hard. Also give archery back some of its old blood lust

[Cheap_Shot]

Thanks for your support everyone, and even thank you to the critics keeping the debate going. The official survey about item power turned up an overwhelmingly positive support to buff throwing! This was even despite all the troll votes, or people not taking it seriously and voting to buff/nerf whatever they used/whatever killed them. I will draw some celebratory comics to congratulate throwers on making themselves heard.

Lets hope some development team members come into the thread now to discuss it with us, now that they know it is in fact a real issue.

Throwing might yet live again! 

[Cheap_Shot]

As promised, another cRPG comic!

visitors can't see pics , please register or login


As for throwing. Lets brainstorm. We need to have something replace the wpf limitation. As for what I'm not sure yet. Lets theorize until someone from the dev team shows up to say what will/wont work due to coding issues. There just has to be some reason for every two hander in full plate not to grab a couple axes and chuck them randomly without skill. Thrower hate is on the decline, and an influx of TK's wont be good.

I'll start a list of ideas and add them all up. We can discuss their pro's and cons, and discard the unlikely ones. Someone else can start while I think.

[Beans]

Give all throwing weapons a fixed damage not influenced at all by either power throw or wpf.

Allow wpf to increase accuracy.

Allow powerthrow to increase number of throwing weapons you get per stack.

Adjust base ammo accordingly.

This way if you want to have a jav or 2 you can put some points into it and have a nice little pre-melee ranged weapon. If you want to really invest into throwing and be a dedicated skirmisher type dude and have a bunch of javs you can do that also.

Just trying to brainstorm here.

[AlbaTiger]

Yay another comic!
 

On the throwing front a lot of your previous comments on damage increase, slight stack increase, and importantly from the perspective of making hybrid an idiot proof choice (it should be an option but not more so than any other hybrid choice) making the requirements of the weapons higher.

I know none of that helps the accuracy issues which I would say are the major problem, but those are the easiest changes to impliment I assume.

[Cheap_Shot]

I think an obvious thing is to have wpf effect accuracy more for sure. There could be secondary effects of raising wpf though.

[Bryggan]

I like the wpf accuracy deal.  I try take out rogue cav and don't dare throw till he's on me for fear of hitting friendlys until he's gone or running me over.  And one jarid doesn't slow a charging horse down oddly enough.  And then after I throw 2 jarids into a typical mailed fallen cav I get one hit killed by a bolt or arrow through my Novgorod helm.  My guy is a bit of a hopeless hybrid due to a little indecision, but I got to level 30 and I should be able to kill the odd peasant with one hit of my 3 jarids much like an archer can do with one of his 30+ arrows.

I'm 18 str 18 agi, 6 PS, 5 shield, 3 ath, 4 riding (which I'm gawdawful at, BIG mistake), 5 PT and 6 WP.  I got 129 pf one handed and 106 throwing.  Not the greatest build, but I'd like a little more damage for my throws.  At 100 wpf I don't expect good accuracy, but the odd time I do manage to hit that peasant or rouncey it should sink deep.

[San]

In addition to throwing in general, are there any specific items that people feel needs to be changed?


 I think the throwing stars are kind of useless since they seem to be overshadowed by some of the other low price low difficulty weapons. But I have only used these for a limited number of matches, so hopefully an epic star thrower can set me straight.

[Vammo75]

My wish list (although I abandoned having a throwing main after being in a strategios battle, I love playing with my pure throwing alts).

• Take away the stupid wpf requirement.
• I would like all throwing weapons over francisca to be 3 slot but have usefully large stack size: i.e. 12 jarids.
• I would like the wpf to reflect accuracy and running accuracy more.
• PT should increase damage, range, shot speed and lower the trajectory of the missile but have no other effect on accuracy.
• Heavy axes to be replaced by two handed axes (but I have not seen any in any mod yet): any budding animators?.