New Mechanic: Dodge

[Micah]

I really like the overall idea of adding combat abilities, since it adds complexity - and thereby variety - to the fighting. But i have to agree with some counter arguments here.
Firstly, my main problem is, that it has to stay "natural". I do already have problems with accepting the current nudge mechanics (i love nudge but not the cooldown mechanics). I know that this is not a thread about nudge , but my idea includes both (i call them "power-actions") , nudge and dodge .. or leap.

The core idea is , to implement nudge and dodging/leap as a "boosted" standard actions and introduce a "action-key", which will boost the next action.
After using a power action, the character will then enter an "exhausted state" for 5-10 sec (as an substitute for shared cooldown). it will still be able to do all power action , but only perform very weak and slow ... very slow animation which will most propably get him killed - thus it should be interruptable  .
This would feel much more natural and not like a "blocked action" imo.

to make an power-action , do:
1) Press "action-key" (e.g. SHIFT or ALT - both keys aren't assigned yet in the game )
2) Press  keys for corresponding standard action ( A+SPACE for left leap, A+A Left dodge, LMB+MOUSE-UP for Overhead nudge(2h), RMB for defensive nudge ...)

This might help out with the mess about assigning activation keys (V-for nudge isnt exactly aergonomic tbh )

edit: well, doubble tap for dodge might do aswell .. but tbh, i never really loved double-tap activation - should be substituted by a 2-key-combo imho 

edit2: perhaps , reducing running acceleration in exhausted-state would be reasonable too 
Also, regarrding the 100% kd ... this should be only doable as a power-action 

[dynamike]

I already dislike the nudge, please don't add more.

Maybe I'm just too old to learn new mechanics, but the core MB fighting system without fancy key combos was and is what still attracts me to the game after so many years.

I appreciate the effort, though I wish it was invested in making the current game more diverse (armors, maps, game modes) without touching core mechanics.

[Angantyr]

Something that allows one to get up when knockdowned would be very welcome, never liked the free hit knockdown.

Other than that I've always enjoyed the free form movement in WB, that if you evade it is not some rigid evasive animation but yourself WSAD'ing like in the good ol' days. I remember TaleWorlds suggesting jump and climb animations back in beta, like for example when passing over a fence, luckily this was quickly shot down.

Normal dodge rolls are completely out of the question for me, this would be the ultimate immersion breaker.


I may be conservative but I really just prefer fighting with my weapon and footwork, not all these kinds of fancy karate kicks and ninja rolls. Enjoying my polearm nudge, nevertheless (thank you Tydeus), but I strongly feel these extras should stay firmly in the background.

[PanPan]

inb4

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This sig <3

[Micah]

Enjoying my polearm nudge, nevertheless (thank you Tydeus).

pole-nudge should be AoE though (considering weapon-size and weight) and 2h-overhead-nudge should have kd-chance ... 

[Vermilion]

I don't like the idea of any sort of 'rolling'. Also the whole point of knockdown is so you can get a free hit against shielders when they are on the ground, if you add rolling after being knockdown you might as well just remove knockdown from the game..

I would like to see a 'double-tap' side step though... this would allow you to avoid over heads from weapons such as the long maul, or get behind someone for a quick hit behind their shield/block/etc.

However, I think the side step should be affected by agility and armor weight. That way you can't get side-stepping strength builds wearing tin-can armor.

[Fips]

plate armors are not heavier than chainmail armour at last not that much if at all but that depends on what armours we want compare
also plate armors were extremyl good designed and provided good movement abilities.
but your version sounds more balanced

Yeah, wasn't really talking about realism anyway. To me it just made more sense balance wise.

Also, i really don't get why so many people are against this! If it's a gamebreaker it still can be removed. Stuff like that always needs some real testing on server before you can be sure about it and the possibility that it will be awesome is there, so why not take this chance? If people now are pondering against this and it won't make it in the game because of them, it just saddens me. I like that devs will take the community into account, but imo this poll should have been done after it was tested on the servers. That way people can actually talk about their experience with the mechanic instead of their expectations of it.

[Micah]

I don't like the idea of any sort of 'rolling'. Also the whole point of knockdown is so you can get a free hit against shielders when they are on the ground, if you add rolling after being knockdown you might as well just remove knockdown from the game..

i think kd-roll should be made as a challenge to hit a key in a very shoort time-window after you get kd'd this would make alot of sense and fun imo 

[Radament]

The only thing I can think about is all the hit boxes being wonky everywhere and people morphing into each other constantly.

I only see problems with the dodging idea.  As for the knockdown roll.  I really do not think it is needed nor fair to those who use knockdown.  Although, I guess if it heavily relied on your overall weight it would be alright.

i approve dodging but i'm afraid about these possible consequences..
knockdown is still knockdown but with the difference that you have not anymore the secure free (retarded) hit like before and i like it even if i'm using winged mace myself as 1h.

problems are those weird hitboxes (they're screwed even in normal game  ) when rolling....or you plan to set dodging with invicibility on?

The fact is that dodge adds more ways to play , more skill involved , not only the same spinthrusts , left swing , thrust and kicks...but i'm afraid it adds more bugs and QQ 

[Sir_Carealot]

I really don't like the rolling option (only reminds me of those awful Demon souls PvP attles that didn't feel at all authentic). The other options I can live with.. loving the nudge but I don't really want anything with greater impact than that. The core gameplay is already awesome.
Rather than new ways to dodge I would love to see new gamemodes, upgraded strategus battles, new maps, letting the mapmaker balance those maps out after a bit of testing and so on. There are a lot of areas already in the game that could be in need of a lookover. 

[rufio]

Because what people think to be badly needed balancing fixes is just their own lobby-twisted view demanding buffs for themselves and nerfs for the others. The mod is pretty balanced from my point of view and I'll make new stuff 'cause it's fun (for me) and eventually add it if the rest of the cRPG devs agree. If it doesn't work out it gets removed. Why not test mechanics in cRPG and give the Melee devs an idea if there is any point of implementing it into their game or not?

remove ranged stagger, like polestagger, imba yo!

[Belatu]

Oh yeah before you start adding more features could you make the Nudge key rebindable first so I can actually use it? thanks.

[51L3NC3R]

This is brilliant...Encumbrance, Athletics and your overall Agility should factor in
Cheers

[Penitent]

I'm not much for rolling after knockdown...I think it will nerf that mechanic a bit too much.

I am very in favor of adding a dodge/sidestep though.  Maybe double-tap "D" to do a quick strafe, or double tap S to hop back real quick.  I don't think you should be able to attack while doing this.

[Son Of Odin]

Gibe Dodge pls!

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