hoplite needs a serious nerf

[Kafein]

Don't hoplites have damage maluses that lead to having less damage than LS users ? I don't know the exact numbers.

Anyway, it's more fair to compare the best hoplite weapons with the best 2D polearms which aren't the pike/LS. I'd say the awlpike is the best, but really all those that are shorter than 190 have decent damage and are relatively easy to use even without a massive STR stack. With a lot of PS or a lot of experience playing those weapons, you can instant stab with the longest 2D polearms which is very hard to fight against. Which is also why I don't think 2D polearms need a buff at all, unless the instant stabs get fixed.

[Paul]

Using polearms onehanded has a speed and damage penalty, yeah. Damage should be around 72%(0.85^2) iirc.

[Konrax]

So even with a speed decrease, they can still stab faster then 1h users.

[Rhekimos]

I recall some polearms had a "penalty with shield" tag on the website, but not all. I don't know if it's gone for all of them, or there for all of them. Or maybe only some polearms still get the penalty.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

I recall some polearms had a "penalty with shield" tag on the website, but not all. I don't know if it's gone for all of them, or there for all of them. Or maybe only some polearms still get the penalty.

Nope

[Rhekimos]

Nope

Nope to which? I'm pretty sure the tag was there back in the days of the white website.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

Nope to which? I'm pretty sure the tag was there back in the days of the white website.

You're probably thinking of usable with shield, pretty sure you can't set some poles to get penalties and some to not.

[IG_Saint]

Native and very old crpg did have a "penalty with shield" tag on some polearms, however I believe cmp once mentioned that the tag is actually broken and doesn't do anything, which is presumably why it got removed in crpg.

Correction, waltf4 said it:

"Penalty with shield" has not done anything since the beta. It was left over code, and the cRPG team recently removed the flag from the item file as it does nothing. Holding a polearm in one hand causes it to do 30% less damage and reduces the attack speed significantly. The speed penalty makes the faster spear weapons used with one hand as slow as the slowest one handed weapons, and the slower spear weapons used with one hand are as slow as the slowest two handed weapons. I have posted exact numbers for the speed penalty elsewhere.

[Konrax]

Native and very old crpg did have a "penalty with shield" tag on some polearms, however I believe cmp once mentioned that the tag is actually broken and doesn't do anything, which is presumably why it got removed in crpg.

Correction, waltf4 said it:

If this is indeed true, I find it difficult to believe because of my experience using a broad short sword (one of the fastest 1h weapons) being slower than some spears used by hoplites.

[Macropus]

If this is indeed true, I find it difficult to believe because of my experience using a broad short sword (one of the fastest 1h weapons) being slower than some spears used by hoplites.

Are you serious?.. Hoplite's spear isn't faster. How did you come to such conclusion? Tried to spam a hoplite and failed at it?

[Vodner]

So even with a speed decrease, they can still stab faster then 1h users.

1h swords can stab very quickly, it just requires some odd wiggling. I was partial to stabbing just slightly over peoples' heads, and bringing the sword down after a split second. This works far better with a higher FoV setting, since with the default FoV you will be effectively blind while looking up.

[Konrax]

Are you serious?.. Hoplite's spear isn't faster. How did you come to such conclusion? Tried to spam a hoplite and failed at it?

We are both within stab range, then prepare to stab at the same time, then I die because their stab fired first. (Not a failed chamber attempt)

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

If this is indeed true, I find it difficult to believe because of my experience using a broad short sword (one of the fastest 1h weapons) being slower than some spears used by hoplites.

That is just you being shit

[San]

1h: 0.35+0.62+0.3
pole: 0.35+0.6+0.3
(ready+release+continue in seconds, before being affected by wpf)

Maybe it's not him being shit?

No idea how the speed penalty affects these numbers. From my personal experience, it seems the ready time can be pretty slow for the polearm, but upon release it's always fast.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

Maybe it's not him being shit?

No idea how the speed penalty affects these numbers. From my personal experience, it seems the ready time can be pretty slow for the polearm, but upon release it's always fast.

It's him being shit, I probably use the 1h stab a lot more than 99% of the other players.