HACKED

[Wolfsblood]

if i get into an archer duel with someone who has a rus bow and i am using my long bow, unless I have superior cover, I will get wrecked everytime except if the skill level of the person using it is very much below mine.

so this discounts the longbow being OP in this situation at the very least.

Also, i don't believe that you can use marketplace data to say an item is OP. There are too many variables in reasons for many people in the market wanting this item. If you are going to use data of any kind, you should be researching the general skill of the archer populace and then compare both bows when they are in their hands. but of course this would be too much work for your average video game nerd who probably has ADD...which I should get tested for...

Finally many people who say items are OP generally point out the people who are OP with any wep.
For Example: I could cry and say the short bow is OP when masterworked  cuase frugfrug can do so well with it. but we all know that it isnt the bow that is OP.

TL;DR  Do some real empirical research before you go crying about an item being too OP

[Rumblood]

Kulin, if I am concerned about any bow at all and its relative usage, it is the Yumi. I've used every bow over my 20+ generations and simply never found a compelling reason to use that one over any of the others.

[Rumblood]

Well, it basically fills the role of most damaging HA bow, at least that is what I always thought.

The problem with that is the accuracy penalty on horseback, the accuracy penalty to higher PD (3 higher than Nomad which is quite a blow), and you can only get to HA 3 at Lvl 31 because you need to put 18 into strength and it takes 6 agility per horse archer point. That makes for a poor shot. The slower missile speed does give you a better speed bonus when charging, but gets no better or worse when circle strafing other mounted ranged or pursuing cavalry. The slower missile speed also compounds that poor accuracy problem. Then there is the cost.
With ragged outfit, leather boots, Nomad and regular arrows, and a spiked club with an Arabian, I just break even on gold. The only thing you can lower in that setup is the Arabian. The courser wont be enough of a savings to keep from bleeding gold, so the best you can go with is palfrey or desert horse. Palfrey is slower than a courser with the same maneuver, so you can't get away from cavalry after you and with maneuver that low, you get eaten by HX and other HA. The desert has good enough maneuver, but the speed is so slow the maneuver won't help you against any of the other mounted classes either. Bottom line is, you go broke or become a slow moving duck.
That is just doing a strict HA compare. Throw in the HX into the mix and now you are really in trouble. Their accuracy is far better than your and they can hold it forever without the reticule expanding. You have to rely entirely on timing. Sure, if you can disrupt their reloading, you have a chance, but your accuracy is so bad from the causes listed above that you may as well hope someone else shoots them and disrupts their reload. At any rate, the armor they wear is superior as well, and with cut damage you aren't going to be one hitting them. They will one shot you though. So to compete, you need to upgrade from those arrows to bodkins. That's another 10k gold you have to remove from your equipment (5k x 2 stacks). That means you might be able to afford a Rouncey, which again lacks speed and maneuver both compared to what others are riding that will be hunting your head. Oh yes, you are also giving up 18 arrows while also being inaccurate at the same time. At least you can have 6 PS since you won't need more than 3 riding with that Rouncey you will be shot and lanced off of every round. But if you want any wpf to swing it with any usefulness, you will need to give up some of that wpf in archery, which makes you even more inaccurate if you do.
You might as well be a ground archer at that point, and then the Tatar or Horn are better choices.

Can Yumi be the most damaging of the horse archer bows? Slightly. Can it be the most effective of the horse archer bows? Not from my experience and the numbers above are why.

[Ronin]

Aren't there viable builds like 18/21, 18/18 or 21/18 for horse archer?

[jtobiasm]

I don't get what you're moaning at Kulin. I use both Long & Rus and I can get the same score with either Long Bow or Rus Bow it just depends on the map or if I need some more money. Rus bow is still perfectly viable.

[Rumblood]

Aren't there viable builds like 18/21, 18/18 or 21/18 for horse archer?

Define "viable". Ask instead of there is an "effective" one.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

A peasant with stones and 50 wpf in throwing can completely ruin a longbow archer. You don't seem to grasp all the negative traits that come with using a longbow.

I had 120 wpf, but I can confirm this.

[Kafein]

The most battle-effective archers are those that oneshot most of the things they hit, even with bad draw times or bad accuracy. Because you are still better oneshotting people with a 70% likelyhood than twoshotting with 80% success chance per shot, even considering that people might not have all their health left.

Also this longbow argument is funny because bows are now maybe the only weapon class with the most expensive item actually the best.

[Ptolemy]

I don't want to derail the subject, since it's a fairly important one - although I personally believe that the Rus and Long are pretty well balanced now when you take upkeep into account, long is better, yes, it also costs more.

What I wanted to say was that having an archer alt and having enjoyed it for over a generation now and also being a "style over stats" player - I'm a ninja after all - I'm glad that the Yumi is now a viable bow to use on foot rather than just on the horse.

[Hunter_the_Honourable]

sooo the easymodebow (rusbow) finally gets a nerf after being one of, if not the most popular bow around and nooooow you're claiming that the longbow which was always hard to master using and a very small handful of people used and even smaller group actually Masterworked got the buff it needed and according to you that's unfair?

The rusbow probably held the title of most OP if not most used bow around and now it got knocked off the top you're QQing that your weapon is now not as good as another? For fuck sake Kulin the rusbow needed a nerf and it got one, maybe it got over nerfed maybe not eitherway the longbow was always the shitty choice out of the two now its not.

Translation: Shut up whining and QQing that your weapon got nerfed, Now you know what EVERYONE ELSE who's weapon got nerfed. Suck it up move on and keep playing.

Just another QQ thread, although its nice to see its about the rusbow being nerfed, but I guess it always deserved/had this coming 

[Rumblood]

The most battle-effective archers are those that oneshot most of the things they hit, even with bad draw times or bad accuracy. Because you are still better oneshotting people with a 70% likelyhood than twoshotting with 80% success chance per shot, even considering that people might not have all their health left.

Also this longbow argument is funny because bows are now maybe the only weapon class with the most expensive item actually the best.

You are assuming the slower bow can even get off that one shot.  70% likely hood of hitting with a 20% chance of getting to shoot isn't great odds.

[Hunter_the_Honourable]

Actually Kulin I did read all the pages (expect a few posts) and all I see when you post is you repeating your self. Honestly Rumblood knows what his talking and I think his right, I don't see how nerfing the longbow in-order to make the rusbow "usable" again is fair because the rusbow always had a very unfair advantage against a longbow now its vise versa you think its bullshit?

The rusbow has had its "popular" time now let the longbow have some ffs.

[Gmnotutoo]

How is this even a statement? Are you retarded?

Of course a short bow can interrupt EVERY other bow/xbow(without taking into their armor, of course), and of course a thrower can "ruin" a longbow archer. That's because they are much faster, but you don't see people running around with short bows or stones cause they are USELESS/troll builds.

Do everyone a favor and get a brain.

And to everyone else, if you think that you will automatically win a duel against longbow just because your bow has faster draw speed, you are wrong. This only applies IF YOU HIT THEM EVERY TIME.

Using the same logic, if a long bow kept hitting you every time, you would not have time to draw your Rus Bow, EVER.

Do everyone a favor and stop posting balance ideas, because not only are you volatile but you clearly have no idea what balance is.

Since no one has a regular sword, they should nerf the Espada because everyone has it? Or a shield. How many shields do people actually use? I bet I can find a lot of useless ones to compare to the Huscarl and claim to get the Huscarl nerfed. I could go on and on using this same logic you are using to nerf any item I want.

If you want the Rusbow or any other bow buffed, make a post about it comparing the stats and offer a suggestion to improve the item that you think is underpowered.

[Kafein]

You are assuming the slower bow can even get off that one shot.  70% likely hood of hitting with a 20% chance of getting to shoot isn't great odds.

Well yes my analysis was clearly oversimplistic but I think it conveyed the message.

[Umbra]

I don't want to derail the subject, since it's a fairly important one - although I personally believe that the Rus and Long are pretty well balanced now when you take upkeep into account, long is better, yes, it also costs more.

What I wanted to say was that having an archer alt and having enjoyed it for over a generation now and also being a "style over stats" player - I'm a ninja after all - I'm glad that the Yumi is now a viable bow to use on foot rather than just on the horse.

Cost? Seriously? Cost is a non issue for like 99% of the playerbase, thats not even an argument