My last post on the matter. (Please do something about Balance.) nvm patch out!

[Kafein]

I can take on any cav guy with just a 1h sword in a duel. At worst, it will just be a matter of patience. At best I chamberblock a lance thrust and cut the guy's head in two.

Now that this is out of the way, we can start speaking about battle : cav always avoids such a duel situation, knowing that the odds are very, very bad. With any horse but a +3 arabian, ridiculously bad.

[Hunter_the_Honourable]

ok sooo on EU_4 today not 10mins ago, was last alive (dismounted cav) and the last alive on the other team is an archer......


All the archer does is run away and shoot and when I hide behind cover he comes close enough to take some shots but far away enough to ensure i cant get to him without dying, I tried spamming feints and spinning around, everything I could to try and dodge his arrows to no avail.

IMO archers need something done to them to help prevent kiting and to help STR ranged builds.

As for cav any half decent inf can kill a charging horseman and has an even greater chance if his a using a German great sword or the Danish. as for inf who are fighting one on one only for one of them to be killed by a horseman, granted that yeah you can't always hear the cav coming and you wont always have perfect timing but if you bitch that it ruined your "duel" or fight well....if you want on on one fights without interruptions or other people coming along and killing the other person well then go to EU_3

Ninjas are not good against cav because of their short katana's and your throwing weapons are weak. Why don't you do what Ninja Nomin does, and take a Bamboo spear that is a good anti cav weapon and still fits your RP stuff no?

yes even a piker wont win against 5 charging cav all at once but a cav wont survive charging into 5 inf who are aware of him (unless his on an armored horse) no class will survive being rushed by a certain amount of another class (unless your an archer who likes running away)

Either way Battle has become boring and even I play siege more now because I get bored of either being put on the team that auto balance put every inf on against a team with all the ranged and cav. Or just dying and having to wait 5mins for the last alive which is normally one half dead inf and one archer who seems to have allot of ammo, to see the archer just run away and shoot the inf and if a cav is the last alive normally just him and the other last alive waiting each other out.

[Moncho]

Just a question:
Right now you are complaining about kiting, but what about 1shooting archers? That would be the next big cry wave if STR archers were made viable...

[Thomek]

@Hunter The cav doesn't have to engage. He can simply wait. Ride past to the next busy player.

The infantry is not in control of the situation.

@ Moncho, We are talking to nerf agi-archers, and make STR archers be the heavy hitters on par with what high-level loomed up AGI-archers are now.

[Leshma]

That's correct Kulin. But only works for cRPG. In Strategus that will create a lot of issues.

[Pandemona]

I played all classes but i'm dedicated cavalry and i don't have any problem about enemy cavalry when i play other classes because i know what to do, people should learn what to do against cavalries and (in general) should learn how to use their own classes advantages. Every class has advantages and disadvantages if you're using them well, then you're a good player. If you are not, you can keep whining. But before whining about other classes think this ''what if you're doing something wrong?''. There are so many cavalries but only few of them can dominate scoreboard and playing good. (this was my old comment about cavalry)

There's no much thing to do against archers but the right way isn't nerf, try to do some teamwork, stick together with your teammates, use your teammates with shield actively. Also this one is useful to avoid dieing for every classes, choose your position well.

But going solo and dieing alone and then whining won't make other classes nerfed.

In summary, in my opinion no class is OP. cRPG is about your own game style and your own build, there are good players and bad players.

[Moncho]

So you want that a class that already does low damage, has limited ammo, and all it can do to survive atm is to run away has two choices:
Either keep running but with much less damage
or
Go for more strength and keep the damage while not being able to run.

Yes, I see the point you make. You hate them, you truly do apparently, but nerfing them even more is not the solution.

What is happening with cRPG can be seen a bit as something along the line of how combat evolved in Renaissance and so on. People realised that they could hit without getting hit if they developed better ranged weapons. Gunpowder came into play, in cRPG it is archers getting more skilled. So they started hitting the enemies before they had a chance to hit back (Europeans vs Native Americans for example).
This was tried to counter with heavier armor at first (survivability), but then the other armies were forced to go into ranged fighting again, and fighting evolved. Within the limited means of cRPG, that is sort of what is happening (at least in my eyes), of course with a lot of differences, but people have realised they can poke from afar getting less chances of dying (eg the 10 riding HX in NA, 18/24 pure archers, etc).

Also something that bothers me is, why do people consider 18/24 rus bow archers to be agi? Many high level players have 21/21, 18/24 and similar builds, the difference is afaik in the armor used (and maybe some movement penalties to long weapons that bows are not affected by).

And cav, well, cav has always been very powerful, but what is the point of having a horse if it does not give you a big advantage?

[Pejlaen]

I used to really love this game before I started reading and unfortunately absorbing to much from the forums. Caring TOO much about what other peoples opinions are, and letting it affect my playstyle has just made me a worse player and I dont have fun anymore because of it, regardless of how I am doing
 
My advice if you want to enjoy Crpg, is to play it in a way that makes you have fun in it, and ignore peoples critics and negative opinions about you, unless you feel they have some point.

You could also leave the gamebalance to those that made the game in the first place, and obviously knew what they were doing, I doubt we would all enjoy this game otherwise.

[Leshma]

As someone who has been away from cRPG for some time I have to say that ranged in this game is broken. Not saying that they are OP (in most cases they aren't, quite the contrary).

In any other similar game ranged isn't annoying as in Warband. Class is badly designed, that's all. I hope Taleworlds will fix that in M&B2. Can't expect that from donkey crew, they worked on it for two years and even though there were so many changes, class is bad and annoying as it was from day one.

[PhantomZero]

I think if anything was truely "broken" or "imbalanced" then both the NA and EU servers would have the same sort of problems.

Really archers are pathetic and can hardly do any damage at all without masterwork bows and bodkins/tartars. Historically whenever someone was afraid of being shot by an arrow, they would typically carry around a flat piece of wood.

Having OP Archers AND Cav seems kind of silly since the cavalry will typically overrun any "kiting" archers. If they are kiting you, why chase them? Wait for MOF and grab a plated shield.

[Bjord]

FYI, "get a shield"-argument has gotten old, and it doesn't work. Shielders also get shot.

[Denam]

I wonder what they can honestly do to tide this. Everytime they adjust or try to change something, a bevy of threads pop up crying to bring things back to normal.

I guess nobody will ever be happy with anything.

[Adamar]

the difference is afaik in the armor used (and maybe some movement penalties to long weapons that bows are not affected by).

Oh yes they are, and that's the key issue that all you non archers haven't been able to point out.

Armor makes you move slower, shoot slower, and gimps your accuracy. So, in archer vs archer situations the fastest/most accurate win. If armor became an advantage rather than a disadvantage in this situation, there would be a lot less light armored/kiting archers in time, and melee archers would return.

I'd really like to know the dev's opinion on this.

[Hunter_the_Honourable]

Most archers have loomed weapons now, infact It seems pretty rare to me to find a non-loomed weapon now days. And the fact you say archers do little damage yet they are able to kill me in three arrows when Im in around 52+ body armor (and this is without headshots)

And Bjord is right, even the shielders cant deal with archers now days cav can catch them but once we do all they do is just hug our horses and unless your on a fairy horse (champ Arabian) you cannot hit them and Iv even seen 1h cav fail to kill archers because of this.

[Fips]

Delete Melee out of cRPG
re-name forum to rangedgaming.com
????
profit!