Author Topic: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.  (Read 4272 times)

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Offline Zanze

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #30 on: September 25, 2012, 09:48:50 pm »
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Didn't read the rest, but just came back. Would the loom points given be re-usable? I wouldn't trust my just finished downloading crpg with loom points...

Offline oprah_winfrey

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #31 on: September 25, 2012, 09:54:18 pm »
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Didn't read the rest, but just came back. Would the loom points given be re-usable? I wouldn't trust my just finished downloading crpg with loom points...

That is a good point, perhaps give the first retirement 3 loompoints, as they will have so experience to know what they want to loom.

Offline Haboe

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #32 on: September 25, 2012, 10:00:53 pm »
+1

Actually I'd much rather have looms and levels altogether removed from the game.

Takes away a part of what seperates crpg from native (not all ofc)
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Offline Leshma

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #33 on: September 25, 2012, 10:10:05 pm »
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This isn't year 2010. and native seems rather dead. cRPG is going there as well.

Game is awfully outdated and many people got sick of it because they've seen it all.

War of the Roses is crappy game but many people will migrate there because it's fresh. If it was decent alternative to Warband, 90% of Warband's player base would migrate to it in first few days.

I support Thomek's idea but I fear it's too late. The longer I'm absent from the servers, less desire I have to ever come back. When a player sever last link (these forums) he's gone for good.

Face it, this mod is OLD.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 10:16:25 pm by Leshma »

Offline oprah_winfrey

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #34 on: September 25, 2012, 10:12:07 pm »
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This isn't year 2010. and native seems rather dead. cRPG is going there as well.

Game is awfully outdated and many people got sick of it because they've seen it all.

War of the Roses is crappy game but many people will migrate there because it's fresh. If it was decent alternative to Warband, 90% of Warband's player base would migrate to it in first few days.

I support Thomek's idea but I fear it's too late. The longer I'm absent from the servers, less desire I have to ever come back. When a player severe last link (these forums) he's gone for good.

Face it, this mod is OLD.

Retire.

Offline Leshma

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #35 on: September 25, 2012, 10:14:32 pm »
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That means I'll be on top of nerd list until this mod finally shuts down.

Offline oprah_winfrey

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #36 on: September 25, 2012, 10:16:06 pm »
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That means I'll be on top of nerd list until this mod finally shuts down.

If you don't want to be on the nerd list just hit respec A LOT.

Offline Teeth

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #37 on: September 25, 2012, 10:18:07 pm »
+1
Takes away a part of what seperates crpg from native (not all ofc)
The crap part, which leaves us with Native with better balance and customizable characters, perfection.

Offline Mlekce

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #38 on: September 25, 2012, 10:23:40 pm »
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Teeth that would be shitty mod to play.
You would play it for like 2 moths and get boored and quit it. Grind and looms are reason why everyone play this,you remove it and mod will be dead.

Offline Haboe

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #39 on: September 25, 2012, 10:25:48 pm »
+2
The crap part, which leaves us with Native with better balance and customizable characters, perfection.

But crpg players dont want only balanced builds. They wanna have 13 ps, or 10 ath because its fun or their playstyle, someothing native doesnt have.
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Offline phrstbrn

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #40 on: September 25, 2012, 10:29:01 pm »
+5
I'm coming at this as a new player, so my theory-crafting might be all wrong on this.  I don't think giving new players free heirloom points will solve anything.

Perhaps the problem is being looked at the wrong way.  I'm looking at the gear and there is no reason to use +1 looms.  The bonus going from +0 to +1 is tiny, +1 to +2 is bigger, +2 to +3 is even bigger.  So of course anybody with all +3 gear is going to completely outclass anybody in something less.  Give the gear diminishing returns for looming, so the +1 items are actually viable items.  So instead of running around with 1 +3 item for min maxing purposes, you'll run around with 3 +1 items.  And since the difference between the +3 and +1 gear has shrunk, there is less of a curve between those with all +3 looms and those who are running around with +1 and +2 looms.  New players are still boned, but at least their first few loom points will help close that gap much quicker, by Gen 5 they'd be in a pretty good place, mostly +1 armor a +1 weapon.

As an example, take any armor piece, instead of giving +1, +3, +5 armor bonuses, give as +3, +4, +5 bonuses.  Lordly armor would stay the same, but the gap between Thick and Lordly would shink.

As of right now, there is no reason why I'd want anything other than a +3 chest.  Why use a +1 chest, +1 boots, and +1 gloves to get a measly +3b/+1l armor, when I can just wear a +3 chest and get +5b/+5l.  With the proposed values, you're looking at +6b/+6l if you wore those same 3 +1 looms.

If you want to fix the gap between fresh players and those running around with looms, then just nerf those +2 and +3 looms altogether to bring their bonuses down across the board.

Offline Kafein

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #41 on: September 25, 2012, 10:37:55 pm »
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Again you fail to get the point.

1. This is not supposed to cater towards people who love super-challenging games. It's about catching NEW players and making them STAY. This is not happening at the moment if you look at the servers.

I'm not worried they will have an "easy" time, because they won't. cRPG now is more hardcore than ever.

2. Don't compare when you and me and most vets started playing.. Sure battlefield was uneven, but skill levels were not even near what they are now. The average player at EU1 now would beat most top players back then.

Sure gear or levels won't help them much, but i.ex start at lvl 25 would make them get their first loompoint faster and they wouldn't have to experience being a useless peasant until 2nd gen. I honestly don't see the problem with this.


cRPG still has level differences, luring players in by making them think there aren't any probably isn't a good idea.

However, the level 25 thing seems ok. But that means new players will actually "learn" the game later on.



Making the game more "noob-friendly" shouldn't default to "erasing the grind aspects". People have varied opinions about grind, but I think it is important that anytime on the battlefield, there are people that have better stats and people that have worse stats (note : this is not really linked to grind, as an example in some FPS games you have a "mutant" mode where one guy is uber powerful and each other player has to kill the mutant to become the next one). The generation system was introduced so that high level players would go back to level 1 willingly, exchanging roles with players of lower levels. I think that's a very good idea, but the incentives for generation grinding were too high. It's totally possible to fix that.

Ideas :

1) No more gen xp bonus, each gen should actually be longer (or just equal in duration) than the previous one. E.g. the level requirement could increase.
2) A generation should give more diverse long term bonuses. They can be cosmetic like titles, banners or exclusive armor skins. They can also take the form of LPs or unlocking skill cappers.
3) The LP system could be so much better. If weapons could be more freely customised, there would be a real depth and variety to it. Imagine improving you weapon speed, weight and damage separatedly.
4) Skill cappers : Imagine that as a gen 1 character, you cannot invest more than X skill points in any given skill, and each generation lets you go one point further than that in one or a couple of skills you choose. That would force people that want lots of specialisation to retire. Also, switching classes when retiring wouldn't be that easy, but still possible.
5) Improving your equipment should be enough of a motivation to retire as soon as you reach the requirements. To keep people from going high level, equipment pieces should be upgradeable much much further than just putting 3 LP in them. Of course further improving your already improved equipment would mean spending more loom points to get the same stats increments.
6) Smoother xp curve, people should be more or less equally spread among levels


As a result, even hardcore grinders would go back to peasantdom regularly, this allowing them to craft unique items with the LP they make through retiring, and unlocking more extreme builds.

Offline Teeth

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2012, 10:40:04 pm »
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But crpg players dont want only balanced builds. They wanna have 13 ps, or 10 ath because its fun or their playstyle, someothing native doesnt have.

The crap part, which leaves us with Native with better balance and customizable characters, perfection.
Customizable characters as in customizable builds as well, just with a fixed level. Just like lvl 30 builds now for example, but without having to grind to 30 or having the ability to go above it. Perfectly balanced aswell.

Teeth that would be shitty mod to play.
You would play it for like 2 moths and get boored and quit it. Grind and looms are reason why everyone play this,you remove it and mod will be dead.
I haven't gotten a single loom for a year now and I am still here. I love the gameplay, fuck the grind, stopped retiring as soon as I had all the looms I really needed.

Offline Mlekce

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #43 on: September 25, 2012, 11:07:29 pm »
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Yeah teeth but you use chase looms,you have full set mw,while i have only shield,wepaon and light armor mw.
You rolled all gens like a boss,and i rolled like a shitty peasant,first 7 gens my gear cost was under 15k. Now it is arround 30k or lower.
Is it fair to me to be equal with newbie or called stupid because i grinded and suffered to get this shit looms that doesn't realy get me any advatage?
I like the idea that we could maybie get some points instead of looms after we retire that we can invest in any stat we want for our weapon or armor to upgrade.
Stuff should stay as it is now,with gen exp bonueses,and looms. Ppl who grinded and suffered should be rewarded and should have advantage over ppl who starded to play yesterday. End of story.

Offline Teeth

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Re: Give free untradable loompoints to new players.
« Reply #44 on: September 25, 2012, 11:46:01 pm »
+1
Yeah teeth but you use chase looms,you have full set mw,while i have only shield,wepaon and light armor mw.
You rolled all gens like a boss,and i rolled like a shitty peasant,first 7 gens my gear cost was under 15k. Now it is arround 30k or lower.
Is it fair to me to be equal with newbie or called stupid because i grinded and suffered to get this shit looms that doesn't realy get me any advatage?
I like the idea that we could maybie get some points instead of looms after we retire that we can invest in any stat we want for our weapon or armor to upgrade.
Stuff should stay as it is now,with gen exp bonueses,and looms. Ppl who grinded and suffered should be rewarded and should have advantage over ppl who starded to play yesterday. End of story.
There is loads of stuff in our bank, if you want to borrow something just ask Schmatso :p. I only have 3 MW's myself and that is all I need. If you feel like you suffered while grinding, how can you say that grinding and looms should stay? Only because you are too selfish to lose them now if they get removed altogether? You would be equal with everyone else, no one would have any advantage over anyone apart from skill. Would be awesome in my opinion.