How to make archery more fun for everyone

[karasu]

Slot system and wpf requirements/repairs killed hybrids. I was one back then, carrying a longsword doing fine. Now is just meh..

[Kafein]

Much of this problem is caused by the simple fact that min-maxing melee equals STR+plate crutching 2h/pole and min-maxing ranged equals AGI+0 weight malus armor crutching with just the necessary strength to use a rus bow.

[Kajia]

Slot system and wpf requirements/repairs killed hybrids. I was one back then, carrying a longsword doing fine. Now is just meh..

^ this

i feel over-regulation, like forcing weapons into slots, is killing it.

my suggestions would be:
# make running speed and/or accelerating harder with huge weapons (longbow/rusbow will have a devastating impact on the archers speed, but to be fair, twohanded and polearms would have that factor increased too)
# make it as logical as possible, how many stuff you can carry and how you carry it - that is for example:
   - only one stack of arrows
   - increase sheathing time for melee weps, so if in this case a runner wants to turn around and take his bow again, it will take some time to put his sword away
# in return: make taking bows from the ground more easy! arrows should stay on the character! (this might encourage longbow/rusbow/yumi/bow* users to drop it for a second, to fight in melee and take it again afterwards without the arrow-sorting part)  (* these are the ones that are biggest and have no sheath = running would be harder)

& get rid of slots.

[Piok]

Reduce their accuracy. They will need go closer and miss more often. They will have same problems like infantry all time hearing hooves so they cannot predict if it is friend or foe.
Also I think about removal of damage dependent on wpf only Pd should matter for better hybridisation.

[Adamar]

Reduce their accuracy. They will need go closer and miss more often. They will have same problems like infantry all time hearing hooves so they cannot predict if it is friend or foe.
Also I think about removal of damage dependent on wpf only Pd should matter for better hybridisation.

More randomness and less range makes the class pointless.

[Shub]

i disagree with free melee slot . slots are the basis of this mechanic system. If u wanna give free slot to archers u would have to give free slot to ALL.

so i would prefer my suggestions  and probably  some other ppl too:

- drastically decrease speed with BOW OUT
- reduce armor weight penalties for med and high armors to speed.

solved.

[Adamar]

I think he meant having one of the existing slots be melee exclusive for archers, which would limit an archers's choices, but encourage melee. Noone is giving free slots to anyone.

-drastically decreasing the speed with bow out will punish armor users, because armor already makes you slower. So, reducing the accuracy penalties from wearing armor to a bearable extent, will free archers to replace kiting with melee while being able to shoot properly with the best bows.

Just nerfing the class wont do.

[MrShine]

People are going to play to their character's strengths.

Saying that an archer should put points into power strike is just like saying infantry should put points into shield - both can do it but they need to sacrifice something else.  For an archer that something could be health, speed, or accuracy.  For an infantry that more often means health or slight weapon speed (WM) which let's be honest doesn't mean as much.

The problem is it will be very difficult to find that 'fine line' to give archers melee capability.  If they are too effective people will scream for nerfs (like that would be anything different).  If they are not effective enough archers will just stick with their strength - shooting.

A bunch of archers against 1 infantry at the end of a round sucks sure, but it usually has the exact same outcome as if 1 infantry is against a bunch of other infantry, or cav, or whatever.  In fact at the end of a round if it's an even battle between archers and infantry it seems like they tend to split who comes out victorious, especially if one of the infantry is a shielder (at that point in the round archers have very few arrows). 

I really don't think kiting is that much of a problem.  The runners become easy picking for cav or other ranged players, and if you're that worried about it you can always wait for flags.

[Leshma]

i disagree with free melee slot . slots are the basis of this mechanic system.

Depends what slots you're talking about. Four weapon slots are warband default but items taking more than one slot is something exclusive to cRPG and there was a time when we played without it and I loved that time.

In my eyes both slot system and non-sheatable tag will remain bad changes. Realistic, maybe. Somewhat good for balance, maybe. Pain in the ass, that's for sure.

[Haboe]

Depends what slots you're talking about. Four weapon slots are warband default but items taking more than one slot is something exclusive to cRPG and there was a time when we played without it and I loved that time.

In my eyes both slot system and non-sheatable tag will remain bad changes. Realistic, maybe. Somewhat good for balance, maybe. Pain in the ass, that's for sure.

well its good for balance.
In the old days i ran around with my flamberge (sheatable) and 6 trowing lances (yes they were stacks of 2 back then). same with archers then, most had a sword of cookies or tears (german and danish for the new players) as their sidearm.

[Shub]

I think he meant having one of the existing slots be melee exclusive for archers, which would limit an archers's choices, but encourage melee. Noone is giving free slots to anyone.

-drastically decreasing the speed with bow out will punish armor users, because armor already makes you slower. So, reducing the accuracy penalties from wearing armor to a bearable extent, will free archers to replace kiting with melee while being able to shoot properly with the best bows.

Just nerfing the class wont do.

Thats why i wrote Reduce armor penalty(for mid and heavy armor)  in second paragraph . changes has to be complex. (weird that ppl select what they want from posts or threads and comment it. )
There is a thread i have made ( even before this one was created) suggesting very similar changes . http://forum.meleegaming.com/suggestions-corner/i-think-this-is-solution-to-archery-balancing/

for the sake of discussion i think one thread is enough.

[Vodner]

Reduce their accuracy. They will need go closer and miss more often. They will have same problems like infantry all time hearing hooves so they cannot predict if it is friend or foe.

That would remove the only difference between a good archer and a bad one.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

Slot system and wpf requirements/repairs killed hybrids.

Bullshiieet.

[Cup1d]

Slot system and wpf requirements/repairs killed hybrids. I was one back then, carrying a longsword doing fine. Now is just meh..

I don't care about wpf requirements for repairs, but slot system is really bad decision. Nonsheatable weapons can be a better solution.

Technically - all weapons that do not have a sheat must be nonsheatable. I mean all this danish\german gayswords, poleaxes and sci-fi shit like great mauls must be nonsheatable but take only 1 slot in your inventory.

[Shub]

Cupid idea is interesting , but more relevant to hybrid topic .We want to solve close combat kitting here.