What has cRPG come to?

[CrazyCracka420]

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I do think of cav lancer fighting in c-rpg as very much like WWII dog fighting, but on a 2d plane versus 3d (if I'm going up against other horsemen).  I feel more like a cheetah when I'm picking off stragglers, and like a German Panther tank when flanking enemy infantry that are engaged with my infantry.

I'll bite anyways.   I am fully confident on the ground in my ability to not get steamrolled or put myself in a terrible position (tactically).  And just because I choose to take the class that is the most like a carnivorous predator IRL, that doesn't mean I don't understand other dynamics between classes. 

[Arn_Magnusson]

When I placed you by my finger what I'm tryin' to say, you no longer want to speak about it, huh?

[CrazyCracka420]

When I placed you by my finger what I'm tryin' to say, you no longer want to speak about it, huh?

That's not what I want out of the game.  I'd rather not dumb every game down into arcade mode.  Your clarification merits no response.  You want to be able to run around by yourself without thinking about what other people (on your team and the enemy team) are doing in the server, and not worry about repercussions for being oblivious to your surroundings.  I'd rather not play that type of game, but War of the Roses sounds like just what you're looking for.  http://forum.meleegaming.com/war-of-the-roses/

[Swaggart]

And just because I choose to take the class that is the most like a carnivorous predator IRL, that doesn't mean I don't understand other dynamics between classes.

So do rapists and murderers.

Just sayin'.

[CrazyCracka420]

And they are very efficient at what they do

[Aleskander]

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I do think of cav lancer fighting in c-rpg as very much like WWII dog fighting, but on a 2d plane versus 3d (if I'm going up against other horsemen).  I feel more like a cheetah when I'm picking off stragglers, and like a German Panther tank when flanking enemy infantry that are engaged with my infantry.

I'll bite anyways.   I am fully confident on the ground in my ability to not get steamrolled or put myself in a terrible position (tactically).  And just because I choose to take the class that is the most like a carnivorous predator IRL, that doesn't mean I don't understand other dynamics between classes.

Wow, I've been thinking the same thing with the dogfighting for, well as long as I can remember playing cav

[Ubereem]

this why I prefer siege as infantry still rules. the only downside is everyone is 30-3

[Spleen]

this why I prefer siege as infantry still rules. the only downside is everyone is 30-3

You're clearly NA

[Bryggan]

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I do think of cav lancer fighting in c-rpg as very much like WWII dog fighting, but on a 2d plane versus 3d (if I'm going up against other horsemen).  I feel more like a cheetah when I'm picking off stragglers, and like a German Panther tank when flanking enemy infantry that are engaged with my infantry.
 

Smart cav works with infantry, ie trying to draw enemy cav to friendly infantry.  In your terms, engaging the enemy near your flak guns.  When you have hoplites and throwers near you, an enemy cav can't concentrate on you alone.  I remember begging cav in chat to stay close to where the anti-cav infantry was, and preferably draw them nearer.  Unfortunately most were 'Maverick' types, and we lost the anti-cav advantage.

But my Gawd, when we took out the enemy cav and marched forward... downright glorious.  As a useless hybrid at melee even I had the joy of chasing down the enemy who ran only to be lanced by our victorious cav.  We won the good fight, and, well, they reaped the benefits.  They had the glory but i had a multiplyer. 

The truly sad thing was while it was so obvious cav kicked meg-ass with infantry/archer support, stupid rambo cav wouldn't glom onto the idea.  It really sucked while us support infantry were stuck in a field whilst our cav charged far our of our support range.  And while anti-cav are good at anti cavving, we can't win without cav support.  4 or 5 cav can flank us and really fuck us up, something they can't do with a couple friendly cav supporting us.

So once again, it all comes down to stupid people being stupid.  And WTF can we do about that?

[Oberyn]

I usually play cav as a lone "rambo", and though it sometimes ends up as pointless kamikaze charges, a lot of the time I will fuck up a lot of their cav then proceed to rape their infantry, gaining precious cav superiority for the team. What you call "smart" cav are usually random noobs too afraid to face off directly against other cav on their own because they know they will get slaughtered, so they hang around big inf formations being useless arrow fodder. Every moment you are not harassing or hunting down enemy cav is one more moment they are able to do it to you and your buddies.
The most important role of lancer cav imo is to hunt down other melee cav and gain that cav superiority, not try to play combined arms with a bunch of unorganized pubbers. That's well and fine once the enemy cav is already neutralized. Being a slightly unpredictable free atom on the battlefield has gained me more multipliers than I can count, so my idea of it is probably somewhat biased, just as yours is, coming apparently from an inf perspective.

[Bryggan]

True, but in my inf perspective that guy who's too afraid to charge us guys hanging in the back, and is too frightened to engage our cav is extremely annoying.  He's not getting kills or doing damage, but he's still a threat and we just want him dead so we can move on.  If he's keeping 2 archers a hoplite and a thrower out of the main mob, he's being effective.  Probably more effective than if he actually tried something, because, as you say, he's probably noob and has a big target on his forehead.

Truth is I usually get impatient with those 'outside the circle' dancers, and just try catch up with the pub mob.  And then, when I get horse bumped to death (cuz this guy can't aim a lance) I run to the forums and write a 'nerf cav' thread.

Oh, but I lost my train of thought thinking of your random noobs.

I was thinking if you have a proper cav fight, why not do it where you have some archers, hoplites and throwers?  Just like smart inf try to fight in areas with archer support, smart cav fight around some ground support.  I have no problem being horse bumped by friendly cav, cuz I know how hard it is to focus on where you're going while your engaging enemy cav.  The thing is that it's just as hard for the enemy to concentrate, but the difference is I'm gonna throw a jarid in his face before he horse bumps me... or a hoplite will bring him to a full stop so you can lance him, or the archer will prick him full of holes.

I guess the obvious thing is that you're better off surrounded by friends than by enemies.  Once the enemy cav is neutralized, then you can be the lone 'Rambo'.  All of us ground troop hate that when we know our cav is all gone but there's a few enemy cav popping in and out.  Odds are I'm so worried about cav that a 2 hander will jump out of the shadows and 1 hit me.

So I say, bitch about cav as much as you want, they sure make the game a lot more interesting.  Not archers though.  Took a body shot with light kuyak today.  If it wasn't for the stun I wouldn't have noticed my 4% health drop.

[BranStark]

I believe all problems stem from the Courser and the Arabian.

Remove those two from the game and you'll see a lot of stuff fall back into line because everything that happens with infantry and ranged is a reaction to loomed coursers and arabians (mostly coursers).

After your 25th time being lanced in the back by a horse that's so fast you had no chance to hear it coming, you start thinking about things like spears.

After your 25th time being lanced in the back by a horse that's so fast you had no chance to hear it coming while trying to stab some other horse that simply stayed out of range of your spear, you start thinking about things like ranged.

So you either give up entirely and pick up a bow so you can hide in a tower and shoot horses or else you at least pick up power throw 4 so you can throw axes at horses, which I can tell you is WAY more effective than trying to spear them (good cav easily avoid spears but avoiding throwing means staying 50 meters away at all times).

The people who toughed it out and stayed infantry are now being shot and axed to death by ranged attacks that were originally picked up to be used on horses.  When there's no horses around, you use it on infantry instead.  These remaining infantry, tired of being peppered by ranged, will either go cav or ranged.  (They may briefly try shield only to realize it leaves them nearly defenseless against cav.)


I think if the best horse was the Destrier, you wouldn't see this cascade of failure occur because destriers aren't so awesome-fast or awesome-maneuverable to just make infantry give up.

The refusal to nerf coursers and arabians means this mod can never really find a balance.



Incidentally, what's up with horse acceleration in cRPG?  I was noticing in single player native, if you ram your horse into a crowd of people you're liable to grind to a halt.  cRPG seems to slow you down too but you recover speed so fast that unless you jam your horse into a smashed crowd of 10 infantry, you'll hit 1 and have your speed back before you hit the 2nd one, 5 feet further in.  Consequently you can ram through formations in cRPG that you would never attempt in native. Combine that with loomed courser speed and it's generally a free lance and a free getaway.

How the fuck is this being downvoted.

[Thomek]

How the fuck is this being downvoted.

Scary answer: Cav and ranged are now becoming the majority.

But yeah, horse acceleration nerf is a very, very good idea.

[Leshma]

Cav and ranged aren't majority, far from it.

What happened is that infantry went to play siege and some are most of the time on DTV/Duel servers.

Horse acceleration nerf is a bad idea.

Good idea is to buff infantry movement speed.

[Joker86]

Good idea is to buff infantry movement speed.

Archery = infantry + bows. Buffing infantry speed would buff archer speed, unless you make bows have 50+ weight...