So people I don't know say he was out of line, and only people he knows supported his process. I think you need to re-read that thread, all of it. It was a blatant TK as shown by the chat logs. Also a member of KUTT said "really?", as one would say in awe of what just happened. First Smooth ignores the active chat, I guess I should highlight things for you guys? Second, instead of saying ok he is banned for blatantly TKing you but who were you kicking, he starts to question me and assume a lot of information.
While indicative of teamkilling behavior, it wasn't necessarily condemning. I don't see how you can be so appalled by an admin actually trying to uncover more facts before issuing a punishment.
I
did re-read that thread. The chat logs show intent, sure, but your screenshot was small and difficult to read, you can't assume Smoothrich can actually see that well, he's an old fogey, you're the one assuming information now!*
*this was a joke, sorryIs that in this process you refer to, assume information not present? So he doesn't believe me, but yet he wants the full story form the person he doesn't believe?
He could have believed you up until you refused to present information and started your accusations. At first, all that could be seen was a screenshot of Sigvard teamwounding you twice (the second one killing you), Sigvard saying "quit kicking him you fuck" barely legible (which could have happened any time after you had the chat log open, since it isn't scrolled properly.), and you saying "Intentional TK." and nothing else in the thread.
He errs on the side of caution, says something as an example of what might have happened and you immediately took an incredulous stance to the way Smoothrich was handling the situation. His next statement was
merely a question about the incident and you
refuse to answer it while insisting it's the same as a previous experience you'd had where
you were the one breaking the rules (which an admin was online to witness) on another server.
This is where Smoothrich returns your attitude to you, and you start to accuse him of being biased. You start (and continue without ceasing) to say he assumes information, but you've been the one withholding it the whole time. The hell do you expect?
If you want to sit there and say well we can't punish people on one report, then LOOK IN THE FUCKING LOGS instead of questioning my integrity OR approach it from a neutral position(ie "Ok he is banned for TKing you but explain who was kicking who and why"). Yet you want to sit here and say "well you went on the defensive". NO SHIT?!
The logs aren't updated constantly for the NA admins. We
can't check them constantly since they might not be up to date. I'm fairly certain that approaching it from a neutral position isn't to assume guilt just because you're so adamant about it, it's to weight both sides of what might have happened and decide it based on evidence, some of which you
intentionally refused to give out. You tried to brush off the question "Quit kicking who, exactly?" as if it wasn't pertinent information, when in fact it dealt directly with what had happened. He TKed you because you kicked some guy,
that's proof that he was deserving of a ban, not because he had two teamwounds on you and an out of context statement shown together in one screenshot. Your persistent belligerence towards Smoothrich did not help your case.
Also you also say "well kicking slides so often" and "it has little impact on the game" yet his first response is to question the kicking being mentioned in the chat log versus dealing with the blatant TK. Once again, here you are wondering why I got so defensive?! I don't give a fuck if people kick me unless it is harming me either, so yes I got defensive. You are being MASSIVELY contradicting right now.
It's against the rules, it's against the rules, it's against the rules. You're missing the point of what I said. I was describing why it can go unchecked. If nobody's complaining about it, we can't always do anything about it. I'm not saying it's okay that it slides, just that when it happens it is hard to notice sometimes.
The guy I actually kicked lied, saying "you guys actually hurt me" when I know GranPappy searched the logs and found NOTHING. He wants to say he took 2 crossbow bolts from the HX that can 2shot me in high end medium armor with 5 IF. Yet he claims he was and getting hurt by our kicks? Sure that TOTALLY adds up as well. He also had a shield on so he wasn't str stacking to live through the bolts. Could he possibly hit the M button, take screens, and get me banned? Instead it somehow provokes his teammate to TK me.
Ban people without evidence? Canary when you TW it SHOWS IT TO THE SERVER. 30s in a round, 2 TW reports pop up and you want to say there is no evidence? When I was kicked off the bridge it showed a teamate headshotting me, and in chat he says "SORRY I COULDNT RESIST". But NO THATS NOT EVIDENCE. What the FUCK are you looking for then? So situations where an admin is present always dictate a warning first? Why was I not warned when I TK'd badplayer? I was instantly banned without warning, and smooth saw the whole thing.
It does not display teamwounds in the logs unless they result in a kill or get reported. Reports do not always display to admins. I had to ask you for a name when you were kicked twice at spawn, and I issued a warning because I couldn't see the reports. I don't know anything about the instance where you got kicked off a bridge. I am also not responsible for the judgments of other admins, though I will defend them, in most cases. It's up to the discretion of an admin what the punishment will be for a particular person in a particular situation based on the severity of the circumstances and the people involved.
Excuse me? I didn't know asking for bans when being intentionally TK'd was overkill.
It isn't. Sigvard got banned, in case you forgot.
Where am I asking for a week ban anywhere?
Right here:
Thats why I say a penalty range. Intentional TK 24hr-week based on situation and regular occurance.
I will be in awe if you dont ban him for a week.
I'm not saying that Sigvard's was a small infraction, but it
was his first offense. You were subject to different rules when Smoothrich banned you before that because it was on a different server with different rules (and different people in charge of unbanning).
I wouldn't be offended if someone kicked me 3x in a closed building with full armor on, no. Now if they kicked me off of a bridge, yes I would be. If they kicked me out into the enemy infantry, I would be. If it had harmed me in any way, I may be offended. Once again, Granpappy checked the logs, your little friend is a liar so maybe you need to check your own company.
Just because you wouldn't be offended doesn't mean he wasn't. Just because he didn't report the teamwounds doesn't mean they didn't deal damage. Teamwounds don't show up in the logs unless reported or if they result in a kill. At this point it's your word versus his, and I think it's time we stop retreading this specific issue, since it's already been dealt with.
I'm surprised by how scathing your accusations can be, it's no wonder people don't take you as seriously as you'd like.
I'm not asking for you to police constantly but when something as blatant as kicking/killing a player off the bridge and saying "I COULDNT RESIST" or two TWs pop up in the first 30 seconds of a map, yes I think something other than a warning needs to be issued. What is that inconsistent with what I've asked? How is that not blatant evidence of griefing? Also I want to see this official process if you want to PM it to me.
Once more: Teamwound reports don't always show up for admins. I don't know about the incident with the bridge, but the admins available seemed to have handled it (unless that person teamkilled again after being warned).
You don't always give us the evidence we need. You want us to ban people without actually looking into things, apparently, and I for one will not do that. You presume we can do
far more than we actually can, and that we see much more than we actually see.
On top of which, we do sometimes like to play the game ourselves, so I apologize if some of your messages to I-chat go unheeded, but it can be hard to respond to every issue in a timely fashion without turning ourselves into leechers.
