Strategus item&gold reset - new game variables

[Kalam]

Both is fine, full wipe or 'half' wipe, we all knew it was coming soon any way.

[a_bear_irl]

Why not a proportional reduction of gold/items? Keep enough gear to equip your troops up to a max of 3 times over and enough gold to pay for upkeep for a a week or so. Aside from people who got "hit" by the retreating bug, nobody I've seen is running around with a ton of items relative to their troop numbers.

This way it doesn't really screw anyone over and clans who didn't benefit from the retreat bug shouldn't be hit too hard.

[SPQR]

From the sounds of how it works it will be 1 gold at x2, 2 gold a ticka t x3, 3 gold at x4, adn 4 gold at x5.  Probably changing gold production on strategus too, so essentially it gold will become very very scarce, but you may be able to actually manufacture equipment in fiefs now.  Full wipe would make some sense, especially for the smaller landless clans.

Long term, unless Working in fiefs is removed won't this mean that landless clans are going to be completely absolutely unable to get enough money for anything once all the fiefs are taken? Most clans do not allow random clanless players into their fiefs.

[chadz]

Now that I have a bit more time:

- why are you wiping gold and items?
first, it's not really a good solution, i think we can all agree. A full wipe would be fairer. However, a full wipe is currently not possible.
Also, the reason for the wipe is not (only) the current bug. I actually planned item&gold wipe before, and now that this happened it's a perfect situation to combine it.

- so why are you wiping it!!?!!
because of a new game mechanic. The new gold income is lowered drastically (before: crpggold/20, now: crpggold/50-1). the reason is that gold should be, for now, earned in strategus, not by grinding. People kicked everyone out of their fief because they gave a rats ass about the money, they wanted the troops. making it unplayable for people without fiefs.

- why should that change?
by lowering the grind income, people have to consider how to make money within strategus. Which means working, raiding, fief visitor fee, etc. Overall, gold will be lower, which also means lower tier equipment and less troops. Troop cost will be increased too - probably heavily, whatever that means, we'll see.

- why is a full wipe not possible?
because it would take too long to see any kind of results. right now is the perfect stage to test things for the gameplay. and i cant wipe strategus any time i'm testing new values. it usually goes like this: when possible, change on the fly. when that would substantially make it unfair for certain groups, do a semi wipe. when it's broken beyond fixability, do a full wipe.
doing no wipe now would mean that those who stashed cash up to now would be really unreachable by those who would have to start getting gold now. doing a full wipe would mean it would take months to see how the values turn out. and they will probably be adapted soon again, hopefully(and probably) without the need for a semi wipe or a full wipe.

-why aren't you giving people resources to test stuff?
it's not just about the battles, those are working very good, i think. what i'm trying to tinker with now is the amount of gold(=items) and troops people can and want to bring to skirmishes. i can only test that with a semi-real world, like we have in strategus. giving or taking resources would totally influence this balance.

-why aren't you testing stuff before releasing.
the entire QA department is on vacation. on a more serious note, you cannot test strategus with a small team, and I currently don't have the time to set up a proper test world. there is only the real strategus. I know many of you think this is the worst strategus EVER. Bug ridden, unplayable, you never know what bug or exploit will screw your entire plans over. From a dev point of view, I can say this is the best round ever. Every bug found is one less in the next strategus. And damn we've fixed a lot of bugs. Lots of code was rewritten in the backend, and if it goes on like this, strategus will be (breaking)bugfree soon. And then you will understand why the current round is so important.

Some of you get annoyed by bugs, you think "wtf? another bug? learn2code noob!". But the way I see it is actually: "yay, another bug found! means one less to worry about next round!". Try thinking of it this way: there's x number of bugs in strategus. Once all are found, the game is bugfree. So every reported bug brings the game forward, not backwards. also, please, report bugs in the strategus issue forum with a descriptive title. It often happens that the entire community knows a bug apart from me, because people talk about it on TS or skype or whatever, but no one tells me, or just drops a line in irc which will get overlooked 80% of the time. If it's not in the strategus issue forum, chances are I don't know about it. Many thanks to the guys who keep reporting bugs, it's really appreciated. Special thanks to kesh here who gave many detailed reports so far, and the more detailed the report is, the faster the bug is fixed.

Long story short: if you're just here to play and can't accept setbacks, better sit out and wait for some time. There will be a real strategus up, and it will be as polished as possible. I know it's sometimes frustrating, I thank you for dealing with this - and me. I'm trying to put as much work into this game as possible, and I am not really a person with a lot of free time. For all those who are willing to sit this through - I thank you very much for your participation, I really rely on it and your continuous bug reports. They not only help, they are the columns of my work. Without it, strat would never be in a playable state. I promise I will try to keep the current strat as playable as possible for you, and the next strat as awesome as possible.

[Ujin]

I think a full wipe is more proper (as in proper for THIS Strat's competetive factor and overall fairness) due to many reasons, one of them is highlighted in the topic Meow started (some clans using multiple accounts and account sharing to get extra troops). But we can understand that you want to test as many things as possible to make preparations for the "real" Strategus. I think i can speak for everyone when i say we all hope it wont take years of waiting =).

[Cicero]

Now that I have a bit more time:

- why are you wiping gold and items?
first, it's not really a good solution, i think we can all agree. A full wipe would be fairer. However, a full wipe is currently not possible.
Also, the reason for the wipe is not (only) the current bug. I actually planned item&gold wipe before, and now that this happened it's a perfect situation to combine it.

- so why are you wiping it!!?!!
because of a new game mechanic. The new gold income is lowered drastically (before: crpggold/20, now: crpggold/50-1). the reason is that gold should be, for now, earned in strategus, not by grinding. People kicked everyone out of their fief because they gave a rats ass about the money, they wanted the troops. making it unplayable for people without fiefs.

- why should that change?
by lowering the grind income, people have to consider how to make money within strategus. Which means working, raiding, fief visitor fee, etc. Overall, gold will be lower, which also means lower tier equipment and less troops. Troop cost will be increased too - probably heavily, whatever that means, we'll see.

- why is a full wipe not possible?
because it would take too long to see any kind of results. right now is the perfect stage to test things for the gameplay. and i cant wipe strategus any time i'm testing new values. it usually goes like this: when possible, change on the fly. when that would substantially make it unfair for certain groups, do a semi wipe. when it's broken beyond fixability, do a full wipe.
doing no wipe now would mean that those who stashed cash up to now would be really unreachable by those who would have to start getting gold now. doing a full wipe would mean it would take months to see how the values turn out. and they will probably be adapted soon again, hopefully(and probably) without the need for a semi wipe or a full wipe.

-why aren't you giving people resources to test stuff?
it's not just about the battles, those are working very good, i think. what i'm trying to tinker with now is the amount of gold(=items) and troops people can and want to bring to skirmishes. i can only test that with a semi-real world, like we have in strategus. giving or taking resources would totally influence this balance.

-why aren't you testing stuff before releasing.
the entire QA department is on vacation. on a more serious note, you cannot test strategus with a small team, and I currently don't have the time to set up a proper test world. there is only the real strategus. I know many of you think this is the worst strategus EVER. Bug ridden, unplayable, you never know what bug or exploit will screw your entire plans over. From a dev point of view, I can say this is the best round ever. Every bug found is one less in the next strategus. And damn we've fixed a lot of bugs. Lots of code was rewritten in the backend, and if it goes on like this, strategus will be (breaking)bugfree soon. And then you will understand why the current round is so important.

Some of you get annoyed by bugs, you think "wtf? another bug? learn2code noob!". But the way I see it is actually: "yay, another bug found! means one less to worry about next round!". Try thinking of it this way: there's x number of bugs in strategus. Once all are found, the game is bugfree. So every reported bug brings the game forward, not backwards. also, please, report bugs in the strategus issue forum with a descriptive title. It often happens that the entire community knows a bug apart from me, because people talk about it on TS or skype or whatever, but no one tells me, or just drops a line in irc which will get overlooked 80% of the time. If it's not in the strategus issue forum, chances are I don't know about it. Many thanks to the guys who keep reporting bugs, it's really appreciated. Special thanks to kesh here who gave many detailed reports so far, and the more detailed the report is, the faster the bug is fixed.

Long story short: if you're just here to play and can't accept setbacks, better sit out and wait for some time. There will be a real strategus up, and it will be as polished as possible. I know it's sometimes frustrating, I thank you for dealing with this - and me. I'm trying to put as much work into this game as possible, and I am not really a person with a lot of free time. For all those who are willing to sit this through - I thank you very much for your participation, I really rely on it and your continuous bug reports. They not only help, they are the columns of my work. Without it, strat would never be in a playable state. I promise I will try to keep the current strat as playable as possible for you, and the next strat as awesome as possible.

finally a logical reply from chadz now we can understand your point.We are not gonna play strategus serious.Only thing we gonna do is try to fight and have fun and report bugs.So multi account and bla bla is free cos i dont think people gonna spend their time to get troops from people ( like steam message skype ts > member no:1 send your troops to fief , member no:2 send your  gold ) .

[SeQuel]

Long story short: if you're just here to play and can't accept setbacks, better sit out and wait for some time. There will be a real strategus up, and it will be as polished as possible. I know it's sometimes frustrating, I thank you for dealing with this - and me. I'm trying to put as much work into this game as possible, and I am not really a person with a lot of free time. For all those who are willing to sit this through - I thank you very much for your participation, I really rely on it and your continuous bug reports. They not only help, they are the columns of my work. Without it, strat would never be in a playable state. I promise I will try to keep the current strat as playable as possible for you, and the next strat as awesome as possible.

I'm impressed chadz, keep up the good work. It's good to see the more serious side of you every now and then.

[Dasty]

This all looks good, the only problem I see with the new gold system is that you have clans with 100+ members who don't even have to play cRPG to gain gold or troops. Smaller, highly active clans simply can't compete with the resource production of large, less active clans. This was a problem before the upcoming wipe and I think it will only get worse with the new system.

[chadz]

That's true, and we're trying to find a solution to this.

[Darkkarma]

You'd dare try and curve the military strength of the LLJK/DRZ/GREY warmachine?!

[Tears of Destiny]

Right in the middle of The Great Calradian War, lmao ahahahahaha

I love chadz.


EDIT:
Only player items and such reset, right?

Dear chadz, if I say give a neutral city 60,000 gold, since it is not a player owned city, does this mean that it will keep the gold? So, say... theoretically, if a neutral city in the middle of someone elses territory were to recieve a bajillion itmes, tens of thousands of troops, and a few million gold, will it stay, since it is neutral?

[Cicero]

The point this mod has been beta for 2 years.

[Sharky]

because of a new game mechanic. The new gold income is lowered drastically (before: crpggold/20, now: crpggold/50-1). the reason is that gold should be, for now, earned in strategus, not by grinding. People kicked everyone out of their fief because they gave a rats ass about the money, they wanted the troops. making it unplayable for people without fiefs.

- why should that change?
by lowering the grind income, people have to consider how to make money within strategus. Which means working, raiding, fief visitor fee, etc. Overall, gold will be lower, which also means lower tier equipment and less troops. Troop cost will be increased too - probably heavily, whatever that means, we'll see.

Try to implement crafting caravans complex trading, in short an economic system similar (but hopefully better and more complex) of M&B Single Player, otherwise it will change little since alone or low rank guys will not have anything interesting to do anyway.
The only barely useful thing an unclanned guy can do atm is to just earn Strategus money in a town and sell it to some faction in exchange of Crpg money  . But since money earn in most town is low i don't think the benefits overcome the costs (contacting other clans, meet at a fixed hour since the guys have to do shitloads of clumsy trading both on strat and on crpg marketplace, and also have to press the allow trasfer button)
And the low ranks in a clan just have to work 24/24 in your fiefs to support the village lord or work in a town and dump the gold in your faction fiefs.

Strategus now is really boring if you are not a clan leader or an high rank, and i think now that it's harder to use lame mass puppetting of their clanmembers or fake accounts, i think we'll see a lot less activity in strat, with a lot more bored people teleported to merc lands because of inactivity.

[Digglez]

This all looks good, the only problem I see with the new gold system is that you have clans with 100+ members who don't even have to play cRPG to gain gold or troops. Smaller, highly active clans simply can't compete with the resource production of large, less active clans. This was a problem before the upcoming wipe and I think it will only get worse with the new system.

Very good point.  Personally I think doing well in cRPG should be more rewarding than sitting in a town doing nothing.

[roymorrison]

I can't wait for the gold nerf.  Now we won't even be able to afford the cheap ass armor we used to wear, making archers even better in strat.  Getting shot to death in spawn for 90 minutes or however long a battle lasts is fun and satisfying.