Crossbow Needs love.

[SharpG]

More requirements? Haha.
Crossbows were designed for the battle-retarded in the Medieval Era.

You pulled back a string and pulled a lever. Is that too hard?

First off, using real life analogies for game balance is absolutely fail. That's exactly like saying "How hard is it to notch an arrow and pull the string back?". The reason crossbows should have more requirements is because it allows them to be buffed without the hybrid classes having access to them.

In my honest opinion, its not the damage that plagues the crossbow, its the incredibly long reload time (Now you may say, use the light crossbow! But even it's reload time in proportion to it's damage is rather poor). Heroin was talking about how anything above 40 armor takes 2 shots from his double heirloomed sniper xbow. This is perfectly fine, but paired with an incredibly long reload time and a chance to miss which results in most likely NOT scoring a kill which is fine FOR A HYBRID CLASS, not a dedicated crossbowman. The process of aiming..firing..reloading..aiming..firing with a sniper crossbow takes close to 20 seconds, to further continue, shields completely negate crossbows (Which they should, its one of their main counters).

Crossbows (Especially the sniper crossbow) with added requirements that a hybrid can't effectively reach paired with a decreased reloading time would probably make a dedicated crossbow class a far more viable option.

Sounds good, people getting to the top with just a ranged weapon would, well, prompt everyone to go for one.

Couldn't you say the same about a 2H sword or ANY other weapon, I'm not sure why ranged classes should be punished and not have the same chance to be succeeded with.

[Noble Crassius]

You've never tried to shoot a bow have you? it's pretty difficult lol

[ShinySpoons]

Since xbow's don't need skill points investment they lend themselves very well to hybrid builds. At least 100 wpf and you're good to go. A truly dedicated xbowman imo is more of a just for fun build than something really effective.

The only problem I have with xbow's is the massive drop off of dmg when shooting at range.

[Heroin]

The only problem I have with xbow's is the massive drop off of dmg when shooting at range.

Agreed.

[Tai Feng]

shields completely negate crossbows (Which they should, its one of their main counters).

Actually, one of the key things that made crossbows different from bows: shield penetration.
In Native, it works fine. In cRPG, it does not. Everyone has huscarl shield since it's affordable. Or some other shield that is simply too strong. So crossbow penetration is something I never see in cRPG (but correct me if I'm wrong). I quite liked this feature, it was fun.

[Greziz]

Back when the sniper xbow did 100 dmg you would occasionally pierce the mighty huscarl it was rare but if you masterworked your xbow like I used to have with alot of wpf it seemed to happen about 1 outta 3 tries for me. Now I am lucky if I pierce the lowly 1-2 skill point shields.

[Tai Feng]

nvm

[Darkkarma]

In my opinion xbows are fine and there is no reason to change their statistics. I play as crossbowman and my well made sniper crossbow is deadly. After patch there's a lot of fun because they are much more accurate than before and there is no problem to headshot someone and a lot of people (more than half) are dead after one shot in chest

This won't hold up to anyone with a decent amount of iron flesh and armor. One-shotting level 1-15's is one thing. But as for my character, who is a dedicated Crossbowoman with 150 WPF and using a well-made sniper Xbow with steel bolts, fighting people around my level and doing what you're describing is a bit unrealistic; especially with as many hybrid throwers as there are now. Also, if you don't have at least 130+ WPF in XBOW don't expect to hit anything that's not directly in front of you or a good distance away from you which is probably one of the most frustrating things in the world if you're using a sniper bow. It also doesn't even stand close to throwing right now.



 If not a ridiculous distance away(which greatly drops off the damage), i'm lucky if I get two shots off in battle(assuming the enemy won't come directly after me,if they do, it's one shot and then to melee mode or keep running away until they lose interest.) even then, at very close range,a thrower with a decent amount of PT/ items like jarids can match me(if not out do me) in damage. Did I mention that they can jump and throw with a good amount of accuracy as well? Lets also not forget that many of those higher level items such as jarids,throwing lances and throwing spears all get bonuses against shields. Also, the top level throwing item is nearly half the price of the top crossbow. Finally, lets not forget  the fact that they can use shields while throwing. Given all of this, I rhetorically ask what on earth makes crossbows seem like a practical or even smart alternative to any semi-serious player?  In fact, were it not for the fact that heirlooming the sniper bow brings it close to it's pre-patch stats, i'd probably follow suit and go with throwing. Frankly, i'd be ok with the way bows/crossbows are now if throwing was brought back into check a bit. As they are now, crossbows are impractical in most scenarios unless the player really knows what they are doing, and even then an experienced thrower will usually best them.

I say either show the bow some love, or bring throwing down a bit.

[Tai Feng]

Crossbows won't suddenly become good even if you totally remove throwing. I fail to see the connection. It will only decrease diversity like we had months ago so we'll have archers.. and mmm that's it for ranged (throwing lance anime users are now rare because of upkeep).


Crossbow has no niche right now (except roleplay). I can't think of a single situation where I'd want a crossbowman in my team instead of something else.

[Noble Crassius]

Make PT decrease or do nothing for accuracy. The 0 wpf throwers are just basically enjoying the pre-patch crossbow with 10x the shoot speed.

[Magikarp]

At least they need to fix the stupid delay bug, I hate it when that happens!

[Vance]

I want a close range heavy sidearm that requires preparation.

Maybe make the sniper/siege reload for longer, do more damage, start out less accurate and perhaps weigh more.

[Darkkarma]

Crossbows won't suddenly become good even if you totally remove throwing. I fail to see the connection. It will only decrease diversity like we had months ago so we'll have archers.. and mmm that's it for ranged (throwing lance anime users are now rare because of upkeep).


Crossbow has no niche right now (except roleplay). I can't think of a single situation where I'd want a crossbowman in my team instead of something else.

You actually hit on the connection I was talking about perfectly. Throwing makes crossbows and even bows in many cases impractical. If they nerfed throwing, they(crossbows)wouldn't become good or godlike like they were before. I don't want that at all, but one ranged alternative shouldn't totally make the other two useless. We saw a similar thing before back with crossbows pre-patch, and that bothered me alot. I don't want throwing nerfed into oblivion, but when a guy who's 20 feet away can do just as much damage from one throwing spear while jumping  as a sniper crossbow from the same range, something is wrong; terribly,terribly wrong.

[Tai Feng]

I agree that range of some throws is way too long. As a matter of fact I brought that out months ago, and when I do kill at such range I make "Olympic throw!" comment in game chat ;)  The fact that throwing weapon cause higher damage than siege crossbow, is also sad.

But you're missing one thing: throwing is more fun. It's more dynamic. It should be natural weapon for melee character. Not bow or xbow as a backup. In this patch at least that works as intended. In previous patch, infantry had xbows as a backup weapon, and throwing was usually present in the form of anime-lance. A melee player with throwing is still a melee player. A melee player with xbow turns into xbowmen.

[Vexus]

Crossbow prices NEEDS to go down! 593 upkeep from the heavy crossbow is too much add on 100 from steel bolts 1 or 2 a weapon and armour it's costing too much for dedicated crossbowmen like my alt and now wpf means something not like before and it's damage is no longer OP.