cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Beauchamp on April 23, 2012, 02:07:52 pm

Title: make horses more expensive
Post by: Beauchamp on April 23, 2012, 02:07:52 pm
there are to many of them, i'd make those cheaper ones (rouncey, steppe, desert, courser, arab) more expensive.
i don't care about heavy ones, those may as well stay the same.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: karasu on April 23, 2012, 02:15:16 pm
   No matter how expensive you make a class, money is something easy to achieve, either by market playing, selling loompoints ( !! ), etc.

   If someone wants to play cav, he will, this same situation happened with archery. Guess what? Nothing changed. Archerfest 24/7, even if paying every round for both stacks (aka 600+ gold).

   Two options here: team play with proper pikemen, or try Siege for a change.  :wink:


I'll leave the "its named MOUNT and blade" card for the raging incoming replies.  :oops:
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Ronin on April 23, 2012, 02:16:30 pm
it's named MOUNT and Blade
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Beauchamp on April 23, 2012, 02:22:06 pm
aye but its not called MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and BLADE  :)

like there are 1/4 of cav on servers  because of archery nerf... we traded devil for satan...
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: karasu on April 23, 2012, 02:23:53 pm
Horses are still getting shot down to easily by those who know how to. My champ destrier got 1 shot in the legs by a 1h p.e.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Ronin on April 23, 2012, 02:28:31 pm
aye but its not called MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and BLADE  :)

like there are 1/4 of cav on servers  because of archery nerf... we traded devil for satan...
You said it yourself. It is now 25% MOUNT and 75% BLADE already. So it is like MOUNT and BLADE and BLADE and BLADE or so. You want it to become BLADE and BLADE and... eeh screw it already. You get it. My answer is, I'm afraid, no.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Gnjus on April 23, 2012, 03:01:01 pm
The only solution for not seeing horses, tincans & arbalesters for some time is full database wipe and since it's not gonna happen every other suggestion is futile, especially the price raising. People are rich in this mod, they need to be striped of everything they own, it would be glorious for a change. Fresh start and equal odds for all, no matter how long ago you started playing. In other words:
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Life on April 23, 2012, 03:05:03 pm
i would actually LOVE to have the whole game wiped- a fresh start on everything. Although that wont happen cause of many reasons, one being that the community cannot afford to lose even MORE members or else cRPG would just... die.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Vibe on April 23, 2012, 03:09:44 pm
Not going to help.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Beauchamp on April 23, 2012, 03:16:07 pm
i wouldn't even mind to buff horses if they'd cost WAY more. my problem is not with MOUNT part of the game, my problem actually is with the ammount of that MOUNT.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: _Tak_ on April 23, 2012, 03:23:49 pm
so much horse haters ....
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Kafein on April 23, 2012, 03:53:48 pm
I kind of agree about the large number of cavs on servers. It used to be much easier for a cav like me to get cheap kills back when there was no other cav on the team that would spot the same opportunity at the same time (=> lots of direct or indirect unintentional teamharm). Now when I see a good and squishy unaware enemy, I have to watch on all sides making sure there is no ally or enemy cav that will block me (or that I will block, or both) on my way to my cheap kill.

That is not wrong per se, but a few noobish cav really can ruin it.

On a brighter note, bringing a pike for anticav purposes is now more profitable, which is a good thing.


I'd prefer if we reduced the incentives for cav without touching upkeep (because that pisses off 1st gen newcomers) and without bluntly nerfing the class, because it doesn't need it. Cav needs a rebalance, but not really a buff or a nerf. I know some cav players have ideas to make the class more skill-based and they should be listened to. Less raw damage, more speed and maneuver. Full lance angle but fixing the block hitboxes on horseback... Horse fall damage and reverting the leg damage bonus...
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Beauchamp on April 23, 2012, 04:55:39 pm
so much horse haters ....

i have nothing against them, the only thing i dislike is there are to many of them.

in general i wouldn't mind horses to be even way stronger (more HPs, way more charge damage), but way more expensive at the same time resulting in less people taking them. i kinda feel this is how it should be - horsman to be the elite class available only to a few individuals (for example to those that sacrifice/sell their looms).

now it almost feels like in native, spawn as swadian horseman and rock the server...
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Torben on April 23, 2012, 05:02:42 pm
I agree.  I would like to see a horse being so expensive that one can only ride it every ten rounds or so,  and in return see them buffed a lot
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Tavuk_Bey on April 23, 2012, 05:20:28 pm
fuck mount and bump, too many noobs riding around makes me puke
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Tomas_of_Miles on April 23, 2012, 05:39:58 pm
I agree.  I would like to see a horse being so expensive that one can only ride it every ten rounds or so,  and in return see them buffed a lot
Surely that would split the population into those who can indefinitely afford the newer OP horses and those who would have to grind beyond all reason.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Lichen on April 23, 2012, 05:56:48 pm
The only solution for not seeing horses, tincans & arbalesters for some time is full database wipe and since it's not gonna happen every other suggestion is futile, especially the price raising. People are rich in this mod, they need to be striped of everything they own, it would be glorious for a change. Fresh start and equal odds for all, no matter how long ago you started playing.
That's not really a 'solution'. More like a temporary 'make people feel good' measure. The game can never be 'equal' because players aren't equal in how much time they play and or skill they have. Also why can players buy anything they want just after a short time playing? Things aren't that expensive is why so let's make them more expensive. Ok, but oh yeah people don't want that either cause it 'punishes' new players. Why not just do what some of you seem to want and limit how much gold people can have so nobody is capable of being rich? That's really the only 'solution' that will satisfy the whiners. Just make the limit 50,000 gold. Problem solved. Then when you see players in expensive gear at least you can take satisfaction in knowing they will be going broke soon.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Gnjus on April 23, 2012, 06:08:00 pm
That's not really a 'solution'. More like a temporary 'make people feel good' measure.

Yes, i called it a temporary solution up there, still better then nothing. Game needs refreshment and what better way of making it uber-interesting again then a new version of bug/cheater-ridden Strategos accompanied by a full database wipe so we're all peasants again ? Would take ages to get into the current state again, ages of uber-interesting cRPG. Not that it's gonna happen but a man can dream all he wants and share his dreams with others. This dream would solve more then half of "suggestions" in this sub-forum for some time to come, at least they wouldn't need to "invent" things to balance it out, it would balance itself that way. :wink:
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Torben on April 23, 2012, 06:12:14 pm
Yes, i called it a temporary solution up there, still better then nothing. Game needs refreshment and what better way of making it uber-interesting again then a new version of bug/cheater-ridden Strategos accompanied by a full database wipe so we're all peasants again ? Would take ages to get into the current state again, ages of uber-interesting cRPG. Not that it's gonna happen but a man can dream all he wants and share his dreams with others. This dream would solve more then half of "suggestions" in this sub-forum for some time to come, at least they wouldn't need to "invent" things to balance it out, it would balance itself that way. :wink:

ya i would wate with a whipe till the new strat comes up.  more peasant fights n such : )
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Spanish on April 23, 2012, 06:40:35 pm
Ugh rather you just wipe the game and make me start over again then raise the price of horses even after selling looms it costs so much money -_-
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Lichen on April 23, 2012, 06:45:24 pm
Yes, i called it a temporary solution up there, still better then nothing. Game needs refreshment and what better way of making it uber-interesting again then a new version of bug/cheater-ridden Strategos accompanied by a full database wipe so we're all peasants again ? Would take ages to get into the current state again, ages of uber-interesting cRPG. Not that it's gonna happen but a man can dream all he wants and share his dreams with others. This dream would solve more then half of "suggestions" in this sub-forum for some time to come, at least they wouldn't need to "invent" things to balance it out, it would balance itself that way. :wink:
Full database wipe would guarantee many longtime players would simply leave the mod or just troll since they no longer care anymore. Great way to ruin a mod though.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on April 23, 2012, 06:54:49 pm
aye but its not called MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and MOUNT and BLADE  :)

like there are 1/4 of cav on servers  because of archery nerf... we traded devil for satan...

You think cavalry making up 1/4 of an army is too much?  Let's say you have a 100 many army, how would your classes be broken down?

I'd say 1/4 to 1/5th of your army being cavalry is a good number.  You could even go as high as 1/3.  Most battles took place in open terrain (hills, valleys, clearings near forests, etc).  Unless you plan on hiding in the forest or the top of a large hill and playing defensively the whole time, you're going to need some mobile attack units.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Vexus on April 23, 2012, 06:57:31 pm
If there would be a full wipe I don't know if I would be playing the game much.

The game is already too grindy for lower gen players and some of the old players where able to avoid it thanks to their high generations before the change.

Don't think it's a good idea, why not try making the horses slower when they are damaged? I believe if that would be in the game people (Ranged) would finally start aiming at the fucking horses instead of the players 24/7.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Molly on April 23, 2012, 07:01:05 pm
Full database wipe would guarantee many longtime players would simply leave the mod or just troll since they no longer care anymore. Great way to ruin a mod though.
Still, a full wipe seems to be the only reasonable solution to a lot of problems the game has atm.
It's not just the huge amount of cav on the server but the huge amount of ranged too. And I am not just talking about archers who at least have to spend some points into PD. But 50% of the melee people running around with a crossbow on their back...

Yesterday Meow was proud to be leading the scoreboard on a full EU1 with 13:1 (or similiar) as an archer with 4 PD. When I asked him, and I even said I wasn't trying to troll but dead serious, if he thinks it's okay that a support class which shoots like a machinegun is leading the scoreboard, I was just ignored...
Playing melee w/o shield just isnt really fun anymore. You can't have a nice fight, lasting for... let's say 20 seconds, w/o getting shot at or bumped/couched/lanced in the back. It really takes a lot of fun out of the game.

I don't like the idea of nerfing those classes but I think there has to be something done to limit them somehow.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Torben on April 23, 2012, 07:05:29 pm
words

in what way would a whpe help with this?  furthermore,  on a BATTLEserver,  anything but teamwork will lead to a clusterfuck,  in which everyone will be shot and bumped to pieces.
the game is actually fine,  it just cant live up to its potential if some phase doesnt command ^^
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Kafein on April 23, 2012, 07:06:38 pm
Nobody commenting on not changing the upkeep but rebalancing the class in a more skill-based way ?
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Molly on April 23, 2012, 07:08:15 pm
Nobody commenting on not changing the upkeep but rebalancing the class in a more skill-based way ?
I don't think that this would help to lower the amount of cav. Maybe less lancer and more HA/HX and that's not desirable.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Life on April 23, 2012, 07:10:30 pm
You can't have a nice fight, lasting for... let's say 20 seconds, w/o getting shot at or bumped/couched/lanced in the back. It really takes a lot of fun out of the game.

Go to duel.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Kafein on April 23, 2012, 07:12:23 pm
I don't think that this would help to lower the amount of cav. Maybe less lancer and more HA/HX and that's not desirable.

I'm sure it would be one of the (unwanted) side effects, but we can treat that problem separately. There's already a MOTF fix (I don't know whether it's in the latest patch or still in development, but it's there) that will hopefully make the central grief against mounted ranged dissappear.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Torben on April 23, 2012, 07:13:39 pm
Nobody commenting on not changing the upkeep but rebalancing the class in a more skill-based way ?

I´d love to see that, we however had a lot of threads concerning it...  not sure it will happen
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Gnjus on April 23, 2012, 07:17:01 pm
Full database wipe would guarantee many longtime players would simply leave the mod or just troll since they no longer care anymore. Great way to ruin a mod though.

Don't know if anyone told you yet but.....this has been done a few times in the past, each time "legends" & "veterans" threatened to GTX but they're all still here plus thousands of new players who came after. And i never said just "wipe it as it is"......the key words are "new vastly improved Strat & Battle servers, ridden of game-breaking/ruining bugs" and stuff like that.
Anyways - it's just an idea nothing more, everyone is entitled to his own opinion on how to change situation for the better, you don't have to agree with it.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Lactose_the_intolerant on April 23, 2012, 07:36:25 pm
i tend to think that being a hybrid cav is the most effective hybrid there can be. invest 6 points in riding  and there you go zooming across the battlefield with a horse that does really good bump damage and backstab all the way. You dont feel like playing cav or need to save up? well you can go on foot and be as decent as any infantry out.

If you see a hybrid thrower, he has to invest those 6 pt, a decent amount of wpf and wear light armor in order to be less impact then cav on the battlefield.

Maybe cav doesnt require enough build sacrifices? is cav to easy to acces for someone who has a loose skill? Just tossing some ideas in
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: _Tak_ on April 23, 2012, 07:38:35 pm
Quote
Nobody commenting on not changing the upkeep but rebalancing the class in a more skill-based way ?

Cav is now skill base because all horse can die from 1 hit now, which means when you want to attack you have to think twice than before, and try not get get leg damage from melee.

Edit: All Cav can now only backstab and cannot fully engage infantry because that is just too risky, skill based now
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on April 23, 2012, 07:54:12 pm
i tend to think that being a hybrid cav is the most effective hybrid there can be. invest 6 points in riding  and there you go zooming across the battlefield with a horse that does really good bump damage and backstab all the way. You dont feel like playing cav or need to save up? well you can go on foot and be as decent as any infantry out.

If you see a hybrid thrower, he has to invest those 6 pt, a decent amount of wpf and wear light armor in order to be less impact then cav on the battlefield.

Maybe cav doesnt require enough build sacrifices? is cav to easy to acces for someone who has a loose skill? Just tossing some ideas in

I don't think so.  As infantry you'd be a lot better off being 24/15 than being 18/18 footman who is hybrid cavalry. 
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Lactose_the_intolerant on April 23, 2012, 08:04:59 pm
I don't think so.  As infantry you'd be a lot better off being 24/15 than being 18/18 footman who is hybrid cavalry.

you'd be better off, of course, to be a pure inf build. but if your good enough you can still top the scoreboards
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Chagan_Arslan on April 23, 2012, 08:06:22 pm
make cav duels more fun and skill based

some time ago the cav duels were the thing to do for a good cav, now they most would rather go for inf rather than get dehorsed

yeah i know mind = blown
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Son Of Odin on April 23, 2012, 08:10:23 pm
It's only temporary... Just let me visit EU1 couple times and dehorse all new cav. It won't be long until they rage respec into pikemen :DD.
Title: Re: make horses more expensive
Post by: Lichen on April 23, 2012, 11:03:24 pm
Don't know if anyone told you yet but.....this has been done a few times in the past, each time "legends" & "veterans" threatened to GTX but they're all still here plus thousands of new players who came after. And i never said just "wipe it as it is"......the key words are "new vastly improved Strat & Battle servers, ridden of game-breaking/ruining bugs" and stuff like that.
Anyways - it's just an idea nothing more, everyone is entitled to his own opinion on how to change situation for the better, you don't have to agree with it.
Well, I happen to think the devs put a lot more thought into balancing the mod than some of you may think. What's the problem here? (specifically to the OP)  Horses aren't expensive enough? Ok, double the price, In fact double the price on ALL high end gear as well. I won't whine and I don't have hardly any gold (anymore). I even gave some of it away cause I was feeling charitable. So 'make horses more expensive'? Sure, also make high end gear more expensive. Also reduce gold for high level gens and increase for low level. What else can be done to help the helpless?