cRPG
cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Slev23 on March 12, 2012, 11:50:00 pm
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CRPG is aptly named, because it's not meant for casual players. If you aren't in Chaos, or KUTT, or ATS, or Occitan, don't play. There might be some people who are fine having a 1x multi, or who are fine to just banner swap to whatever clan is winning. I'm not, I just want to play the game, but it doesn't matter, because one of those 4 clans will be controlling the multi, it's too bad all the servers use banner balance, but obviously the game is for the 10 or so clans that have lots of members. Don't need to pub a game that doesn't reward you if you don't join one of 5 clans.
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And somehow you always get placed on the team that is not has a good clan on it?
Regardless, banner balance needs a change, preferably one that takes the banner part out.
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There are some EU servers without banner balance, dunno about NA though. They are probably also not that crowded. :/
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Yup, I'm a recruit for invicti and our banner is always opposite the big clans and we usually at most have 8 or 9 people on, it's rare that we force a multi, but, if Occitan is on for instance, you know they're running the multi.
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This may be true for you, but I never have problems getting a multi facing off against chaos or ats(quite the contrary with KUTT or Occitan by the way, every time I find myself on one of their teams it's almost a certain x1). Maybe you should take initiative and start picking off their good players. If you are an archer, and see a tin can like Serge with a naked peasant with practice sword behind him, shoot serge.
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I run BRD banner and other then the few who play occasionally we ain't no active clan like Chaos and I get x5 perfectly fine.
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well, I love big clan it's funny to be on their team, and whne on opposite... try to make them loose the GTX are always fuunny thing to watch :twisted:
for the record I'm the only NA guy of my clan but I wear the same banner of KUTT (I got banner pack so my banner is a cool pig they use native and their is an horrible bear...)
they are part of game and you gotta use this to enjoy the game more : maybe you'll get x1 often when on opposite, but that x2 will be yummy!!
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Perhaps we should just limit banner-balance to aim for collections of players, rather than having all members of a clan be on one team. This would mean that, if there are 7 members of clan X on at a time, then there'd likely be 4 members on one side and three on another. I'd like this.
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Clans are sometimes problematic because they make it harder for you to target the real threats. Clans that play on pub servers usually aren't much more organised than the pubbies, but the clan players are simply better.
I think I have a pretty good W/L ratio currently, with a banner barely used by anyone. I'm not teamswitched with clans, but I'm not glued to noobs either that way.
In the end it all comes down to how the autobalance takes the actual performances of the teams into account.
Perhaps we should just limit banner-balance to aim for collections of players, rather than having all members of a clan be on one team. This would mean that, if there are 7 members of clan X on at a time, then there'd likely be 4 members on one side and three on another. I'd like this.
That's the worst possible situation for a 7 member clan. And pretty much the reason why banner balance was added.
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I roll random-banner and get 5x ocassionally too, but sure as hell don't get to roll 5x the MAJORITY of the time. Big difference.
It's far from balanced as is.
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I did find that once I started rolling with the Hospis that I got more x5s going but it wasn't any huge increase on when I had it set to auto banner.
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I think the biggest detriment to your x5 is picking a banner used by below average people, as even the good clans can have their players picked off or mobbed. The problem is that people with less kills tend to get moved to the losing team as it tries to stack so many players that the losing team can mob the winning team, what ends up happening is the really good players just get more slag to kill. If you have the same banner as people with terrible kill ratios it tends to keep you with them.
If it was perfect at balancing you'd rarely get a x5 any ways.
On a side note it takes 3 arbalest shots from medium range to kill serge (not heirloomed). You'd probably do better killing his team mates so that he gets mobbed.
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I run BRD banner and other then the few who play occasionally we ain't no active clan like Chaos and I get x5 perfectly fine.
this
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Communism-RPG.
Fear not proletariat worker! We have your interests at heart!
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Just get better and then join a clan.
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This may be true for you, but I never have problems getting a multi facing off against chaos or ats(quite the contrary with KUTT or Occitan by the way, every time I find myself on one of their teams it's almost a certain x1). Maybe you should take initiative and start picking off their good players. If you are an archer, and see a tin can like Serge with a naked peasant with practice sword behind him, shoot serge.
LOL you always use the hospy and chaos banner
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So..... change your banner to match someone you want to play with.
Lots of people do that. NH is hardly a big clan but on the days where we've brought out enough people to start rockin' a server (it often only takes like 5 or 6 people working together on voice to make a real impact), there are always cases of "which one of you is toker97? Nobody? I guess it's just someone using our banner now..."
I guess some clans hate that but I think it's a form of flattery.
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I also never understood the banner ballance thing in this mod. Isn't clan stacking a bad thing in overall warband?
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LOL you always use the hospy and chaos banner
Not that it's relevant but I have never used chaos banner and yes I fight under the hospi banner as I am a hospitaller squire
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The problem of random players is that they play on random parts of the walls most of the time while those big clans defend whatever is important on that map.
If randoms would look at the basic tactics those clans (hre included) are doing and try to play the same it wouldnt be so unbelievable easy to win the maps.
Its always a pleasure to come to flag while the whole defenderteam is still dancing on the walls.
Those clans dont even need to have the best players cause its enough to attack organised to defeat every random-team.
=> Mostly its the randoms-fault. Its not my fault or any fault of bigger clans that a lot of people dont understand basic mechanics of the game.
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Ive played solo for the first 6 months. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Now if you are picking a banner of another clan and they arent the top dog, then you are setting yourself up to lose. Might want to improve your skills and run solo, or join a real clan and try to play with them.
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well, I love big clan it's funny to be on their team, and whne on opposite... try to make them loose the GTX are always fuunny thing to watch :twisted:
for the record I'm the only NA guy of my clan but I wear the same banner of KUTT (I got banner pack so my banner is a cool pig they use native and their is an horrible bear...)
they are part of game and you gotta use this to enjoy the game more : maybe you'll get x1 often when on opposite, but that x2 will be yummy!!
We just changed to an actual banner in the banner pack. WOrking on refining it :]
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Personally, I don't understand this. I've never had a problem obtaining multipliers, whether I'm rocking a clan banner or a random one.
The almighty autobalancer rewards excellence! Spend some more time on the duel server. I guarantee you'll see more of X5 and much less X1.
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I actually maintain a BETTER multi when I dont have my faction banner on my alt most days (my alts dont all use our banner) mainly because unless 7+ of us are on or a few of the CHAOS Heroes are on, its all pubbies using our banner lately. You also have to remember we don't roll 5x for days because of the lack of banner balance on the first round and after the second.
Banner balance was included to foster more teamplay and better faction teamwork and it has succeeded. Look at Kutt, despite the armor crutching of some of their players and smaller over all numbers they are the best team-working group I've seen.
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The REAL problem here is GTX.
Somebody said the low score players get moved, this is true. However, AFTER autobalance is calculated, people are like "F THIS!" and quit. So teams might go from 40-50 to 40-44 after GTXs.
It's not the low scoring players who GTX either.
So one team loses, decent players quit, the team loses again. When people don't quit, the teams seem to be more balanced overall. So I don't think there's an actual problem with the autobalance as there is a problem with people disliking autobalance and just assuming it's not working.
Then again I was just on the battle server, our team got absolutely slaughtered (I think we killed about 5/40 of them?) and the autobalance switched 2 players (cav) off of our team in exchange for their team killers. (-1 and -2 score* -2 guy suicided I think, actually) maybe some other unnoticeable changes.
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the usual blabla.
Balance is fine, don't touch it.
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The exp system should return to the way it was in the old CRPG where nearby kills give you gold and exp.. This will encourage people to cooperate more and be closer to the battle.
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The exp system should return to the way it was in the old CRPG where nearby kills give you gold and exp.. This will encourage people to cooperate more and be closer to the battle.
It doesn't though, it just encourages small boxy maps where everyone can just line up and die as close together as possible.
Meanwhile Archers and Cav get fucked out of gold and xp.
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What's the problem? One time you're on the big clans side, one time you aren't.
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The banner balance is perfect as it is. Yes, there are a few big clans, if you're really annoyed by it feel free to change to their banner. I personally love seeing clans work together to win, even if it results in me not having a multiplier in several maps in a row. Rather that than individual-skill based wins or luck, which ends with getting to max x3, for so to fall back to x1 every third round.
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there are always cases of "which one of you is toker97? Nobody? I guess it's just someone using our banner now..."
In Chaos ts it's, "who in the hell is Bilbert?"
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I roll random-banner and get 5x ocassionally too, but sure as hell don't get to roll 5x the MAJORITY of the time. Big difference.
It's far from balanced as is.
You are right. It is far from balanced. When I was wearing the only banner in the server I'd get moved around all the time, hard to keep a multi when you're constantly going from one team to the other (maybe because I'm a kill whore on my horse...who knows).
I would sometimes roll a x5, but not like it is now that I joined and wear the Hospitaller banner. I go literally 45 minutes to an hour most nights rolling a x5. Sometimes I've rolled x5's for 3 or 4 maps, and that's not abnormal.
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shoot serge.
Also, it takes a dedicated group of players or a few individual rockstars to win maps continuously. The chance to have more of these playing together comes with being in a clan, which is one of the reasons people join them: to learn and get better, individually and in a team.
You would surprise how many people that have joined us have improved their game significantly because of it.
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Also, it takes a dedicated group of players or a few individual rockstars to win maps continuously. The chance to have more of these playing together comes with being in a clan, which is one of the reasons people join them: to learn and get better, individually and in a team.
You would surprise how many people that have joined us have improved their game significantly because of it.
+1, I'd encourage players looking to improve to join clans. Many don't mind what your skill level is! Improve in a friendly environment!
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I run around with "use faction banner" and when I'm on a roll, which doesn't happen all the time but often enough for my taste, I'll go upwards of 3-4 maps with a x5 and enough time off x1 to keep me happy. From a certain point of view I can understand the frustration though as this usually only happens when I decide to stick with the team mass with a long pointy stick and only drop to my main weapon when no one is around to help me.
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Also, it takes a dedicated group of players or a few individual rockstars to win maps continuously. The chance to have more of these playing together comes with being in a clan, which is one of the reasons people join them: to learn and get better, individually and in a team.
You would surprise how many people that have joined us have improved their game significantly because of it.
Except me, Ive regressed.
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I think overall it's fine, the balance mostly does a decent job of matching teams skillwise. Clans are slightly more likely to do smarter than things than randoms that's about it but at the end of the day it's a game of execution and even organized clans can get rolled if they slip up.
There's also usually more than one clan on at a time, and they are usually put on seperate teams so counter each other. The only other serious advantage* clans have is that when clans are on together, they tend to put on their best gear. Occitan & Hospitaller especially love to put on all their plate when they get 6-8 on together, chaos to an extent too.
*They pay for it, since it is absurdly expensive especially if they can't dominate the multi, but it will give them an edge since usually randoms are unwilling to also put on their armour.
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Meanwhile Archers and Cav get fucked out of gold and xp.
Which is how it should be because they fight from distance (cav are mostly backstabbing, no difference between them and typical archer/xbowman). High risk = high reward, low risk = low reward.
For most new players (noobs), horse compensates for lack of game knowledge (skill) and they pay gold for it. For experienced players it's different but there is far more noobs than experienced players in this game.
Out of ten situations, noob on a horse can kill me at least 3 times from behind when I'm busy with someone else. Same guy, as infantry player can kill me once if he gets lucky but odds are mostly 1/20 or 1/30.
Old exp and gold system was better imho. And trolls gain nothing out of it and that's a good thing. Current system is abusable and generates far too many leechers and other idiots who are doing nothing, except wasting other people's time.
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I like the banner balance as it is. 8-)
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Which is how it should be because they fight from distance (cav are mostly backstabbing, no difference between them and typical archer/xbowman). High risk = high reward, low risk = low reward.
For most new players (noobs), horse compensates for lack of game knowledge (skill) and they pay gold for it. For experienced players it's different but there is far more noobs than experienced players in this game.
Out of ten situations, noob on a horse can kill me at least 3 times from behind when I'm busy with someone else. Same guy, as infantry player can kill me once if he gets lucky but odds are mostly 1/20 or 1/30.
LOL @ disregarding situational awareness.
If you get hit in the back (by melee, archer or cav) you have not paid attention or got overwhelmed.
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so theirs this guy, and hes amazing. he came up with this awwweesoomee idea to fix banner balance
http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,27353.0.html
the things i would do to this man
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Some guy speaks his mind about the current Clan domination of CRPG and makes some pretty valid points (whether you agree or not) and gets shouted down by the majority of Clanned players, suprise suprise.
Not many new people coming into CRPG these days, a lot less than when i first started thats for sure, i wonder if this kind of banner abuse and general contempt that many clanned players have for casual players is part of it.
I'm not anti clan, i don't have anything to say against organised play, it can greatly help a community, but it can also harm it. "Join a clan" sentiment doesn't work here, CRPG needs casual players.
I'll get flamed to fuck for this, but who cares.
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Some guy speaks his mind about the current Clan domination of CRPG and makes some pretty valid points (whether you agree or not) and gets shouted down by the majority of Clanned players, suprise suprise.
Not many new people coming into CRPG these days, a lot less than when i first started thats for sure, i wonder if this kind of banner abuse and general contempt that many clanned players have for casual players is part of it.
I'm not anti clan, i don't have anything to say against organised play, it can greatly help a community, but it can also harm it. "Join a clan" sentiment doesn't work here, CRPG needs casual players.
I'll get flamed to fuck for this, but who cares.
the thing is that the majority of players are casual clan members that when they get on to play a few rounds, they want to play with their friends.
the people like me who play this game all the time are fine with no banner balance, many people in clans have already stated this. However pairing teamwork with the directional combat system makes the game most enjoyable for a majority of the people.
i feel banner balance has gotten better, especially on seige
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the thing is that the majority of players are casual clan members that when they get on to play a few rounds, they want to play with their friends.
the people like me who play this game all the time are fine with no banner balance, many people in clans have already stated this. However pairing teamwork with the directional combat system makes the game most enjoyable for a majority of the people.
i feel banner balance has gotten better, especially on seige
For me a casual player is someone who logs on, doesn't worry about TS, Vent or IRC, he/she doesn't really care about how the community perceives his epeen, or whatever. That percentage of the community is shrinking.
Yes, alot of clanned players fall under this category, but how long till they tire of the bullshit and leave, taking their friends with them no doubt to greener pastures.
My real point isn't really about Banner balance, (although i think its obviously open to abuse), its how the forum warriors on here react to a casual player just voicing his side of the story.
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For me a casual player is someone who logs on, doesn't worry about TS, Vent or IRC, he/she doesn't really care about how the community perceives his epeen, or whatever. That percentage of the community is shrinking.
Yes, alot of clanned players fall under this category, but how long till they tire of the bullshit and leave, taking their friends with them no doubt to greener pastures.
My real point isn't really about Banner balance, (although i think its obviously open to abuse), its how the forum warriors on here react to a casual player just voicing his side of the story.
no i understand where you are coming from completely. banner balance does not favor random pubs
however, you cant cater to the minority here
also the majority of players that come into crpg are through steam sales and we actually get alot of new guys players then
if you took off banner balance you would get even less multipliers. the teams would be too fair and you would rarely have an x3
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Use a popular banner if it is that big of a deal. Banners don't really matter anyways if you are not in a clan, so pick whatever you think will work best.
Last night on NA, communities were half full, siege was two thirds full, official battle was maxed. Playing on official battle there were clans on both side, both struggling and losing against each other regularly.
Banner balance rarely puts all clans on just one side. In my experience, things even out in the long run.
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no i understand where you are coming from completely. banner balance does not favor random pubs
however, you cant cater to the minority here
also the majority of players that come into crpg are through steam sales and we actually get alot of new guys players then
if you took off banner balance you would get even less multipliers. the teams would be too fair and you would rarely have an x3
Yes, you have a good point.
But, i don't it is catering to a minority, clanned players are just alot more vocal in voicing their opinions.
I don't think we're seeing many new players, and if we are, i don't think we're sustaining them. But thats only my observation, i don't have any access to raw data to make a full judgement.
On banner balance: Yes, less multipliers, but i don't care about multipliers, i care about whats fair and whats fun.
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On banner balance: Yes, less multipliers, but i don't care about multipliers, i care about whats fair and whats fun.
then y even bother posting? just play the game.
and i know what your going to say. clans steam roll non clans in the battle servers
if you want the answer to that you should probally re-read the thread
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then y even bother posting? just play the game.
and i know what your going to say. clans steam roll non clans in the battle servers
if you want the answer to that you should probally re-read the thread
Don't really understand what your getting at here. It's a fact that clans steamroll non clans the vast majority of times. Like i said before, i don't hold it against them for being organised, they have as much of a right to play the game the way they want as i do.
I'm not asking questions, and therefore not looking for answers. Just stating my opinion is all.
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I don't have opinions, I have answers :)
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With the fall of that SW MMO a bunch of new LLJK are moving over actually, completely new to M&B I might add.
Plus you got to consider... M&B was on steam sale, and gift codes were given away over the holidays, so that could be a contributing factor to why new additions have slowed down more recently.
I wouldn't be surprised if we get a surge of new players if/when the game goes on sale again. :mrgreen:
(a messed up banner balance system would not slow down new players from finding/joining the game, and it takes a while for new players to even figure out how things work so obviously they're not going to rage about it before they try the mod..)
Edit: Yeah I'm in a clan but my team also loses quite frequently. I get valor sometimes. Whatever. I think the autobalance system is fine on paper but not in practice, due to human error.
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im a very old CRPG fart and i dont support BB and i never will.....
But im so tired of explaining theses days and ill just rejoin chaos and get that multi madness
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Banner balance rarely puts all clans on just one side. In my experience, things even out in the long run.
It's totally random actually. Sometimes the BB seems to do nothing though. I saw battles where the top 5 of one team had more kills than the whole other team together and lolbalance was doing shit about it till 5-0. And I saw battles where BB put almost all clans in one team for a whole map, it doesn't happen that often, but it happens.
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Murm sayz no
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The balance is terrible, I am always on the losing team now unless I use the banner of a clan with alot of members on, the balance just stacks all the good clans on one side and everyone else on the other but with 5+ more players. Of course extra players is useless when they are all bad/peasants.
It gets annoying being at an almost permanent x1 even though I am doing the best out of everyone on the server.
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Its like this in every Team-game. Be it a Shooter, a Strategy-game or a PVP-MMO. The most organised team wins.
This is not a "problem". This is simply the way Team-Games work. This is no Deathmatch-Style of game. This is no Quake or Unreal-Tournament.
Don't get me wrong I would really like some Deathmatch-mode for cRPG. And if there would be one all complaints about banner-balance would be in the right. But right now we don't have Deathmatch or something similar...
Complaining about team-work in team-based modes is plain wrong.
Some peculiar people seem to have false ideas about this whole thing.
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Its like this in every Team-game. Be it a Shooter, a Strategy-game or a PVP-MMO. The most organised team wins.
This is not a "problem". This is simply the way Team-Games work. This is no Deathmatch-Style of game. This is no Quake or Unreal-Tournament.
Don't get me wrong I would really like some Deathmatch-mode for cRPG. And if there would be one all complaints about banner-balance would be in the right. But right now we don't have Deathmatch or something similar...
Complaining about team-work in team-based modes is plain wrong.
Some peculiar people seem to have false ideas about this whole thing.
Can't help feeling that if you weren't part of a clan you wouldn't be so quick to judge these "peculiar" people. It's no coincidence that both sides of the argument are split almost 50/50 based on clan membership or lack thereof.
There's team work and theres outright exploitation. You can get away with this kind of organised farming in something like an MMO, where your premade is spread amongst a massive pool of players, in CRPG it isn't, the same player base is being farmed by the same clans. Sooner or later there will be a point where this starts to hurt the community, people are already starting to get tired of this bullshit.
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Bourgeois = The system is fine, don't change it!
Proletariat = The system stinks! Change it!
In the entire history of human endeavour no one has been able to solve this problem. Good luck to a community mod for an obscure PC game.
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Can't help feeling that if you weren't part of a clan you wouldn't be so quick to judge these "peculiar" people.
Quite on the contrary. The reason i am actually in a clan was because of my Teamwork. Instead of complaining I was following some dudes on a server and try to do Teamwork with them. It never occured to me that to be succesful you have to be in a clan. And it never occured to me that not being in a clan is "underpowered". And i still think so. When some Byzants are on we still get owned if the enemy team is playing together and we do not.
Some clansmen though saw me doing teamwork and then asked me if i wanted to join them on Teamspeak to do even more effective teamwork. Hence I'm now in Byzantium.
I still think not being in a clan is perfectly viable if you do it right. But being in one makes the whole thing easier. And thats not bad. It is meant to be so.
There is team work and there is outright exploitation. You can get away with this kind of organised farming in something like an MMO, where your premade is spread amongst a massive pool of players, in CRPG it isn't, the same player base is being farmed by the same clans. Sooner or later there will be a point where this starts to hurt the community, people are already starting to get tired of this bullshit.
Like I said: You get it wrong. Doing Teamwork is the key here. This is a Teamgame. Coordinating your movements as a team is no exploiting. Its the way this game is meant to be played. If you do not like this kind of playstile I understand that fully, but then you are wrong in cRPG. You should go and play native-deathmatch then. Or one of the other mods where you are supposed to play as an individual... But even then you would not find too much of that out there. Most mods with large playerbases I know of are Team-based-modes.
And because of that there is no "exploiting" here. Not in a negative sense of "abusing the system". Because the system consists of Teamwork. People complain there are big groups of players who work together as intended by the gamemode and "break the game". Thats not true. They do just a better job of teamwork as you.
It's no coincidence that both sides of the argument are split almost 50/50 based on clan membership or lack thereof.
I will grant you the fact that opinions are based on clanmembership. But it is in no way 50/50. Most long-time-players are in clans. Thats because most players see this game as what it is. It is based on teamwork. You can teamwork better if youre communicating actively and effectively with other players. Even more with players you know. At best together on teamspeak. And that is how clans work. That is why the majority of long-time players ARE in clans.
I mean no disrespect whatsoever to you and your opinion. I loathe people who argue on the internet and get personal simply because they are anonymous and they can, but I hold the honest opinion that you are in the wrong. You simply want the mod to be played in a way it is not meant to. It seems to me there are people who refuse to see this or want it to be in another way because of personal taste.
Another thing is to me that this theme in general is just the new "argument-flavour-of-the-month."
Sometimes it is polestagger, sometimes it is Ranged sometimes 2handed, sometimes cavalry, sometimes the way you earn XP/gold.
Clans were owning uncoordinated teams since i play this game, which is since 2 years ago. Nothing happened to make this into a "problem" recently...
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Quite on the contrary. The reason i am actually in a clan was because of my Teamwork. Instead of complaining I was following some dudes on a server and try to do Teamwork with them. It never occured to me that to be succesful you have to be in a clan. And it never occured to me that not being in a clan is "underpowered". And i still think so. When some Byzants are on we still get owned if the enemy team is playing together and we do not.
Some clansmen though saw me doing teamwork and then asked me if i wanted to join them on Teamspeak to do even more effective teamwork. Hence I'm now in Byzantium.
I still think not being in a clan is perfectly viable if you do it right. But being in one makes the whole thing easier. And thats not bad. It is meant to be so.
Like I said: You get it wrong. Doing Teamwork is the key here. This is a Teamgame. Coordinating your movements as a team is no exploiting. Its the way this game is meant to be played. If you do not like this kind of playstile I understand that fully, but then you are wrong in cRPG. You should go and play native-deathmatch then. Or one of the other mods where you are supposed to play as an individual... But even then you would not find too much of that out there. Most mods with large playerbases I know of are Team-based-modes.
And because of that there is no "exploiting" here. Not in a negative sense of "abusing the system". Because the system consists of Teamwork. People complain there are big groups of players who work together as intended by the gamemode and "break the game". Thats not true. They do just a better job of teamwork as you.
I will grant you the fact that opinions are based on clanmembership. But it is in no way 50/50. Most long-time-players are in clans. Thats because most players see this game as what it is. It is based on teamwork. You can teamwork better if youre communicating actively and effectively with other players. Even more with players you know. At best together on teamspeak. And that is how clans work. That is why the majority of long-time players ARE in clans.
I mean no disrespect whatsoever to you and your opinion. I loathe people who argue on the internet and get personal simply because they are anonymous and they can, but I hold the honest opinion that you are in the wrong. You simply want the mod to be played in a way it is not meant to. It seems to me there are people who refuse to see this or want it to be in another way because of personal taste.
Another thing is to me that this theme in general is just the new "argument-flavour-of-the-month."
Sometimes it is polestagger, sometimes it is Ranged sometimes 2handed, sometimes cavalry, sometimes the way you earn XP/gold.
Clans were owning uncoordinated teams since i play this game, which is since 2 years ago. Nothing happened to make this into a "problem" recently...
God thats a long post, yes i understand where your coming from, no need to restate what you already have said in your previous post. We just won't agree unfortunately.
I do think however alot of Longtime (clanned) players are directly relating to a time when they themselves were unclanned, when dinosaurs walked the earth. CRPG has changed dramatically in recent times. I myself have been playing for nearly as long as you, unclanned, and i can honestly say its worse now than it has ever been.
I'm not arguing against your right to play the way you want, or that this game isn't based on teamwork, i just happen to believe that certain people are taking advantage of certain things, that's all.
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God thats a long post, yes i understand where your coming from, no need to restate what you already have said in your previous post. We just won't agree unfortunately.
I do think however alot of Longtime (clanned) players are directly relating to a time when they themselves were unclanned, when dinosaurs walked the earth. CRPG has changed dramatically in recent times. I myself have been playing for nearly as long as you, unclanned, and i can honestly say its worse now than it has ever been.
I'm not arguing against your right to play the way you want, or that this game isn't based on teamwork, i just happen to believe that certain people are taking advantage of certain things, that's all.
We both plus a cask of beer and maybe a bottle of Vodka/Tequila would make a great discussion round. :)
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We both plus a cask of beer and maybe a bottle of Vodka/Tequila would make a great discussion round. :)
The thing is, you can't expect teamplay if there are only single clannies or no clannies at all on a team. The players need some kind of leader and in this case this would be a group of clanplayers who show the way to go. Most of the time when one team dominates the map, the experienced players in the loosing team try to lead their team by saying "stay together and go right" or "dont split up" and things like that but it just doesn't work, because the people don't listen to them. But if you see a group of 7 or more clan players you will most likely join and follow them. So if we have team red with 2 big clans and team blue with no big clans at all, team blue is disadvantaged, because you won't see good teamplay from them. What I want to say is that clans are responsible to lead their team and BB can fuck this up by putting all clans in one team.
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oh, cRPG stands for casual RPG?? I always thought it meant chadz' RPG
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So if we have team red with 2 big clans and team blue with no big clans at all, team blue is disadvantaged, because you won't see good teamplay from them. What I want to say is that clans are responsible to lead their team and BB can fuck this up by putting all clans in one team.
You were right except that part... what could happen is the 2 big clans split up and one gets outnumbered and loses. Happens quite often with some clans. Chaos/KUTT will usually work together but there are some clans that don't like to work with CHAOS. And LLJK basically just runs off like a bunch of idiots (I know this)
But usually they do win frequently, when autobalance puts a bunch of peasants on a team to make up for the clan players especially, because decent players quit at that point. 5 peasants don't make up for 1 decent player.
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I prefer fighting against and with teams with a large proportion of clan players because there is generally more challenge and more teamwork involved in fighting a team with a solid core of players who work well together.
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I'm seeing a disconnect with all the people in this thread talking about clan teamwork, and what I actually see in battles. Which is, only a handful of clans that actually stick together for any length of time and try to use teamwork and so on. Mostly they're just as disorganized as us random pubbers, occasionally ending up near each other creating an illusion of teamwork, but not really. Just my observation. Randomers 4 lyfe. Da bears.
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I'm seeing a disconnect with all the people in this thread talking about clan teamwork, and what I actually see in battles. Which is, only a handful of clans that actually stick together for any length of time and try to use teamwork and so on. Mostly they're just as disorganized as us random pubbers, occasionally ending up near each other creating an illusion of teamwork, but not really. Just my observation. Randomers 4 lyfe. Da bears.
KUTT occasionally falls into that appearance tbh. It isn't until we have 4+ infantry men that we really organize our tactics, or unless Xeen is around. Our problem has been the amount of our roster that wanted to go to Cavalry lately like a lot of people.
But I do agree with your random disorganization, I see that a lot. A clan that works good together is a clan that can look at what they have to field and quickly organize it to fit any situation and hopefully let everyone come out alive on their side--not easy to do given the fast-paced and very-quick-to-change gameplay we're in. Any clan that can deploy that 100% of the time, my hat's off to them!
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Well... You can't really just ignore the fact that clan players, in general are better players. In a scenario where you have an almost even amount of infantry from both sides, the side with better players will usually always win the battle. Imho the team balance shouldn't be banner, and instead be based on kills achieved in a single round(CS 1.6-style). If you want to practice teamplay, go organize scrims, or have your own clan-server with BB.
Even though I'll have to add that the BB isn't the worst thing. Sometimes you're on the winning side, sometimes you're not. But those times when you're on the side that gets steamrolled 5 maps in a row. Well... It sucks.
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I'm seeing a disconnect with all the people in this thread talking about clan teamwork, and what I actually see in battles. Which is, only a handful of clans that actually stick together for any length of time and try to use teamwork and so on. Mostly they're just as disorganized as us random pubbers, occasionally ending up near each other creating an illusion of teamwork, but not really. Just my observation. Randomers 4 lyfe. Da bears.
This.
Personally I think the biggest "imbalance" from the majority of clans is not their disciplined fighting styles (which as you note, mostly don't really exist), but the fact that when they are all on together they tend to all put on heavy, expensive gear to impress their bros.
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Well... You can't really just ignore the fact that clan players, in general are better players. In a scenario where you have an almost even amount of infantry from both sides, the side with better players will usually always win the battle. Imho the team balance shouldn't be banner, and instead be based on kills achieved in a single round(CS 1.6-style). If you want to practice teamplay, go organize scrims, or have your own clan-server with BB.
Even though I'll have to add that the BB isn't the worst thing. Sometimes you're on the winning side, sometimes you're not. But those times when you're on the side that gets steamrolled 5 maps in a row. Well... It sucks.
Pretty sure BB balances by kills & banner. So if one clan is put together it will try and make sure the other side has an equally skilled group to offset that.
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Pretty sure BB balances by kills & banner. So if one clan is put together it will try and make sure the other side has an equally skilled group to offset that.
it switch me versus the clans all the time because of my high kd , working as intended.... le sigh
i did a few tests going spec to avoid the balance and rejoin after , its quite funny how the clan side lose 2 huge clanmates to compensate when i got spec
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If the teams are lop-sided enough, it will break up the banner of the the large banner on the winning team. Saw it happen where 3 of us cavalry for hospitallers were top 3 on one team and won a few rounds in a row, and then all 3 of us switched to the losing team. We of course won, and kept our x5 rolling. "Hey I gots mine, so fuck you" doesn't seem like a very convincing argument to take for team balance discussion, but hey, I'm getting my x5 so....
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it switch me versus the clans all the time because of my high kd , working as intended.... le sigh
i did a few tests going spec to avoid the balance and rejoin after , its quite funny how the clan side lose 2 huge clanmates to compensate when i got spec
this.