[Feedback] Archery / Xbow feedback thread

[Paul]

Balancers don't know that slow reload speed on XBOW increases the Shoot delay speed as well.

Noob balancers.

I think that's why we increased the specific anim duration instead in the past.

[Penitent]

I only play archer on an alt, so I don't feel like I have a lot of say -- but I do archery in RL, and some of these new bow names are dumb as hell.   Chief's bow?  CRPG is cool because the weapons and armor are based on historical examples.

There are real bow names you can use:

-Self-bow (in general, a bow made from one piece of wood)
-Flat bow (flat in cross section, unlike a longbow's "D" cross section for example. Common in the Americas, but used elsewhere.)
-Yew Bow (the best kind of wood for making long bows.  Common in continental Europe and England)
-Stick bow (a simple bow, made from a straight piece of wood)
-Sinew-backed bow (sinew increases the durability and draw strength of an all-wood bow)
-Recurve bow (a bow that curves at the tips, like the "bow" and "rus bow" do.

Let me expand on this a little bit more, because the bow names are bothering me.   

A medieval longbow is not just a "bow that is long."  It refers to a specific bow, made of one piece of wood, that has a "D" shaped profile, and that flexes through the handle.  (there is no separate handle section that stays still when it is drawn -- the entire bow flexes, including the grip.) It's usually as long as the archer is tall (5-6 feet). We have 4 bows right now called "longbow" of some sort, and some of them just aren't longbows -- and this is kind of like calling the "side sword" a "broad sword."  It's silly.

On C-rpg.net, we have:
 the "longbow" -- but this isn't a proper long bow.  It has a flat cross section, and recurved tips.  It's also short.
We have the "hunting longbow" -- but this is clearly made up of several materials, has a distinct handle, and has greatly recurved tips.
We have the "war longbow" -- the only real long bow so far
We have the "Lord longbow" -- Look like a legit longbow with some flare

Suggestions:

-"Longbow" should be "self bow".  It's a simple bow.  The old name "bow" was apt as well.
-"Hunting Longbow" should be "recurve bow" or "sinew backed bow" or "reinforced bow"
-"War longbow" should be "longbow"
-"Lord Longbow" should be "war bow" or "yew longbow" or "english longbow"

This would make it a bit more palatable and fit in with the rest of the historically named weapons and armors.

[Utrakil]

^ + a lot

[Totally Not McDeath]

I have an archer
Lvl 35
30/15
10 pd
10 ps
5 wm

I also have an xbow
18/24 arb build
6ps
6if
8ath
8wm
I have not played either character yet because if time restrictions but I already know that my arb build is scrapped. I also don't know which bow is worth it and I don't have the time to figure that out right now.

[Úlfur]

It's no use patcher don't care anyways.

Give me my looms back.

http://c-rpg.net/index.php?page=marketplacetrade&id=781252

[njames89]

Thanks for free respec. BACK TO PURE 2H WOOOOOOO

[bagge]

Why is everyone complaining?

Edit: About archery that is

[njames89]

Why is everyone complaining?

Lower ranking xbows have been ruined

[WITCHCRAFT]

First things first: please give a respec to my heavy xbow user, ISIS_WIFEY. I can't even test the new stats due to increased requirement.

Second, my archer is 18/27, 6PD, 198WPF. I can't say for sure how much the patch changed my build because I JUST got +3 bodkins. I've been using +3 tatar arrows for like 2.5 years. My 6PD rus bow changed into 4PD, but I don't think that is too much of an issue. I'm not above the PD cap. If I was str archer with 9+ PD I would be very mad.

My aim reticule is still very tight, although I can't "hold the shot" as long as before. I think this is due to the PD change, since the +3 rokusan yumi (still 6PD req) I picked up during battle still held accuracy for a long time while I aimed. The increased arrow speed makes it much easier to land a shot in close to medium range, even when the target is actively trying to dodge your shot. Long range is very hard for me... I think I just need to "re-learn" my archery to adjust for the completely different arrow trajectories now.

Also I'm getting an absolute shitload of points on my archer now. I'm not getting more kills than before, just points and valor all over the place. Is it possible that the new bow stats had an effect on the ranged scoring system?

Lower ranking xbows have been ruined

Other people are saying they have better accuracy at lower WPF, with a higher "max" accuracy. I don't know if the extended trigger release time was on purpose or just due to decreasing overall speed for longer reload time, but it took me a long time to get used to that when I started using an arbalest way back in the day.

Crossbows and bows have been completely re-done. This is not a small stat adjustment. If these changes stay, I think that all ranged players should get a free heirloom exchange. A +3 item takes a long time to make. A respec helps you test out the new stats on your bow or crossbow, but it is no longer the weapon you spent those loom points on.

Overall I think it's cool that this was all reworked. It will take time for everyone to adjust to it, even after people get their respecs and loom up the new bow that they want. There's going to be a lot of whining and tears on the way there though. Players are set in their ways after years of only minor changes to ranged.

edit:To everyone that was bitching about archery accuracy after patch:

(click to show/hide)

visitors can't see pics , please register or login

People on EU1 refused to believe I had a tight reticule.

[Richyy]

NERF

[Algarn]

First things first: please give a respec to my heavy xbow user, ISIS_WIFEY. I can't even test the new stats due to increased requirement.

Second, my archer is 18/27, 6PD, 198WPF. I can't say for sure how much the patch changed my build because I JUST got +3 bodkins. I've been using +3 tatar arrows for like 2.5 years. My 6PD rus bow changed into 4PD, but I don't think that is too much of an issue. I'm not above the PD cap. If I was str archer with 9+ PD I would be very mad.

My aim reticule is still very tight, although I can't "hold the shot" as long as before. I think this is due to the PD change, since the +3 rokusan yumi (still 6PD req) I picked up during battle still held accuracy for a long time while I aimed. The increased arrow speed makes it much easier to land a shot in close to medium range, even when the target is actively trying to dodge your shot. Long range is very hard for me... I think I just need to "re-learn" my archery to adjust for the completely different arrow trajectories now.

Also I'm getting an absolute shitload of points on my archer now. I'm not getting more kills than before, just points and valor all over the place. Is it possible that the new bow stats had an effect on the ranged scoring system?

Other people are saying they have better accuracy at lower WPF, with a higher "max" accuracy. I don't know if the extended trigger release time was on purpose or just due to decreasing overall speed for longer reload time, but it took me a long time to get used to that when I started using an arbalest way back in the day.

Crossbows and bows have been completely re-done. This is not a small stat adjustment. If these changes stay, I think that all ranged players should get a free heirloom exchange. A +3 item takes a long time to make. A respec helps you test out the new stats on your bow or crossbow, but it is no longer the weapon you spent those loom points on.

Overall I think it's cool that this was all reworked. It will take time for everyone to adjust to it, even after people get their respecs and loom up the new bow that they want. There's going to be a lot of whining and tears on the way there though. Players are set in their ways after years of only minor changes to ranged.

edit:To everyone that was bitching about archery accuracy after patch:

(click to show/hide)

visitors can't see pics , please register or login

People on EU1 refused to believe I had a tight reticule.

Try a longbow (even the first one) with maxed out PD, the result will be far from that screen. Any bow that isn't a high tier bow has superior accuracy compared to them (particularly the lord long bow), while not really losing anything upon damage, and requiring less difficulty to max the PD bonus, allowing for you to go for an hybrid, or to go for more WM.

PS : the missile speed buff is also retarded on bows, I can't believe this is even close to RL speed, the arrows are just travelling within half a second to a target at mid range.

[Kadeth]

I don't know what happened and I can't read this entire thread right now, but please tell me 1 wpf xbow is no longer viable?

[Nightingale]

I don't know what happened and I can't read this entire thread right now, but please tell me 1 wpf xbow is no longer viable?

As of right now 65-85 wpf is the equivalent of 190 wpf prepatch: higher accuracy means lower wpf being more viable. AKA, currently 1 WPF is equivalent to about 100-115 wpf pre-patch.
It's being worked on so hopefully fix soon.

[XyNox]

Can you guys at least up the accuracy value for MW bows to ( damage gain ) + 1 instead of the current ( damage gain ) - 1  as a "hotfix" before things will be sorted out ? So instead of losing accuracy when looming you would actually gain accuracy, as you would expect when improving a weapon via looms.

[Nagasoup]

REVERT THE PATCH

Please, its not even about tweaking the stats at this point. This whole change to ranged was totally uncalled for, its not a tweak, you overhauled the whole system. It's like you sink all these hours into this mod, all your characters and looms, learning all the ins and outs of your playstyle, your builds, all the subtleties of ranged combat... and then the devs just shit all over it.

If you're going to nerf ranged, nerf it, but don't change the whole system so drastically and so suddenly. Nobody asked for this kind of change. It's just like SURPRISE! Your looms? Your build? fuck you get new looms, make a new build noob. All our experience, the muscle memory we built, all our familiarity with this mod we've grown to love over the years? Fuck you, new mod, relearn everything because we say so. 

When you do this kind of change so suddenly and without good reason its just going to piss off a lot of people. People still play this mod after so many years because we've grown attached to our characters and our playstyles, and when you force people to change everything at once a lot of them will just stop playing.