Author Topic: Twohanded is so unrealistic  (Read 5731 times)

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Offline Torak

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Twohanded is so unrealistic
« on: January 08, 2011, 07:43:51 pm »
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Is it just me ho gets relly angry that you can't strike back at on a twohanden fighter even if you block whit the shield the speed is the same and even if you don't block the blows a twohanded sword is heavy and must take time to recover befor the next blow not like it is now when they swing it around like a stick
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Offline Bear

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2011, 07:57:25 pm »
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coowl story broow!

Offline Baggy

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2011, 08:02:30 pm »
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Whine whine whine...
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Offline zach

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2011, 08:04:15 pm »
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dunno mate, 2handers can still move pretty fast IRL (in real life)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ln94E9AGYTc
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Offline BlackMilk

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2011, 08:14:40 pm »
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Offline Nick_Larking

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2011, 08:28:32 pm »
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Problem is you cant block and attack at same time like you can IRL.
So with shield and 1hander you are pretty much fucked against a good 2hander.

Offline Gorath

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2011, 09:14:24 pm »
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Problem is you cant block and attack at same time like you can IRL.
So with shield and 1hander you are pretty much fucked against a good 2hander.

This is the issue.  If we're talking about real life, two handed weapons are pretty fast.  Polearm designed weapons are even faster than 2h'd swords.  However when you have a shield+1h weapon you can block and attack at the same time, as well as use the shield itself as an offensive weapon and not just some turtle wall.
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Offline gazda

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2011, 10:11:38 pm »
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first of all this is a game and it can't be made 100% realistic, but it can be made for fun

yes 2h are fast and you need to find good opportunity to counter 2h attacks if you are using 1h+shield

whats actually interesting, when i as thrower run out of ammo i often find myself picking up 2h sword even though i have 1 wpf in 2h
and even without my wpf in 2h i actually get some kills using it especially against 1h+shield. So best ways to counter a fast 2h is to do it without shield
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Offline SalmonGod

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2011, 10:49:57 pm »
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So best ways to counter a fast 2h is to do it without shield

Makes sense to me.  There should be no dominant melee class.  They each serve different purposes.

1H + Shield = wall for your teammates to hide behind, easiest survivability in large melees or against throwers/archers, must be opportunist to land blows.  Attacks are very targeted and not meant for fending off multiple opponents.  That's what the shield is for.

2H = Dominant in small skirmishes.  High damage + speed, but attacks are still quite targeted, though less so than 1H.

Polearm = High damage output and keeps enemies at a distance in large melees.  Anti-cav.  However still vulnerable (unless using a shield which robs their weapon of much speed, damage, and versatility).  Thrives on open ground in large fights against multiple opponents where they can make wide swings indiscriminately.  Loses this advantage in smaller fights or cluster fucks where they have to be careful about hitting teammates or the enemy does not and can simply block one strike and close the distance.

This is the way I think things should work, anyway.  There's also some wiggle room, where for instance some heavy 2H work more like polearms, some polearms are better for duels (Iron Staff?), etc.

I wish there was more emphasis in this game on balancing the equipment itself rather than limiting availability on a mostly linear power scale.

Offline Airith

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2011, 11:14:40 pm »
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You need to work on your timing. Although I just made a 2hander and spam the crap out of people, my 1h+shield guy usually has no problems taking out 2handers. You can attack back after they attack, you just need to have the right footwork and side to attack. A fast 1hander helps too :p
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Offline zagibu

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2011, 11:33:18 pm »
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You CAN strike back, but only if you are on a similar agi and wpf basis. Even then, you have to estimate when their blow is gonna land on your shield, and let go exactly then, or you will be too slow. Good 2hers know this and hold their strikes a third of a second longer, or do a feint first, which gets most shielders (including me).

What some shielders don't understand, is that they can easily push through the first ranks without getting hit, then turn around and do some swings on the way back. This not only gets you a kill or two, but it also disrupts enemy formations, so that following teammates can get some blows in. The best formation out of a siege tower would be 3-4 shielders followed by 2h. Shielders push through enemy ranks without striking, 2h kills those who turn around. Then shielders turn around and kill those who are still facing the 2h.
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Offline priest

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2011, 11:42:09 pm »
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dunno mate, 2handers can still move pretty fast IRL (in real life)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ln94E9AGYTc

Those are ultra light fencing  swords built for fast moving competition, not for battle.  And even if they weren't, don't confuse real life with video game balance (except for maybe things which rely upon the laws of physics).

Offline EyeBeat

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2011, 11:44:31 pm »
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Polearms are unrealistic.  The sweet spot on weapons like boulder on a stick should be further away.  If I was to work my way in and get close the sweet spot should not hit me.  I would simply be blocking the wooden party not the actual boulder therefore it should do less damage and not break through shields and blocks.

From my experience... 2 handers and polearms are not too different at all.  They should be made different.  Up the speed and range on polearms but nerf the defenses so they could not be as good as regular 2 handers for blocking.  Scale melee weapon difficulty with power strike or you can just make a separate skill for each melee type.  Power 1h, Power 2h, Power Polearm.  I think that would balance out melee a lot.
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Offline Rokem

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #13 on: January 08, 2011, 11:47:32 pm »
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You CAN strike back, but only if you are on a similar agi and wpf basis. Even then, you have to estimate when their blow is gonna land on your shield, and let go exactly then, or you will be too slow. Good 2hers know this and hold their strikes a third of a second longer, or do a feint first, which gets most shielders (including me).

What some shielders don't understand, is that they can easily push through the first ranks without getting hit, then turn around and do some swings on the way back. This not only gets you a kill or two, but it also disrupts enemy formations, so that following teammates can get some blows in. The best formation out of a siege tower would be 3-4 shielders followed by 2h. Shielders push through enemy ranks without striking, 2h kills those who turn around. Then shielders turn around and kill those who are still facing the 2h.

An extremely effective strategy if you got the right people to do it.

Offline AssPunisher

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Re: Twohanded is so unrealistic
« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2011, 11:54:51 pm »
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If 2-hander wants to hit you successfuly behind that shield he must feint to force you open AND you have to do exactly the same (feint) to trick and outswing the 2-hander. Nothing to see here... move along.