0.3.3.9.1

[Joseph Porta]

We're discussing this change in IRC and if I understood Tydeus correctly:

HA, HX and HT were too accurate before due to something with armor weight penalty not applying correctly. Now it does... That's why the reticule is bigger. For everyone I guess.

Short and incomplete answer from a dummy! 

Pras Molly 

[Gravoth_iii]

cut stabs are shit, and blunt stabs bounce most of the time 

That still doesnt make it a nerf if they actually increased the damage. The stabs arent useless either, most people never expect them.

[Macropus]

Buff polearms + range \0/

That was indeed needed.

(click to show/hide)

Sarcasm

Lol, the amount of non-shielders will go up and so will the amount of range as well and with all this, the amount of tears about range on forum will also go up.

I was right after all. They are out-phasing shields. They want it to be a duel-game where 100 shitlords running around on battlefield looking for 1vs1, no range, no cav, no shielders... Only shitlords 

I like how bitches come so quickly to complain about the changes without even knowing what the patch was about. 

[Tydeus]

IIRC, Tydeus or another balancer said that the archer WPF change would nerf archers with over 8WM, and the rest would have relatively the same accuracy.

I guess the same applies to throwing.

All ranged. Crossbows are the least affected by this with the exception of HX, but HX weren't deemed as deserving a reimbursement, which is why they weren't reimbursed. This obsolete mechanic that was removed came after the wpf per pd/pt penalties, and modified the penalized wpf amounts by a power of 1.1. Meaning that you were essentially bypassing all wpf penalties.

We did change the WPF per PD penalty, we lowered it significantly. The new formula is final wpf = (wpf - max((14(PD) - (1.35^PD) - 35),0))

Also, we're not closing the chapter on ranged item reimbursements/rebalances, but you have to balance the class before you can begin with minor item tweaks to get things where they need to be. So that is what has to be looked at now.

[Macropus]

Since Tydeus is lazy and doesn't post here.

[16:09] <Tydeus> not all archers were hit the same
[16:09] <Tydeus> the more agi focused you were
[16:09] <Tydeus> the more you were hit
[16:10] <Tydeus> 8wm is a bit lower wpf, yea
[16:10] <Tydeus> but like
[16:10] <Tydeus> 8/9/10 pd could be seen as getting a small buff from this
[16:10] <Tydeus> especially 9/10
[16:11] <Tydeus> should have also fixed 10 pd being more accurate than 9 pd
[16:11] <Tydeus> everything everyone knew about wpf
[16:11] <Tydeus> prior to this patch
[16:11] <Tydeus> is still true
[16:11] <Tydeus> the difference
[16:12] <Tydeus> is that this mechanic was hidden
[16:12] <Tydeus> no one in the community knew about it
[16:13] <Tydeus> macropus
[16:13] <Tydeus> we just removed an old mechanic
[16:13] <Tydeus> slightly lowered the wpf per pd penalty
[16:13] <Tydeus> I do not
[16:14] <Tydeus> should just make respecs more obtainable
[16:14] <Tydeus> lobby chadz/harald
[16:14] <Tydeus> do it more
[16:14] <Tydeus> and only in irc
[16:14] <Tydeus> 10 times a day
[16:14] <Tydeus> making a thread
[16:14] <Tydeus> isn't lobbying
[16:14] <Tydeus> sitting in irc
[16:14] <Tydeus> querying chadz
[16:14] <Tydeus> is lobbying
[16:14] <Tydeus> also mass pings
[16:14] <Tydeus> ping chadz 10 times dailey
[16:15] <Tydeus> with 50 other people
[16:15] <Tydeus> he'll do it simply to cease the flood of pings
[16:15] <Tydeus> you mean
[16:15] <Tydeus> a STF-Only tournament
[16:15] <Tydeus> ?
[16:15] <Tydeus> you can change your builds
[16:19] <Tydeus> about time then
[16:20] <Tydeus> imo
[16:20] <Tydeus> get more PD
[16:20] <Tydeus> it's nothing like that
[16:20] <Tydeus> because the change didn't affect builds equally
[16:21] <Tydeus> removing a exponent of 1.1 from the wpf calc
[16:21] <Tydeus> key word
[16:21] <Tydeus> being exponent
[16:21] <Tydeus> wpf^1.1
[16:22] <Tydeus> which means "hurry, I now no longer have to worry about ANY wpf penalties"
[16:22] <Tydeus> that would be an even larger nerf than what I just did, jtobiasm
[16:23] <Tydeus> yeah
[16:23] <Tydeus> it is
[16:23] <Tydeus> but if you only have like 3 wm
[16:23] <Tydeus> you still have a hell of a lot more than just 170 wpf
[16:23] <Tydeus> even 5 wm
[16:23] <Tydeus> err
[16:23] <Tydeus> 5 pd*
[16:23] <Tydeus> it would kill off those builds, essentially
[16:25] <Tydeus> atm no, but we're also not closing the book on the item reimbursements
[16:25] <Tydeus> you have to balance the builds before you can properly balance items
[16:25] <Tydeus> this was about balancing classes
[16:25] <Tydeus> so we have to start over -somewhat- on ranged item stats

UPD: oh wait...

[Panos_]

That still doesnt make it a nerf if they actually increased the damage. The stabs arent useless either, most people never expect them.

It counts as a nerf because pierce damage is better against armour, I`d take pierce over cut any day of the week.

I maybe wrong but I once read that 1 pierce equals to 3.5 cut damage, if that is correct then the poleaxe should receive at least +7 cut damage.

[Son Of Odin]

lel irc channel right now... Horse archers, archers and HX joining to cry a river of bloody tears


Sweet dreams are made of this

[Macropus]

It counts as a nerf because pierce damage is better against armour

No it counts as a buff because cut damage is better against low armour.

^
||

I like such arguments.

[vipere]

lel irc channel right now... Horse archers, archers and HX joining to cry a river of bloody tears


Sweet dreams are made of this

!!!!! IM COMING RIGHT NOW TO SEE THIS

[Sniger]

lel irc channel right now... Horse archers, archers and HX joining to cry a river of bloody tears


Sweet dreams are made of this

wut?  just played my archer, couldnt really feel difference

[FleetFox]

wut?  just played my archer, couldnt really feel difference

What build are you?

[Sniger]

currently 18-20

yeah, this one no agi whore. my main is 18-24 xbow havent tried that yet, but i dont really care how that is, its xbow... :p as for the archer and infantry, i believe in perfect balance. im going for 21-21

what seems to be the archer issue??

the patch rendered totally OP power-whore archer builds useless? OH NOES, LETS WHINE 

did you really think you would be able to go on like that forever?  obvious exploit 

[Son Of Odin]

MibbitUser1734 is Kulin (hybrid HX)

(click to show/hide)

3:52 PM <MibbitUser1734> to the community: i am sorry i played occasionaly with a build that was complete shit, but it was actually too OP
3:53 PM <jtobiasm> everyone on eu1 uses 18/24 or 18/27
3:53 PM <MibbitUser1734> i did not know it
3:53 PM <Son_Of_Odin> well now you know
3:53 PM <MibbitUser1734> i am glad balance is restored now
3:53 PM <Macropus> I mean that nerfing archers does effectively reduce their amount
3:53 PM <jtobiasm> yes
3:53 PM <Tydeus> MibbitUser1734> i am glad balance is restored now
3:53 PM <Tydeus> thank you for your understanding
3:53 PM <MibbitUser1734> it was increasingly hard to have some kind of variety in this mod
3:54 PM <jtobiasm> I'm more annoyed that you've done it in the middle of a 5v5 tourney -like wtf
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> cause you had to escape the boring, shallow melee gameplay oh no you didn't!
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> but now that is impossible
3:54 PM <karasu> a STF tourney
3:54 PM <jtobiasm> Can you not read?
3:54 PM <jtobiasm> 170 now is like 140 pre patch
3:54 PM <Macropus> "Boring, shallow melee gamplay"? Go away
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> i should respec to pure melee again and order a new mouse every week
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> cause you have to destroy the sucker just to kill someone in crpg
3:54 PM <karasu> LOL boring shallow melee gameplay
3:54 PM <karasu> wrong game mate
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> oh really?
3:55 PM <Macropus> You don't have to feint like Qoray to be good at melee
3:55 PM <karasu> I do understand that it affects games that already had place
3:55 PM <karasu> jtobiasm
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> i could block you indefinitely if i wanted
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> it is that easy
3:55 PM <Adre_W> 229 now is 140 pre patch
3:55 PM <Son_Of_Odin> only the best melee mechanics ever (yet)
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> sure
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> i will block you with a tiny hammer for 10 minutes
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> great fucking game
3:55 PM <Son_Of_Odin> nope
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> yep
3:55 PM <Son_Of_Odin> it's gotten faster
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> not for me
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> you can block forever if you want
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> it only favors qooray type of guys
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> feint spamming suckers
3:56 PM <Son_Of_Odin> well you would know if you ever came down from your high horse
3:56 PM <Tydeus> ^
3:56 PM <karasu> oh snap
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> i played foot melee more than your lancer cav ass
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> Son_Of_Odin:
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> this build i played only as of recently
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> for 30 levels
3:56 PM <Panos_the_Bear> SOMEONE IS MAD
3:56 PM <Panos_the_Bear> SOMEONE IS MAD
3:56 PM <Panos_the_Bear> SOMEONE IS MAD
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> well, for 1 level actually
3:56 PM <karasu> dense
3:57 PM <Macropus> MibbitUser, let's duel for 1 million gold
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> hahaha
3:57 PM <karasu> oh boy
3:57 PM <karasu> IT IS ON
3:57 PM <Son_Of_Odin> I somehow also remember you as a foot archer
3:57 PM <karasu>  PLACE YOUR BETS
3:57 PM <MibbitUser1734> yea, where i had NO HORSE
3:57 PM <MibbitUser1734> so your pun is useless
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> Kulin, for the last year you always play ranged
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> deal with it
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> and get
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> r
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> e
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> k
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> t
3:57 PM <Tydeus> looney toons axe says macropus wins
3:58 PM <Son_Of_Odin>
3:58 PM <Panos_the_Bear> yeah, I bet 2 lp`s at macropus aswell

tldr: my pun was useless and I don't play melee with my lancer/foot melee hybrid.

[Prinz_Karl]

He had to escape boring melee by changing class to HX hybrid and literally making the life of every melee player like hell? ...lol

I hope he GTXs this mod.

[Herezy92]

Heretics ! NO ONE is allowed to change stats on MY Bloody Poleaxe !
Heretics ! Burn all of you !

About my poleaxe stab : The damages could be extremely violent from time to time yes. But making a stab with the poleaxe is way more difficult than the 1h stab for example.
We often bounce and then get hit by an enemy swing (while being stun)
But whatever, i'll adapt.

MibbitUser1734 is Kulin (hybrid HX)

(click to show/hide)

3:52 PM <MibbitUser1734> to the community: i am sorry i played occasionaly with a build that was complete shit, but it was actually too OP
3:53 PM <jtobiasm> everyone on eu1 uses 18/24 or 18/27
3:53 PM <MibbitUser1734> i did not know it
3:53 PM <Son_Of_Odin> well now you know
3:53 PM <MibbitUser1734> i am glad balance is restored now
3:53 PM <Macropus> I mean that nerfing archers does effectively reduce their amount
3:53 PM <jtobiasm> yes
3:53 PM <Tydeus> MibbitUser1734> i am glad balance is restored now
3:53 PM <Tydeus> thank you for your understanding
3:53 PM <MibbitUser1734> it was increasingly hard to have some kind of variety in this mod
3:54 PM <jtobiasm> I'm more annoyed that you've done it in the middle of a 5v5 tourney -like wtf
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> cause you had to escape the boring, shallow melee gameplay oh no you didn't!
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> but now that is impossible
3:54 PM <karasu> a STF tourney
3:54 PM <jtobiasm> Can you not read?
3:54 PM <jtobiasm> 170 now is like 140 pre patch
3:54 PM <Macropus> "Boring, shallow melee gamplay"? Go away
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> i should respec to pure melee again and order a new mouse every week
3:54 PM <MibbitUser1734> cause you have to destroy the sucker just to kill someone in crpg
3:54 PM <karasu> LOL boring shallow melee gameplay
3:54 PM <karasu> wrong game mate
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> oh really?
3:55 PM <Macropus> You don't have to feint like Qoray to be good at melee
3:55 PM <karasu> I do understand that it affects games that already had place
3:55 PM <karasu> jtobiasm
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> i could block you indefinitely if i wanted
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> it is that easy
3:55 PM <Adre_W> 229 now is 140 pre patch
3:55 PM <Son_Of_Odin> only the best melee mechanics ever (yet)
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> sure
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> i will block you with a tiny hammer for 10 minutes
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> great fucking game
3:55 PM <Son_Of_Odin> nope
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> yep
3:55 PM <Son_Of_Odin> it's gotten faster
3:55 PM <MibbitUser1734> not for me
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> you can block forever if you want
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> it only favors qooray type of guys
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> feint spamming suckers
3:56 PM <Son_Of_Odin> well you would know if you ever came down from your high horse
3:56 PM <Tydeus> ^
3:56 PM <karasu> oh snap
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> i played foot melee more than your lancer cav ass
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> Son_Of_Odin:
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> this build i played only as of recently
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> for 30 levels
3:56 PM <Panos_the_Bear> SOMEONE IS MAD
3:56 PM <Panos_the_Bear> SOMEONE IS MAD
3:56 PM <Panos_the_Bear> SOMEONE IS MAD
3:56 PM <MibbitUser1734> well, for 1 level actually
3:56 PM <karasu> dense
3:57 PM <Macropus> MibbitUser, let's duel for 1 million gold
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> hahaha
3:57 PM <karasu> oh boy
3:57 PM <karasu> IT IS ON
3:57 PM <Son_Of_Odin> I somehow also remember you as a foot archer
3:57 PM <karasu>  PLACE YOUR BETS
3:57 PM <MibbitUser1734> yea, where i had NO HORSE
3:57 PM <MibbitUser1734> so your pun is useless
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> Kulin, for the last year you always play ranged
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> deal with it
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> and get
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> r
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> e
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> k
3:57 PM <Panos_the_Bear> t
3:57 PM <Tydeus> looney toons axe says macropus wins
3:58 PM <Son_Of_Odin>
3:58 PM <Panos_the_Bear> yeah, I bet 2 lp`s at macropus aswell

tldr: my pun was useless and I don't play melee with my lancer/foot melee hybrid.

Edit : this is pretty hilarious