Cav and long 1handers/nerf long 1 handers.

[Thomek]

Then you haven't seen much. Perhaps not the most extreme builds with loomed top end head armor, but with speedbonus and head hits (easiest to do from a horse..) these things do insane damage. Someone else calculate it.

I've are also effective in melee, the range takes a lot of players by surprise.

[Penitent]

i have yet to see an arabian cav sword 1 hit a tin can.

[Tibe]

Indeed, 1h cav lacks variety. The ACS is almost exclusively used by all players playing this class. 1h infantry has nice variety, you constantly see everybody wielding different blades. But the cav doesnt. Even the ones somewhat RPing Templars or whatever euroknight mainstreamshite, use it.

[Kafein]

Then you haven't seen much. Perhaps not the most extreme builds with loomed top end head armor, but with speedbonus and head hits (easiest to do from a horse..) these things do insane damage. Someone else calculate it.

A katana held swing on foot with the usual agi induced speed bonus is going to do only slightly less damage than an ACS held swing with typical cav speed bonus on a clean hit. If the ACS hits while bumping (which is just about always unless you catch someone afk which allows you to ride at the optimal distance without risk), the damage gets a huge malus on top of the reduced speed bonus (source : Paul in IRC a long time ago and that doesn't seem to have been changed). Hence the katana probably going to do more than a bumpslash, not counting bump damage. Do you feel you often oneshot stuff with katana held swings ?

I've are also effective in melee, the range takes a lot of players by surprise.

That's not an argument. Bad or underused weapons (which the ACS is, on foot) are always underestimated and therefore surprising.

[Jarlek]

Thomek brings up a good question though. Why is it the longest 1h swords that does the most cut damage?

Give all <100 length 1hs 34+ cut.

[MURDERTRON]

Then you haven't seen much. Perhaps not the most extreme builds with loomed top end head armor, but with speedbonus and head hits (easiest to do from a horse..) these things do insane damage. Someone else calculate it.

I've are also effective in melee, the range takes a lot of players by surprise.

So what you're saying is attacks to the head should do less damage and people should loom head armor more?

Thomek brings up a good question though. Why is it the longest 1h swords that does the most cut damage?

Give all <100 length 1hs 34+ cut.

According to tydeus, is a 1her is more expensive than another, it can be better in every regard.

[Tydeus]

According to tydeus, is a 1her is more expensive than another, it can be better in every regard.

That's putting it a bit too simple. It's true that due to the vast number of 1h weapons that we have, they're balanced slightly differently than other weapons.

[Thomek]

A katana held swing on foot with the usual agi induced speed bonus is going to do only slightly less damage than an ACS held swing with typical cav speed bonus on a clean hit. If the ACS hits while bumping (which is just about always unless you catch someone afk which allows you to ride at the optimal distance without risk), the damage gets a huge malus on top of the reduced speed bonus (source : Paul in IRC a long time ago and that doesn't seem to have been changed). Hence the katana probably going to do more than a bumpslash, not counting bump damage. Do you feel you often oneshot stuff with katana held swings ?

What katana has to do with anything. It's a short 2 handed weapon used with completely different risks and rewards than cav with an ACS.

Sure, if I could bumpslash people with my katana, I wouldn't mind a damage penalty..

Anyway, what all this boils down to is 1h cav doing vastly better than other classes, with less risk than other classes. I think going after the longest 1handers would be a way to deal with that. Perhaps not the best, but should be looked at, together with tweaking horse stats.

The longest weapons having the most cut is certainly a huge, and I think uneccesary advantage, to cav. I think they would still be used and preferred by cav players, even with lower cut. If they want more cut damage, they should use shorter weapons with less range, hence requiring more skill to use, and more risk taken.

[San]

If you reduce ACS cut, then there's the paramerion that was already just as good. You underestimate the utility of 1h stab on horse when needed for frontal clashes especially (and even lol bump stabs). With all of the possible damage multipliers, tweaking the weapon stats isn't really going to solve the problem with the class, which IMO is too much damage from bump slashes and swings without speed bonus / holds still doing too much damage.

If the cut for all of the longer 1h gets reduced, then people will just use 2h weapons + shield, since it would take a huge penalty to make 38-40 cut feel like it's under 30.

If they want more cut damage, they should use shorter weapons with less range, hence requiring more skill to use, and more risk taken.

What shorter weapon could ever possibly compete against the morningstar?

Sure, if I could bumpslash people with my katana, I wouldn't mind a damage penalty..

Do you mean you, or in general? Hate to burst your bubble...

[Kafein]

What katana has to do with anything. It's a short 2 handed weapon used with completely different risks and rewards than cav with an ACS.

Sure, if I could bumpslash people with my katana, I wouldn't mind a damage penalty..

I think you are exaggerating the damage that the ACS does in battle situations. Moreover, damage is much, much more critical for cav than for infantry. When you charge someone on horse, you only get to hit that guy once, you don't have a second chance if you miss or if your attack doesn't kill.

I think you should play cav yourself some more, that would perhaps make you reflect on your suggestions, particularly the nerf maneuver nonsense.

[En_Dotter]

Isn't this how all weapons are balanced? Long, heavier weapons hit harder, but are slower. Likely the issue is just in perception due to the fact that the range in stats on 1hers is much lower than other types. Non integer based speed and damage values would be nice, but that's limited by the module system, and therefore won't change.

You dont need real numbers to deal with the problem... You can still use integer and manage to get the same effect. Multiply stuff by 10 including hp? (could need new armor soak formula adjusted as well but the logic is there).

[bruce]

Honestly, I don't think the poliferation of armoured cavalry which you see on EU server was intended with the upkeep system. But it's too late to change something fundamental like that - but the amount of "second chances" you get either with a very maneuverable horse or an armoured one allows for cavalry to do what it does.

Then again, I liked the old crpg best, when you had, after reset, just some rounceys and palfreys riding around but, eg. lancing was normal and so on, HA skill was I think one in 12 agi which was rolled back later and slots didn't exist at the time.

[kono yaro!]

i have yet to see an arabian cav sword 1 hit a tin can.

it has happened to me once or twice when i had 78 head armor and 12 IF

[Soldier_of_God]

If you ask me, it should be 2hers that should be nerfed on horseback. i dont know about EU, but in NA you'll see dozens of people with longswords and morningstars 1 shotting everything, falling off their horse, and having no penalties. have you tried fighting on the ground with a spathion or a cav sword? unless you're a tank (like me), and you can absorb alot of damage, its worthless. its slow, and easy to dodge. anyone with a good italian sword or a 2h will kick your teeth in.
for the record, i fight with a spathion on foot and... well i often get outspammed, so i have to rely on brute strength. 24/12 helps, but a good spammy weapon spells the end for me.

[Smoothrich]

If you ask me, it should be 2hers that should be nerfed on horseback. i dont know about EU, but in NA you'll see dozens of people with longswords and morningstars 1 shotting everything, falling off their horse, and having no penalties. have you tried fighting on the ground with a spathion or a cav sword? unless you're a tank (like me), and you can absorb alot of damage, its worthless. its slow, and easy to dodge. anyone with a good italian sword or a 2h will kick your teeth in.
for the record, i fight with a spathion on foot and... well i often get outspammed, so i have to rely on brute strength. 24/12 helps, but a good spammy weapon spells the end for me.

Why don't you carry another weapon for backup when you are dismounted if you don't like your cav weapon. A cheap fast weapon to get you out of a tight spot.

Also your problems are because of your build/playstyle being kind of bad, not because of balance