Regarding the new gloves

[BlueKnight]

You're still saying the marketplace should be abolished, or at least modified until every trade is equal so no gain is possible, making the marketplace useless.  And you're still saying people who have invested time in the market and earned wealth fairly should have some of it taken.  How does any of this make sense or seem fair?   

You say it's not fair for them. Do you say it's fair that players earn twice+ as many lps on marketplace than in game? How much work did it cost really?

You're still saying the marketplace should be abolished, or at least modified until every trade is equal so no gain is possible, making the marketplace useless.

Marketplace isn't useless because it allows you to get the item that you want for your item or some sort of equivalent. You wouldn't need any equivalent from anyone if you could just respec your loompoints. therefore marketplace would be useless and wouldn't be a source of abusive, easy income.

[Smithy]

You'd be surprised.  However, anyone can do this.  It's completely fair, because its not restricted to certain people, the marketplace is available for literally everyone.  You're simply saying, since you don't use the marketplace for gain, no one else should be able to.  That's ridiculous, lol 

[BlueKnight]

You'd be surprised.  However, anyone can do this.  It's completely fair, because its not restricted to certain people, the marketplace is available for literally everyone.  You're simply saying, since you don't use the marketplace for gain, no one else should be able to.  That's ridiculous, lol 

I have given away 3MWs and 1 +1 item and gold once that I quit crpg. By clever use of marketplace [I mean selling 2lps+gold for 3 items (which is fair and ok if you keep reasonable offers)] and playing I managed to get now to the state that I have my own 14MWs (=value of 42 lps) while playing for 39 gens=39 lps value. I got what I wanted and I don't abuse the marketplace to get myself 40MWs just for sake of being rich. I used marketplace right. Didn't abuse it yet managed to earn something. I got 13 more lps value, not 60lps value like some others...

[Macropus]

I have given away 3MWs and 1 +1 item and gold once that I quit crpg. By clever use of marketplace [I mean selling 2lps+gold for 3 items (which is fair and ok if you keep reasonable offers)] and playing I managed to get now to the state that I have my own 14MWs (=value of 42 lps) while playing for 39 gens=39 lps value. I got what I wanted and I don't abuse the marketplace to get myself 40MWs just for sake of being rich. I used marketplace right. Didn't abuse it yet managed to earn something.

Now tell me please how can marketplace be "abusive" if both players have agree on each trade? Why do you think they do these trades if it's unfair?

[BlueKnight]

Now tell me please how can marketplace be "abusive" if both players have agree on each trade? Why do you think they do these trades if it's unfair?

So according to you, if and old and naive grandma buys some unnecessary piece of shit for her small pension it's ok because she decided to do it and she agreed to that trade? For example she bought a new holy statue or a holy poster or a new cleaning foam that is just as good as any other, just more expensive.

Yes, she agreed to buy it. It's all ok. The trader got his money for which he was working hard!

[Leshma]

chadz once said he likes the marketplace metagame.

[BlueKnight]

chadz once said he likes the marketplace metagame.

It totally makes me now love marketplace. Best winning point ever. chadz said something.

[Smithy]

Macropus beat me to it.  There is no such thing as "abusive" use of the marketplace.  There are shitty offers, but you don't have to accept them.  If someone offers 700k for say, a +3 Longsword and some guy actually gives his Longsword for 700k, it was his choice.  And people who trade up to 30 MW items spent the time and effort to do so, just as you did to get your 15 MW items.  I really don't see what you're arguing for, lol.

[BlueKnight]

Macropus beat me to it.  There is no such thing as "abusive" use of the marketplace.  There are shitty offers, but you don't have to accept them.  If someone offers 700k for say, a +3 Longsword and some guy actually gives his Longsword for 700k, it was his choice.  And people who trade up to 30 MW items spent the time and effort to do so, just as you did to get your 15 MW items.  I really don't see what you're arguing for, lol.

The difference is that if you don't take bad offers and don't try to rip off people you will earn something but it won't be 19 raw Masterworks just from fair trades. From my fair trades I got ~4MWs and I consider it ok when set with all of those that I earned by leveling. Can't you see any difference between 4:13 ratio and 19:7?

[Macropus]

So according to you, if and old and naive grandma buys some unnecessary piece of shit for her small pension it's ok because she decided to do it and she agreed to that trade?

Do you assume that new players that use marketplace don't even know how many loompoints it takes to make a MW item yet? So that they actually pay more than they would like to if they had more information? I don't really get how's your example even relevant.

For example she bought a new holy statue or a holy poster or a new cleaning foam that is just as good as any other, just more expensive.

And she succeeded, if what she bought is easily and quickly accessible, while to get cheaper one she'd have to wait much longer (and this is how things are in c-rpg marketplace).

[BlueKnight]

Do you assume that new players that use marketplace don't even know how many loompoints it takes to make a MW item yet? So that they actually pay more than they would like to if they had more information? I don't really get how's your example even relevant. And she succeeded, if what she bought is easily and quickly accessible, while to get cheaper one she'd have to wait much longer (and this is how things are in c-rpg marketplace).

I will just wait until someone earns his money on the naivety of your grandma when she buys some sort of "new" TV that she doesn't need and that is actually 3 times as expensive as in a shop. We will see if you find it ok then. She agreed after all.

[Macropus]

I will just wait until someone earns his money on the naivety of your grandma when she buys some sort of "new" TV that she doesn't need and that is actually 3 times as expensive as in a shop. We will see if you find it ok then. She agreed after all.

My grandma is dead. Think we better stick to the topic of the discussion (which atm seems to be marketplace, not gloves, lol), instead of giving irrelevant examples.
If I got it right, you say that the problem is that some traders make "unfair" offers which get accepted only by new people that don't know what is what in this game.
Now if that's the case, there is a "New market rule" to prevent scamming. Although, I don't see how a player who earned a loomed item already could possibly not know what it's worth of.
What seems much more realistic to me is that those offers get accepted by people who want that exact thing fast, so they are ready to add some gold for that, since the alternative would be making their own offer and waiting (perhaps for a week) till it gets accepted. I don't get how is that not obvious and not fair to you.

[BlueKnight]

My grandma is dead. Think we better stick to the topic of the discussion (which atm seems to be marketplace, not gloves, lol), instead of giving irrelevant examples.
If I got it right, you say that the problem is that some traders make "unfair" offers which get accepted only by new people that don't know what is what in this game.
Now if that's the case, there is a "New market rule" to prevent scamming. Although, I don't see how a player who earned a loomed item already could possibly not know what it's worth of.
What seems much more realistic to me is that those offers get accepted by people who want that exact thing fast, so they are ready to add some gold for that, since the alternative would be making their own offer and waiting (perhaps for a week) till it gets accepted. I don't get how is that not obvious and not fair to you.

It doesn't have to be a new player. It can be just a player who hasn't been following marketplace closely or never really uses it. He sees some offers, only 1 or two match his thing and he's rich enough to buy it so he buys it because he has no comparison and can't see other offers that are better for him so he thinks that this is the value of the thing and he overpays 70-100k. Also don't tell me that all of those are just impatient people that want things badly and can throw away 70-100k like it's nothing instead of waiting 2-6 days. If they give a fair offer the deal will be done quite quickly.

Thread railed again:
I don't think those gloves are any bigger issue than new armours and the upcoming new equipment, therefore if nothing is done about the other eq, we should just leave those gloves alone. Feel free to go through the retire cycle or work hard on the marketplace to get those.

[Macropus]

I give up arguing. 

[Smithy]

Yes instead of waiting however long, I used to frequently throw away gold to get the item I wanted, right then, when I was still retiring and constantly changing my build. There's nothing wrong with it, I got what I wanted, the trader got what he wanted.