Official Survey about item power

[mandible/splinteryourjaw]

1.) Buff Horses

Anything below a destrier is practically worthless, save the courser for its exceptional speed. anything above that is far to expensive, and slow as hell, which amounts to death in any battle server.

a.) reduce cost
b.) increase armor
c.) increase health.

choose one or do all three, any of the options would remedy the situation

2.) Buff 2h swords

quite simply, compared to sword and board and polearms, this weapon is weak. its slower and shorter than polearms, and with it you can only defend or attack; not both at the same time, unlike the shield users. what really makes the 2h weapon unique? nothing, thats what.

a.) add 3 speed to all weapons
b.) add 2 damage to all weapons
c.) reduce price by 15%

choose one or do all three, any of these options would make it better.

3.) Nerf polearms

polearms are a very touchy subject because there are many different types; they are very versatile. the concept of the 2h weapon is that one is better than 2. the concept of the polearms is the bigger the better. gamewise, this plays out as the 2h sword being outranged, outdamaged, and most of the time outspeeded. oh yeah, and if you get hit by it, you're stunned.

a.) remove stun animation, which sucks ass anyway, and is VERY disorienting.
b.) slow weapons down by 2 speed
c.) Nerf iron staff; its VERY OP at the moment, being able to one shot my palfrey with a STAB, and if that doesnt do it, its so fast they can swing again.

add

c.) lances can be swung left to right, heavy lance is 75 speed.
d.) add 3 pierce to all thrust attacks.

4.) Nerf Shield

As it stands, shields are VERY strong. TOO STRONG. a buckler can take a dozen arrows with its invisible ghost reach, and a huscarl shield is nigh destructible.

i propose that all shields be reduced by 100 points for high tier, 50 points for mid tier, and 25 points for low tier, OR that shield resistance be reduced drastically.

i say this as a sword and board fan, that also does 2h; SHIELDS ARE OP.

and that is why i voted those.

I won't make a friend here, but I disagree with the cav part of this post (the rest I haven't experienced enough to comment.)  Horses in this game are more like horse gods or transplants from the Matrix.  If a real horse turned the way these do it would break its leg (unless of course its been bred with Barry Sanders.)

My suggestion would be to make horses more expensive, make their up-keep more expensive, and when they die in battle that becomes another (large) added cost.  This would stop people from using horses as battering rams (especially in siege...get real,) throw-away transports to get inside castles faster (i.e. charge up the ramp and over the wall knowing the horse will die, but you escape the front door battle and are behind the siege lines,)  and generally using the horse as a double life (so what if my horse dies I'm still alive.)

Maybe even tying the horse's vitality into the rider's somehow...if this was done though the owner would need the option of "putting the horse to sleep" to avoid losing his/her own life points.  OK that may be a little silly, but something has to be done to make the rider concerned for the horse's health.  Maybe each time the horse dies the rider also gets a D in his K/D.

Not everybody should be able to own a horse, it was a nobleman's prize.  They never recklessly threw the life of the horse away.  They knew the cost.  If you think you are a knight, and rich enough to play with a total disregard to your horse's safety, then you should be willing to pay.  This could also help serve as a gold sink to help normalize and ecomony.

By the way an arrow or slash to the horse should cause it to immediatly rear, fall down, or just go crazy in general......not keep its cool and continue following the riders commands.  There shoud be a period of stun after the horse gets hit to give the rider time to regain control.

[Gurnisson]

Like this:
Elegant Poleaxe
weapon length: 132
speed rating: 92


And as darkfox said, one of the best 2h's out there danish:
Danish Greatsword
weapon length: 124
speed rating: 92

Same speed, yes. Still, Danish has 7 more cut, which is a lot. Also, Danish wins in length because of the grip on polearms (I thought people knew about the rangeloss by now):

(click to show/hide)

    1h
    Overhead = +0
    Left-to-right = +0
    Right-to-left = +19
    Thrust = +61

    2h
    Overhead = +15
    Left-to-right = +17
    Right-to-left = +13
    Thrust = +80

    2h Polearms
    Overhead = -15
    Left-to-right = -7
    Right-to-left = -2
    Thrust = +19

    1h Polearms
    Thrust = +50

Which gives:

Elegant:
    Overhead = 117
    Left-to-right = 125
    Right-to-left = 130
    Thrust = 151

Danish
    Overhead = 139
    Left-to-right = 141
    Right-to-left = 137
    Thrust = 204 (A bit less because of the animation change compared to native)

[Matey]

Well, I am a shielder with my main character. I decided to make a polearm/cav alt and a 2hander alt. with the polearm/cav alt i start doing fairly well around level 23 or so. with the 2h alt i started doing alright around level 10, i was even able to go into the duel server and win about 30% of the time (against average players). now that the 2 are higher level... i know i pose pretty much no threat to the top players in duel server when i use my poleax on my polearm alt who is level 29... yet with my level 27 2h alt i keep almost beating top players (if only my sword were mw i woulda done the 2-3 more damage needed to have won!)

anyways, basically... Polearms are great because of their versatility, they are excellent teamwork weapons that allow players to fill different roles but, 2handers are still the champions of melee. Which is fine, It's pretty close, a good 1h or polearm player can definetly beat a 2h on the battlefield where there are all sorts of other things going down, but the 2h is still the overall best 1v1 weapon, i dont think it needs nerfing, but it sure doesnt need buffing.

[Lech]

poleasxes have bonus against shields, you know

[Spa_geh_tea]

I voted to nerf all weapon damage of every class.

[Soldier_of_God]

oh my god... please ignore everything this man said. please.

1. cav already rapes lots of face... if you have trouble doing well with cav, you are doing it wrong.

2. 2h sword is the best wep class in the game for 1v1 fighting. polestun is all well and scary but go to a duel server and see what all the top duelists use... 2handers. mostly longswords. 2h is plenty strong as is.

3. pole stun... well i dont really care if its there or not. other than that... poles are good where they are. they have a ton of versatility but are best as teamwork/support weapons, whether poking from behind an ally or killing horses or breaking shields... they are not superior to 2h in 1v1 combat, though they hold their own.

as for your lance changes... no... lances do not need to swing left and right... its already pretty generous that you can even use them off horseback... theres a reason they are a cav only wep. p.s. they do plenty of damage as is.

4. shields are nerfed enough already. i got the benefits of my heirlooms cut in half after i reassigned 3 of my points into heirlooming a shield with the respec. i understand that you dont like shields that dont break in one hit, but deal with it. shields are an excellent teamwork piece of equipment, they cover against ranged weapons, and they allow the user to block multiple enemies at once. p.s. if you are upset that you cant break them fast enough, get an axe... shields are easy to counter unless you are a dedicated archer/xbow. polearms, 2h and 1h all have shield breaker weapons. the same logic leads people to using blunt/pierce weapons to hurt tin cans. you wont see me screaming that we should make all armour give 25% less armour and cost more; instead i bring a pick to the field as my back up weapon.

p.s. you are clearly NOT a sword and board fan.

1.) Horses are little more than *spay and prey vehicles which are only effective when the victim is unaware, or bent over for the lance. 90% of the time, most people see it coming, and have a 2h weapon, a spear, or something to that effect. if not, they are still capable of swinging their 1h sword at their horse.

*see below

2.) your argument is *inane. just because alot of people use 2h in duel, doesn't mean they are better, does it? its like saying that white people are better than black people because there is more. also, if you haven't noticed, most polearm users are at the top in duel, if they play.

* this is not incorrect spelling.

3.) they are indeed superior, as i use them against 2 handers. war spear, anyone? Bec? also, it makes no sense i cannot swing my lance left and right, as its illogical.

4.) i AM INDEED a shield user, and i hardly ever have my non heirloomed, heavy heater break, unless its against a axe user, and my argument is not that they take alot of abuse, creating a lot of turtles. archers i do this often with

p.s. it is clear that you are a rude prick, and you should learn to agree to disagree instead of opening your jowl spewing vile, ill-mannered rebuttals  designed to make me look like a fool. i don't appreciate your drivel, and i don't appreciate your nullifying behavior.

so next time, when you look at someone's honest opinion on a change, i recommend you follow these steps...

1.) read and intelligently, but temperately approach the subject. repeat if successful, or skip to two if not.
2.) if unable to follow 1.), turn computer chair away from desk
3.) promptly pull head out of ass, making sure that the head is clear from the said orifice.
4.) if head is still not out of ass at this point, go see a orthopedist and be sure that your spine is not permanently bent in a U shape from asshatery.

It is one thing to disagree, which im sure many will and have, with my opinion. its another to be a rude asshole about it, and i don't appreciate it in the least.

-1

[Spa_geh_tea]

Where are folks getting that polearms are longer than 2h.....the only ones that are consistently with ping lag included, the exception of the long voulge, can only thrust or overhead. Dont forget, 2h get a range increase on their swings and polearms get a range decrease.

[Matey]

1.) Horses are little more than *spay and prey vehicles which are only effective when the victim is unaware, or bent over for the lance. 90% of the time, most people see it coming, and have a 2h weapon, a spear, or something to that effect. if not, they are still capable of swinging their 1h sword at their horse.

*see below

2.) your argument is *inane. just because alot of people use 2h in duel, doesn't mean they are better, does it? its like saying that white people are better than black people because there is more. also, if you haven't noticed, most polearm users are at the top in duel, if they play.

* this is not incorrect spelling.

3.) they are indeed superior, as i use them against 2 handers. war spear, anyone? Bec? also, it makes no sense i cannot swing my lance left and right, as its illogical.

4.) i AM INDEED a shield user, and i hardly ever have my non heirloomed, heavy heater break, unless its against a axe user, and my argument is not that they take alot of abuse, creating a lot of turtles. archers i do this often with

p.s. it is clear that you are a rude prick, and you should learn to agree to disagree instead of opening your jowl spewing vile, ill-mannered rebuttals  designed to make me look like a fool. i don't appreciate your drivel, and i don't appreciate your nullifying behavior.

so next time, when you look at someone's honest opinion on a change, i recommend you follow these steps...

1.) read and intelligently, but temperately approach the subject. repeat if successful, or skip to two if not.
2.) if unable to follow 1.), turn computer chair away from desk
3.) promptly pull head out of ass, making sure that the head is clear from the said orifice.
4.) if head is still not out of ass at this point, go see a orthopedist and be sure that your spine is not permanently bent in a U shape from asshatery.

It is one thing to disagree, which im sure many will and have, with my opinion. its another to be a rude asshole about it, and i don't appreciate it in the least.

-1

1. horses are supposed to be opportunists. its their job to pick off people who dont see it coming. secondly, expert cav players can outrange any 2h and almost all polearms with a heavy lance by using it properly, the true champions of cav can out decimate fully aware pike users. Basically, cav is plenty strong.

2. I never said there are more 2h in duels than anything else, I said most of the top duelists use 2h. yes there are scary polearm users, and scary 1handers... but id say 80% of the top duelists are 2h.

3. polearms are very useful in battle as they can fulfill many rolls. i already said that. but i maintain that in a straight up 1v1 fight, 2handers are superior overall.

4. i never said you dont use shield, i said you are not a sword and board fan. no real sword and board fan would be asking to nerf shields. they already gimp your attack and movement speed quite a bit. shields have 3 advantages... they block ranged, they can block multiple directions at once, and they require less thought in regards to block direction. in exchange for those gains, you lose damage, and speed, oh and you have to use a 1h which generally means less reach and dont forget all the skill points you have to dump into shield, which usually means you have 36 attribute points (18-18 for example) compared to all the 2h and pole builds that can convert 6 more points to attributes (21-18 for example).

p.s. your post was significantly more offensive than mine. I was being slightly dickish, you were be completely dickish.

[Cheap_Shot]

its like saying that white people are better than black people because there is more.

Because we get to choose our skin colour at birth like people choose to play 2 handers? Crap, I must have missed the drop down menu that let me select it while I was in the womb.

[San]

I just want to have every main build viable, really, but not overcentralizing.

[Kenji]

May I say that it is likely the average player will vote to buff their most used playstyle and nerf their natural counter. I don't see how this will give you any accurate data, but welcome the chance to offer honest feedback nonetheless.

Not entirely true (In my case, anyways.)

I have an alt that uses steel shield, and I find it too powerful against anything except weapons that have bonus on shields.

Thus I voted to nerf the shields, while I find myself in favor of shielder characters best.

[Frell]

voting closes june 5th? what the hell

[Sharky]

Polearms doesn't need a nerf, they are indeed more versatile then 2h weapons, but on 1vs1 fight polearms tend to loose. 2h weapons might seems shorter, but as other said polearms are shorter then their stats suggest.
Also with 2h is easier to feint, they are more difficult to block and they are useful in closed spaces too, while most of polearms can't.

[Kafein]

Polearms doesn't need a nerf, they are indeed more versatile then 2h weapons, but on 1vs1 fight polearms tend to loose. 2h weapons might seems shorter, but as other said polearms are shorter then their stats suggest.
Also with 2h is easier to feint, they are more difficult to block and they are useful in closed spaces too, while most of polearms can't.

Polearms have the advantage of having a crapload of very good weapons. Fast, long, hard hitting blunt, knockdown (!!!) weapons that aren't unbalanced, many bonus vs shields axes without the unbalanced tag, yet being very long and fast.

Imo we need to fix the stun somehow. Maybe reducing the speed. And another good change would be making a completly separate weapon type for pikes, awlpikes, bills, halberds and lances (any polearm without side swings) vs other polearms. To separate those that really are polearms, which aren't OP at all, and the others with 4 attack directions which basicaly are disguised two handers and are a little OP atm, given the right build, but still.

[Rhaelys]

I find it amusing that once 2Hs were nerfed, polearms suddenly became ungodly overpowered, even though polearms as a whole have not seen any major buffs for many months now. I guess people were too busy complaining about being lolstabbed and lolslashed by everyone and their greatswords, and archers and their longswords.

Remember the Looney Toons Axe? Or the old Bec de Corbin? Or the poleaxes from when they were first introduced? Or the Long Hafted Spiked Mace a few months ago?

I switched over from 2Hs to polearms a few months ago. Although polearms have received no buffs during that time period (they have either been nerfed or seen no changes), my weapon has magically gone from unexceptional to SUPERGODPROHAXNERFNAO. I truly cannot offer an explanation for this.